On Accusations of Cheating

[PakRat]

I see it way too often. People get shot up or they think their opponent should have died with all the lead they put into them and somehow it is just not possible without the other guy cheating. So the radio lights up.

I would bet there really is the occasional cheat that gets past the server. However, this can't be happening nearly as often as the cries of cheating. Most often it is just that they met a pro that put a few bullets right into the canopy or it could also be the ever-present net lag.

But to go on the radio and claim cheating when there is little to no evidence is ludicrous. To then go on the radio and talk about all the cheating you "saw" as if you actually witnessed it then to reveal under questioning that you only read about it on the BBS is even worse.

Guys, get a grip and accept that there are better pilots and gunners than you and that occasionally your data might get lost through no fault of yours or anyone else's. To cry out and accuse people of cheating - people who have frequently been around, flying and winning, for way longer than you have - is just another form of whining. Only this form is worse. In this case you libel other players.

There are a few players who constantly accuse others of cheating. Who whine "no way" etc. It's far more likely these players just have a hard time accepting they are bad shots or their opponents are better.

If you see what you think is cheating, just document. Turn on the recorder and go test the other player as best you can. Notify HTC with time and player ID. But lay off the accusations unless you are damn sure you are correct.

It's sickening.

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Rape, pillage, then burn...

[This message has been edited by PakRat (edited 02-10-2001).]

[hblair]

Agreed! Give this man a cigar!  

[Tac]

Unfortunately, people aint psychic to know when they are going to meet the alleged "cheater".

Last night my squad saw 2 separate instances of extremely fishy occurances. Flakpanzers shooting goon and troops through the hangar wall (hangars up), which we of course didnt film, and later on a FW190 being turned into a completely wingless FIREBALL and it kept flying while a CHOG, 3 P-38's and I believe a Typhoon hit him repeatedly and the thing kept flying, circling over the field ack at low alt, getting hit by field ack as well.. and it kept turning, going vertical, shooting people down. We did manage to get that one on film.

Those germans not only make good cars it seems (Top Secret Pun heehe)

[Thunder]

PakRat is right on target! <S>

Let me first say I am an Older Pilot (52 yrs of age to be exact)I say this because most of the pilots I come up against are younger, quicker, more co-ordinated, have much better reflexes then I do.

I have to admit that there are many times I get jumped, or fall for a deceleration move. I think that a pilot turned back way to fast or caught me when extending.

First let me say,
I run my recorder on every flight!

When I am bested or really respect a manuver that a pilots displays I review it. I generaly find myself learning something new about my flying, my SA, or the game. Its 99% always a miss judgmentor error on MY part!!! In over 10 years of online air combat sims I can think of a few REAL situations that were REAL cheats that I witnesses.

 Pilots that expound on open chanels about CHEATING before they reveiw and logically think about what really happened probably fall into one of these catagories:

• they don't REALLY mean that the other pilot was "cheating" but they use this phrase to overcome there inability to deal with the fact.. they were beaten.
• A quick ego response to let the others in the community to let them know that "Big Bad So & So!" couldn't be killed unless it was a cheat! LOL (some do this .. the real result is there credibility gets eroded!)
  
• Someone who really thinks he/she saw something unfair. (to this pilot.. review the film and take it to HTC privately.. if it is real ...they WILL deal with it! GEROOOONTEEEED! )  
  

Usually there are valid reasons for the preceived experience. It does more harm to the flightsim community and ourselves when we accuse someone before first reveiwing and trying to honestly understand the facts.

AGAIN HATS OFF TO PACKRAT..... WELL SAID!

My oppinion,

Thunder

 

[fscott]

You would have to be very naive to think that someone could not cheat in AH. It is done in ** ALL ** online games. A while ago, two people, a p51 and a p47(?) I think, were dropping endless amounts of bombs on an enemy field. This was screenshotted by a few onlookers. That was an obvious cheat. However, if I were to cheat, I would make my .50's have the punch of a 20mm gun, Make my P51 climb 1000 feet per min better, add about 20mph to top speed, and increase the armour by 30%.

