Aircraft Performance Data

[Skewer]

Hi all,

Is there any page that contains a plane by plane comparison of the aircraft contained in AH??  You know...things like speed, dive rate, climb rate, etc. ???

Thank you,

SkewerFT

[hblair]

Not that I know of, other than the data on the HTC website.

[Jekyll]

Check out the 'Aircraft' pages at http://www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm

I'm updating all the flight data for 1.02 at the moment.  Don't take any notice of the aircraft stats which are not '1.02 certified'  

BTW.. still looking for anyone who can assist with calculating turn rates/radii etc    I would prefer to calculate these correctly rather than rough-guess it using a stopwatch.

------------------
C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'

[funked]

Jekyll, cool pages!  Reminds me of Hoof's old WB pages.  

One nitpick - I noticed you listed speeds in knots.  All these planes read mph on the gauges.

Also I would have tested the Typhoon roll in a right roll, with the torque, to be consistent with the other planes.

 

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 04-24-2000).]

[daddog]

Very nice page! <S>
------------------------
daddog C.O.
332nd Flying Mongrels
 
Where men become friends and friends become brothers.

[Jekyll]

You're quite right on both counts funked.

I've updated all the pages to now read in MPH instead of knots, and the Typhoon roll data is now for a 360 degree roll to the right (instead of the left) to take into account engine torque.

Also just added 1.02 compliant data for the 109G-10 and F4U1-C.  If only the wife and kids would leave me alone for an hour or two I could finish updating the data for all the remaining aircraft  

BTW.. still looking for anyone who knows the equations for calculating turn rate and radius where the aircraft's airspeed and G-loading are known.  Shaw's book makes reference to these relationships, but he does not spell out the equations unfortunately (p. 390).  I would really prefer not to 'rough-estimate' turn rates and radii using a stopwatch.

------------------
C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'

[F4UDOA]

Jekyll,

Your web page is eggsalad. Err, excellent.
Anyway you have asked a very good question about rate and radius calculations. I would love to know how AH is doing the math. I am no Aerodynamic Engineer myself but I can share some information from a very good book that I use when I get confused (More often than I would like to admit). "The Illustrated guide to Aerodynamics" by H.C. "Skip" Smith.

For radius the calculation is.
R=radius V=velocity gravity=32.2
Tangent angle=TAN (The tangent of the bank angle of the A/C)
It looks like this
R=Vsquare/32.2TANof the bank angle

Rate of turn looks like this
Rate=1091TANof the bank angle/v

This is what the book says is correct. I am not sure of the Tangent for the angles so I cannot solve for these myself. I am looking up the trig tables so I should have these soon. However this will not tell you which is the best turning A/C at stall speed because these equations do not calculate stall. So if anyone knows a better way please let me know.

Also if someone at AH could fill me in on how airscrew efficiency gets calculated I would like to know.

Thanks F4UDOA

[funked]

WTG Jekyll.  

Here's your equations.  They are good only for level coordinated turns.

Variables:

V = True Airspeed (feet/second) <-- Multiply the TAS in mph by (5280/3600) to get this.

N = Load Factor (Gees) <-- Read from cockpit accelerometer

G = Gravitational Acceleration (32.2 feet/second/second)

R = Turn Radius (feet)

Omega = Turn Rate (degrees/second)

Equations:

R  = V^2 / [G* Sqrt(N^2 - 1)]

Omega = 360*V / (2*Pi*R)

[F4UDOA]

Funked,

Two questions for the mathmatically impaired.
What function does * represent? I think it is multiply but I'm not sure.

Also what value does Pi represent?
Does lift coefficient play any role in this?

Thanks again
F4uDOA

[funked]

F4UDOA:

* is multiplication, that's how it's represented in computer languages like C or Fortran.

Pi is 3.14 plus a bunch of digits.  The circumference of a circle is Pi times the diameter of the circle.

Lift coefficient isn't needed for these calculations, but it does effect how many gees you can pull at a given airspeed.

The only laws that effect these two equations are the fact that the airplane's lift (load factor) has to overcome gravity to keep the plane level and "centripetal force" to make the plane fly in a circle of a certain radius.  Because it is a coordinated level turn, knowing the rate and radius is the same as knowing the speed and load factor.

The equations you have for R and Rate are correct, although for your Radius equation V must be in feet per second, and for your Rate equation, V must be in knots.

My equations didn't have bank angle because of the good old pythagorean theorem, which let me eliminate the angle from the equations.

[Jekyll]

I started doing the turn rate and radii comparisons today, before I read your excellent messages funked.

Here's the method I've been using so far.
 
1.  Take the plane to 5000 feet, trim for 200mph.
2.  Increase speed until a max g horizontal pull will induce blackout.  Use this as corner velocity for the aircraft.
3.  Increase speed to corner velocity, bank 90 degrees left then pull a max g turn.  Hold the hardest turn possible as speed bleeds off.
4.  Time the resultant 360 degree turn.  Calculate the turn rate from this time.
5.  From the initial corner velocity and exit speed (the speed at which the turn finished) calculate the average speed through the turn.
6.  From the average speed, work out the turn radius.

Some of the results so far have been expected, others have been far from my initial expectations.  Check out the corner speed of the La-5FN!

Only 5 aircraft have their turn data completed as yet ... the Spitfire V and IX, P51, P38 and La5FN.

Much more work to do  

------------------
C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'

[funked]

Jekyll, Wells has a lot more experience in testing than I do, I'll ask him what he would advise.

[wells]

Radius will be constant so long as the turn is a maximum one below corner speed.  Rate will change though.  Use a sustained turn to measure radius, might be a tad more accurate.

[Beegerite]

I'll probably be court martialed for this but I had to make my own with an old DOS database which allows me to look at data nine ways from sunday, Here's an example which will probably lose it's formatting;
04/26/2000                   Tiger Squadron AH Wing                      8:01 pm
                                   Top Secret
                  AH Aircraft by Avg WEP Speed as Pct. of Best
                    MPH      MPH      MPH      MPH      MPH      MPH      MPH
                    WEP      WEP      WEP      WEP      WEP      WEP      WEP
   Aircraft         @ SL     @ 5K     @10K     @15K     @20K     @25K     @30K
---------------     ----     ----     ----     ----     ----     ----     ----
GE                   370      395      410      425      443      440      430
Messerschmitt
Bf109G-10
US North             368      387      407      408      421      436      420
American P-51D
Mustang
US Vought            360      375      390      410      419      400      388
F4U-1C Corsair
US Vought            360      375      390      410      419      400      388
F4U-1D Corsair
US Lockeed           344      358      375      387      405      416      405
P38-L Lightning
GE Focke-Wulf        350      360      365      387      400      385      358
FW190-A8
IT Macchi C-205      334      352      367      380      399      395      375
JP Kawanishi         338      358      358      368      370      352      328
N1K2-J Shiden
"George"
GB Supermarine       303      323      342      362      375      360      337
Spitfire 5 VC

[Jekyll]

 

Radius will be constant so long as the turn is a maximum one below corner speed. Rate will change though. Use a sustained turn to measure radius, might be a tad more accurate.

Yep, I've been thinking a bit about this Wells.  After all, there's NO WW2 fighter that could sustain corner speed on a 6g level pull through all 360 degrees of a turn.

But where the equations will help is in calculating rate and radius for instantaneous turn (up to about 90 degrees).  I can then also calculate sustained turn rate/radius from a constant airspeed and G loading.

Damn... even MORE work to do now  

------------------
C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'