Best Attack Aircraft

[MJHerman]

I think I've seen the Wings episode as well, and it struck me as being a list of the aircraft "with the most impact on events".

If that's the case, I think a good argument could be made for the SBD and its role at Coral Sea, Midway, Santa Cruz and the Eastern Solomons.  Tally up its record to Fall of 1942, and I think you end up with the following, at a minimum:

Sunk:
CVL Shoho (Coral Sea)

CV Akagi
CV Kaga
CV Hiryu
CV Soryu
(all Midway)

CVL Ryuho (or Ryujo, can't remember)
(Santa Cruz or Eastern Solomons)

Damaged at one time or another:
CV Shokaku (Coral Sea, Santa Cruz, Eastern Solomons)
CV Zuikaku (Santa Cruz, Eastern Solomns)
CVL Zuiho (Eastern Solomons)

Etc., Etc., Etc.

Without the SBD, Port Moresby is taken in May, 42 by the Japanese, Midway probably never happens, and the entire Pacific War is changed, forcing U.S. to divert more resources to the PTO to protect U.S. West Coast.

Just a theory on my part

[Animal]

Originally posted by Masherbrum
Ammo, are you sure about only one casualty in the GA role?  (I'm not doubting you, I can't fathom it I guess! lol)  If that is the case then wow, is all I can say, wow.

MAsher

No, that is not true AFAIK.
In fact, I was watching a History Channel documentary exclusively about the P-47. Pretty gritty and obscure film documentary, not that crappy patriotic propaganda on Discovery.

A Jug pilot was telling the story of a pilot who got back in his jug from a ground attack mission. HIS WHOLE SQUAD WAS SHOT DOWN. He was the only survivor. When he got out of the plane, he pulled his .45 1911 out and emptied it on the plane's cockpit.

He was instituted on a mental hospital.

That whole squad were casualties, and this was not the only time it happened.
P-47 suffered heavy losses on the ground attack role.


The jug was a good bomber/attack plane,  but the most significant attack plane, in history, is the IL-2 Sturmovik. BY FAR...[/i]

[HoHun]

Hi Tony,

>Well. I wouldn't want to get too hung up on precise titles and definitions.

I just meant to point out that the planes were measured against a yardstick that was unknown throughout WW2 :-)

To get back on topic, I'm not so sure there was a large difference in the ability to withstand battle damage between the Il-2 and the Ju 87. The Il-2 featured wooden wings and a wooden tail, so while its crew was protected very well, the aircraft itself was more vulnerable to cannon fire than the all-metal Junkers. I'd speculate against small arms fire, the Il-2 probably won out, but if AAA was encountered, the Ju 87 had its advantages, too. (With the introduction of all-metal construction for the late-war Il-2, it certainly became superior, though.)

By the way, I've been looking for data on the Il-2's 23 mm VYa cannon in your book. You're only listing AP/I ammunition - was this the only round available (making the gun a specialized tank buster), or were there other rounds, too, and you only mentioned the most typical one?

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

[-ammo-]

I meant to illistrate the difference between a multi-crew AC such as an A20 or Mosquito versus a single crew AC like the P-47. A P-47 goes down, one casualty, the other you lose two or more.

[Animal]

Originally posted by -ammo-
I meant to illistrate the difference between a multi-crew AC such as an A20 or Mosquito versus a single crew AC like the P-47. A P-47 goes down, one casualty, the other you lose two or more.

It came out wrong, it seemed like you were saying only one guy died in a P-47 in ground attack missions during the war.

[F4UDOA]

In the Joint Fighter Conferance of 1944 the best fighter/bomber catogory was voted on by a very large group of Miltary and contractor pilots. The results were

1. F4U-1D <=== 32%

2. P-47D-30<== 19%

3. Mosquito<== 14%

4. F6F-5<====  12%

5. F7F <=====   11%

6. P-51D<====    7%

7. P-38L<====     5%


In the catagory of best strafer the P-47 was chosen #1 with 41% of the vote.

[-ammo-]

Originally posted by Animal


It came out wrong, it seemed like you were saying only one guy died in a P-47 in ground attack missions during the war.

ammo said
only one pilot is lost in the case of  a casualty

Your just stupid, but we all know that and take it into account..so no harm done.

[Tony Williams]

Originally posted by F4UDOA
In the Joint Fighter Conferance of 1944 the best fighter/bomber catogory was voted on by a very large group of Miltary and contractor pilots.  

Judging by the list, for "Joint" read "USA". The Mosquito is the only odd one out, and it didn't really compare with the others.

There is a natural tendency for people to favour the equipment from their own country, partly perhaps from nationalism, partly because they know it better.

Tony Williams
Military gun and ammunition website: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk
Discussion forum at: http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/

[Tony Williams]

Originally posted by HoHun
By the way, I've been looking for data on the Il-2's 23 mm VYa cannon in your book. You're only listing AP/I ammunition - was this the only round available (making the gun a specialized tank buster), or were there other rounds, too, and you only mentioned the most typical one?

There was an HEI weighing just under 200g which carried 16g HE and incendiary mix, and an HEI-T which carried 11g. These were used in both the VYa and the NS-23 (the NS-23 cartridge was just the 14.5x115 anti-tank round necked-up to take the VYa's shells).

The percentage HE weight in Soviet shells was relatively low. They obviously relied more on fragmentation damage than blast.

Tony Williams
Military gun and ammunition website: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk
Discussion forum at: http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/

[whgates3]

Originally posted by -ammo-


Your just stupid, but we all know that and take it into account..so no harm done.

you're         ¦¬þ

[Animal]

Originally posted by -ammo-


Your just stupid, but we all know that and take it into account..so no harm done.

*in a whiny voice*

Stop making me look stupid in front of the guys!

*runs away*