People are quick to accuse someone of cheating, but they are also quick to blame it on lost packets and the internet.

fscott

[RAM]

a very useful cheat would be to disable the G blackouts and redouts.

And it would be almost impossible to notice and/or prove.

[PakRat]

Fscott - I never said that it doesn't happen. And I remember the screenshots posted regarding the endless bombs and such. It certainly happens - but not nearly as often as those who claim cheating would lead the casual observer to believe.

The incident that prompted the initial post was one where a player was unable to believe that another could hit as well as he apparently could from a flakpanzer and he was all over the radio accusing the other player of cheating. The "cheating" player's identity was discovered apparently when he was finally killed and a number of other players spoke up to the defense of the "cheater" as it turns out he really is a good shot and is not regarded in any way as a cheater. The guy has a good name in the community.

Unfortunately there are those who constantly accuse others of cheating. Either the gods and the stars are lining up somehow so these people are the only ones who see the cheaters (I have yet to personally see anyone appear to cheat) or these people lay blame on others when the fault is in fact their own or due to their/the connection. These bleaters are falsely accusing others. That's what got me pissed off.

I'm just saying to excercise more care and restraint before labelling someone a cheater and if you see it and believe it is real, to document it and report it. I would guess that HTC would then point cheat detectors at that account to see. Detected cheaters are apparently banned for life as they should be.

I'm not naive by any means. I understand it happens. But it is also more than obvious we have a number of players who don't quite realize the seriousness of their actions when it comes to falsely accusing others.

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Rape, pillage, then burn...

[easymo]

 Cheating is in the eye of the beholder. See my cheat? thread in the gameplay section.

[hblair]

Email me that film Tac. I gotta see that!  

[Fishu]

...or the target is losing packets  

[Tac]

aye aye, my winger got the film, i'll ask him to send it to you.

I passed within d90 of that FW190 on a near-HO. Massive fireball with no wings doing loops. Talk about Foo Fighters!  

[milnko]

Somehow this pics seems appropriate for this thread  

 

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"ASSASSINS have BIGGER Joysticks!"

<< MILENKO >>
ACES HIGH ASSASSINS Website
WB/AH ASSASSINS Website

[Octavius]

I had that experience today actually!  

     I had just turned off my recorder and I wish I would have gotten this one on film.  I put no less than a few rounds into a P38 with my ShVaks and it burst into flames.  I assumed another pilot had damaged it in the furball and all it needed was my  few rounds.  A few seconds after I had disengaged the flames went away, its wings magically reappeared and it flew home to safety of field flak.  I never got another chance to take him down after I realized what had happened.

      I'm not sure who the pilot was, they never said anything.  But if someone has a program doing something to the packet transfer is a plain ol' cheater.  There really is nothing to gain from cheating either.  If a pilot cheated to get to a very high rank in the (badly configured) scoring system, they'll possibly get bragging rights or whatever, but there isn't any personal game in the real world at all.

Cheating is only cheating yourself.

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-=///Octavius\\\=-
VMF-323 "Death Rattlers"
MAG-33
(AKA Executor)
Maz203@aol.com

[This message has been edited by Octavius (edited 02-10-2001).]

[Beeking]

Well said, Pakrat. This is all what i wanted to write, but my poor english dont lemme do it.

Tonigh i was in a H2H, got a spit on my tail and worked hard to turn the table. Well, it was lagged but i did turn the table and shot the guy down.
Like u said, Pakrat, imediately he started talking about "crazy moves", "u warp to much for me" etc..etc..etc..  He and another guy intend to call me a cheater and the other guy said: thats cheating pirado.


Now, pls dont piss me off and dont ruin my fun. Go read about internet conection, lost pakets,etc... like pakrat said then come here to play and have some fun with clear game with less typing about cheating and more FUN and SKILL.

Have a nice day.

Pirado

[Nash]

I've only been accused of cheating by two people.

Towd and some newbie named Lotu.