Author Topic: Does the F8F have a place here? (Read 2487 times)

Widewing · « **Reply #60 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:07:11 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sikboy

I KNOW I shouldn't ask this question. I know this. But I never learn my lesson...

What is it about the engine installation that was copied? In general terms, what were the Patentable claims and disclosures? Please don't attack that phrase, I work in Intelectual Property, and I'm not sure how else to express what I'm after... What made the Installation of the FW190 unique to radial engines before it?

-Sikboy

Yeah, I'd sure like to know exactly what was copied from the Focke Wulf engine installation. I'm VERY familiar with the F8F installation, and it follows the the same general layout as the the F6F (different oil coller location) and F7F. Me thinks this is baloney.

My regards,

Widewing

cajun · « **Reply #61 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:15:29 PM »

If it didn't see combat in WW2, it doesn't belong in the game (at least that is my oppinion).

Well I guess you know what I'm gonna say "add biplanes"

But really think about it, of we can have latewar ME262, and planes that hardly even saw combat why not biplanes? There were at least 175 Aces that flew biplanes during WW2, such as "Pattle" (not sure on his rank) with 15 victories in his Gloster Gladiator, and some (I think he was russian guy can't remember his name) with 14 victories.

Even the "Hawker Fury" (wich even I think is a little too outdated for AH, at least untill we get allot more early mono&biplanes) shot down atleast 4 bf109's and a bf110 during the war!

Sorry to get off subject:), the f8f May have a place in AH, once ALL WW2 planes are added, then they might expand the game, but untill then they should be working on WW2 planes I think.

K West · « **Reply #62 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:18:16 PM »

Widewing beat me to it. The F8F cowling, engine installation and exhaust run are directly drawn from the F6F. Just look at the F6F and you can see for yourself how it's literally an exact match while comparing the FW setup to the and F8F (via cutaway drawings etc etc) is not. At all. The FW-190 and the Fury? Yes.

As for Bob Hall, well yes he test flew the FW-190 that was captured. But he was also the cheif engineer for the Gee Bee Z 1930's racing plane. He certainly had a lot of experience in putting huge engines on small airframes.

Westy

udet · « **Reply #63 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:40:04 PM »

i herad the f8f was modelled after a captured fw190

HeLLcAt · « **Reply #64 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:56:20 PM »

Why doesn't the F8F Bearcat have a place in AH? Any plane that served in WWII or was made FOR WWII should be in AH.

K West · « **Reply #65 on:** June 28, 2002, 12:57:16 PM »

"i herad the f8f was modelled after a captured fw190"

No? You don't say.

Westy

Red Tail 444 · « **Reply #66 on:** June 28, 2002, 01:04:02 PM »

I dont understand any of this...the bearcat looks like a pumped up F6, not a 190...what difference does it make?

Chit, the pony looks more like the cousin of a German plane than the bearcat. Either way, no need for the bearcat in here, if so, perk it at +200.

Paul

Sikboy · « **Reply #67 on:** June 28, 2002, 01:07:36 PM »

And I heard that the Zero was modeled on a pre-war Vaught design. But it wasn't. Well, unless you count the fact that both had one engine, two wings and were tail draggers. Serriously, I remember this story, it was crap, but I remember reading both the assertion and the refutation. Maybe it's like the "FW was neutered because of net lag issues." Something that seems so plausable, it becomes a "well known fact"

-Sikboy

cajun · « **Reply #68 on:** June 28, 2002, 01:16:43 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by HeLLcAt
Why doesn't the F8F Bearcat have a place in AH? Any plane that served in WWII or was made FOR WWII should be in AH.

The Bearcat NEVER even shot at an enemy plane in WW2.

K West · « **Reply #69 on:** June 28, 2002, 01:30:33 PM »

Neither did the C-47 we have

Westy

bigUC · « **Reply #70 on:** June 28, 2002, 01:31:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by HeLLcAt
Why doesn't the F8F Bearcat have a place in AH? Any plane that served in WWII or was made FOR WWII should be in AH.

That would make way for some interesting Luftwaffe fighters, and some highly unhistorical and surrealistic furballs. Maybe HTC should launch "Fantasy High" for all the "I want my late-war superplane"?

Karnak · « **Reply #71 on:** June 28, 2002, 06:48:39 PM »

No enemy ever shot at the Bearcat.

That should solve the C-47 problem.

ra · « **Reply #72 on:** June 28, 2002, 09:01:19 PM »

<<>>

Kurt Tank invented putting the engine up front enclosed by a cowl, driving a propellor which pulls the plane through the air. Jeeeeez.

ra

You think the fact that the FW-190 and the F8F both start with 'F' is a coincidence????? Get real.

PS: no, the F8F does not belong in AH, it never made it to the war.

cajun · « **Reply #73 on:** June 28, 2002, 09:19:51 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by K West
Neither did the C-47 we have

Westy

lol, Hmmm... I wonder why it never shot at an enemy plane

but (as Karnak said) It was shot at!

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #74 on:** June 29, 2002, 02:15:34 AM »

Probably because it's basically not true for the F8F. And even if it was it would be very hard for many to admit it much in the same way you cannot admit at all that Tank stole the 190 design from the 1930's Hughes racer.

Me? But stole is rediculous...... It was same relationship as FW190 to F8F.

Actually I know that, and have no trouble with it. Kurt Tank is said to have been very impressed by the H1.

I have no problem with that why do you think I would?

Heres a few more:

The Spitfire wing was copied from a Heinkel design, the lead spitfire wing designer admits this.

The Ju88 was designed with the help of US stressed skin metal aircraft experts.

Just about everyone copied the FW190 engine mount setup.

The USA copied the R4M, made into larger version "Mickey Mouse" used on 1950s US interceptors like F86D

EVERYONE copied the MG213 20mm/30mm 1200rpm revolver cannon. USA M39, French DEFA and British ADEN.

EVERYONE copied German swept wing research. Most notable successes were Boeing B47 and North American F86. Both were originally straight wing with much less performance.

What else.

So again why do you such a problem with the F8F being based on the FW190 concept? I mean the chief designer of Grumman and its chief test pilot (both Bob Hall, of prewar racing fame) went to England, test flew FW190, said its diddlying awesome then built a plane with nearly identical proportions, weight, size but with an R2800. There was no US Navy request for a light fighter. In fact they wanted bigger ones. The F8F was a Grumman idea based on their experience with FW190.

Please get over it! Its no big deal.