Author Topic: Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional  (Read 727 times)

Offline Sandman

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2002, 09:41:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
why don't we change it to "one nation , without god"??

would that make you happy?


How about simply "one nation?"

Would that make you happy?
sand

Offline easymo

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #31 on: June 26, 2002, 10:13:15 PM »
"Ummm... Didn't the Supreme Court already rule that schools cannot force students to recite the pledge of allegiance?"

This nitwit was unhappy because his child had to watch as others recited it.

Offline aknimitz

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #32 on: June 26, 2002, 10:13:46 PM »
The Delcaration of Independance likely will not be ruled unconstitutinal because it is an historical document. Children do not attend school of a morning and recite religous excerpts from the Declaration.

Here, we have children reciting the pledge of allegiance. In this pledge, the phrase "under god" appears. A phrase that was not originally included in the pledge, but was added in 1953.

Our currency has "In God We Trust" on it. Our Congress prays before each session. Our Supreme Court has scripture along the top of the walls. These are all viewed in a different light because the delicate and influential minds of children are not at stake. If we required our children, upon entered elementary school, to hold up a dollar or coin, and all recite "In God We Trust" - clearly there would be a problem.

I am not a religious person. And quite frankly, I think this is a bad decision. It goes just a little too far. However, Courts are starting to really crack down on historically religous events. Christmas is an excellent example. Nativity scenes, standing alone, have been found unconstitutional, by the Supreme Court. Christmas Music Programs with strictly Christian songs have been ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court. School prayer has been ruled uconstitutional. Prayer at graduation ceremonies ... the list is endless for religious events that have been ruled unconstitutional when they involve and incorporate the youth.

And yes this country was founded by religious people, but they were not christians ... nor were they catholics. [Referring to the signers of the Declaration of Indepence].  

Anyway, just a quick history of religion and what has and has not been permitted by the courts.

Nim

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #33 on: June 26, 2002, 10:18:44 PM »
Have the idiot judges shot at once! :D

Offline easymo

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #34 on: June 26, 2002, 10:19:59 PM »
If there is a difference between fanatical atheists, and religious fanatics. I fail to see it.

Offline Sandman

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #35 on: June 26, 2002, 10:24:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by easymo
"Ummm... Didn't the Supreme Court already rule that schools cannot force students to recite the pledge of allegiance?"

This nitwit was unhappy because his child had to watch as others recited it.


Been reading the 9th Court opinion... it says:

Quote
We recognize that the Supreme Court has occasionally commented in dicta that the presence of “one nation under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance is constitutional. See Allegheny, 492 U.S. at 602-03; Lynch, 465 U.S. at 676; id. at 693 (O’Connor, J., concurring); Abington Sch. Dist. v. Schempp, 374 U.S. 203, 303-04 (1963) (Brennan, J., concurring); id. at 306-08 (Goldberg, J., joined by Harlan, J., concurring); Engel, 370 U.S. at 435 n. 21. However, the Court has never been presented with the question directly, and has always clearly refrained from deciding it. Accordingly, it has never applied any of the three tests to the Act or to any school policy regarding the recitation of the Pledge. That task falls to us, although the final word, as always, remains with the Supreme Court.
sand

Offline Wingnut_0

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #36 on: June 27, 2002, 12:09:43 AM »
Loyalist hit the nail on the head.

Everytime some Christian starts raising cane about prayer in school around my house, and brings up the pledge I clearly point out that I and my child will not be raised to be forced to sit thru THEIR beliefs.  Oh but that's not what we're doing, God can mean whatever..yea freaking right....bullchit.

I say the same thing.  If I wanted you to recite something with Gods, Goddess, Allah, Jehovah, Brigid, Osiris, Hecate, No god, etc, you that support the "under God" bit would have a holy fit because it wasn't "christian".   You can't have it both ways.

I could care less if you worshipped Grapefruits.  That doesn't mean everyone should or does think Grapefruits are divine.

Offline Loyalist

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2002, 11:12:58 AM »
America isn't one nation under God anyways.  There are thousands and thousands of athiests.

Offline Nifty

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Federal appeals court rules pledge of allegance unconstitutional
« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2002, 11:24:24 AM »
don't forget us agnostics!  I want the Pledge to end this way to suit MY beliefs.

"one nation, MAYBE under some sort of divine influence and intervention, with liberty and justice for all."

as you see, under God definitely doesn't cut it for my beliefs.
proud member of the 332nd Flying Mongrels, noses in the wind since 1997.