Inaccurate bomb drops and the reason for it?

[fuzeman]

I like the new bombing method even though I'm still hunting for my 'technique'. I think one reason people are having difficulty is that you don't really know what your doing incorrectly and therefore can't get better at it.
Of course you have the basics like bay doors still closed, although that's harder to do now, but I think most errors are made 'Measure Speed' part when you hold the [Y] down.
Thinking about it, and I usually try to stay as far away from that as I possibly can, does this sound somewhat correct?
For clarification here, I chose my Y point ahead of my bomber and push the Jstick forward and then hold it steady. I also do a few 'practice holds' before I really hit the Y.
If when your holding Y down in Calibration mode, you drift the joystick slight away from the bomber and your Y point, would that 'measure' your speed slower and make your bombs drop short? Conversely if the drop was long, would that mean you drifted the Jstick towards the bomber and your Y point when 'measuring' and it calculated you were faster than you actually were?
If you measure right under your bomber, my drift directions above will not be correct.
I also think a longer Y hold would make the drop more accurate. Is the 2 seconds a minimum hold? I seemd to drop better on 5 second holds.
Oh yes, on the bay doors... it says and lists that last but they supposedly now do create some drag, should they be opened first?

fuzeman

[Flossy]

Originally posted by fuze
but I think most errors are made 'Measure Speed' part when you hold the [Y] down.

I personally think measuring the speed at a point directly below the plane will give a more accurate result, and I always try to hold it for at least 5 seconds, longer if possible.  During this time, the bomber will have travelled a good distance so that the speed and direction can be more accurately determined, and result in a more accurate bomb drop.

Oh yes, on the bay doors... it says and lists that last but they supposedly now do create some drag, should they be opened first?

Yes, I definitely think the bomb doors should be opened, as they will be when you come to drop and therefore any drag needs to be taken into account.

I'm not saying I have had perfect results, and I still need more practice to get consistent results, but I have succeeded in hitting targets occasionally when I have been careful with my calibration.  

[bozon]

your speed is measured by the angle difference betwin the angle of view at which you started (pressed Y) and the time you released the mark button. this gives the angular velocity, which is translated to ground speed. the bigger angle difference over time, the higher ground speed you are traveling.
how long you hold it pressed doesn't really matter as long as it is "long enough" for the calibration proces.

note that currently in the MA the wind is from W to E, so if you fly N, you have a strong drift to the right, so when holding the crosshair steady you have to push it left a bit.

I too was curious about this calibration procedure, and asked myself why is it done so, and how the Norden Bomb-sight worked.
I know nothing about it, nor found info about it, so I did some reverse engineering from how it works in AH.
you can find my explanation of it at the link below.
this is just my view of the thing. I don't know if it's correct, it's just a fun puzzle I tried to solve for my recriational needs

http://techst02.technion.ac.il/~snordon/bozon/norden/norden.htm

Bozon

[Innominate]

Originally posted by bozon
your speed is measured by the angle difference betwin the angle of view at which you started (pressed Y) and the time you released the mark button. this gives the angular velocity, which is translated to ground speed. the bigger angle difference over time, the higher ground speed you are traveling.
how long you hold it pressed doesn't really matter as long as it is "long enough" for the calibration proces.

If you're 10 feet off on a 20foot long run, you're going to have a huge error.  If you're 10 feet off over a 200foot run, that 10foot error becomes much smaller.  For precision drops(yes, it is possible)  10seconds+ is more or less required.

Most errors though, are caused by speed/altitude changes, where even a tiny change, too small to even see from the cockpit, can throw your bombs way off.  It can take as much at 10minutes for your speed to become completely stable, and the drag from your bomb doors if you open them too late, will be enough to throw you off.

[bozon]

If you're 10 feet off on a 20foot long run, you're going to have a huge error. If you're 10 feet off over a 200foot run, that 10foot error becomes much smaller

true.
the longer you hold the mark button, you get your speed averaged over a longer time span, and the errors decrease accordingly.

thx for the correction.
Bozon

[Duedel]

First: The new bombing system is great!

Second: Yes I have had succeful runs when i measure my speed directly under my plane (2-3 seconds holding the key work fine with me), I always open the doors before calibrating. When target is visible in sight u can correct ur direction with the stick without loosing accuracy.

[bozon]

I've found this method to practice calibration:

in the TA, or offline (change "AreanaFlagModes" to enable the accurate bombsight), you get a green + mark that points out the exact location of where the bombs will hit.

go through the calibration process, and look though the bombsight. if you've done it well, the green + will be at the center of your crosshair.

now watch it for a few seconds:
* if it moves forward (/backwards), it means your plane is accelerating (/decelerating).
* if it is just off-center, it means you didn't measure your speed correctly (wasn't steady enough).

with this method, I got best results for about 5 sec of marking. much longer than this and the result is worse.

also, you can estimate how long it takes the plane to reach steady speed (green + not moving), and the effect of opening bomb-bay-doors.

edit:
just read Anvil's post, it seems he got here 10 min before me with this method


Bozon

[Blindman]

I think last minute minor course corrections right before
bomb drops throw the bombs off.

like rockets, the bombs follow forward motion and not
the direction that the bomber is pointed, also alt and
speed change (alittle) when course is corrected

Need time to be at speed, straight and level over target

 hmm, sounds like actual ww2 bomb runs

[Ghosth]

From the testing I've done bomber calibration is closer if you

A Set Target alt first
B Calibrate vertically, ie don't push too far forward toward the horizon.
C pick a landmark, shoreline, shorebattery, VH, or some object to calibrate on.
D Zoom in ALL the way
E Hold button longer, actually I'll hold for up to 15 seconds if thats what it takes to get 4 seconds perfect.

Level bombers will never again drop a single bomb to kill a single ack. That kind of precision was extremely unhistoric. B17's were lucky to hit the right square mile from 25k. The current formations and dispersion are looking very good IMO.

Dive bombers were more accurate because they dropped at 1 or 2 thousand feet alt.