Author Topic: Limiting the impact of suicide jabos (Read 814 times)

Soda · « **Reply #30 on:** September 08, 2002, 04:59:45 PM »

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There's no reason to suicide...unless you just wanna.

Somewhat true, suiciding doubles your sortie rate since you don't have to waste time flying back to base. That's a big thing since these people need to get in multiple sorties, quickly, in order to get the job done. The game promotes it, so it will happen. How to tell someone who is intentionally throwing away aircraft though is hard from someone who just doesn't know how to get the job done any other way.

-Soda
The Assassins.

Wotan · « **Reply #31 on:** September 08, 2002, 05:31:13 PM »

lets try to stay away from "blaming" or "labelling" folks. The fact is we cant make folks fly how we think they should. Be it inexperience or the desire to achieve their goal no matter the cost it happens, it will always happen.

I am not sure that any effort to limit its impact is worth the hassel, with the understanding no matter what "fix" is put in place to limit its impact people will still find a way to get around it.

fyi
Mrlars

the first "typh raid" I ever saw I counted 13 or 14 guys at the start and all augered but 3. Half the town was still up 1 fh was up and the base had 75% fuel and 6 of 8 ack still up.

The vh was ded and the bhs were ded. I was in the tower just laughing. A squaddie spawned on the runway and sat there and got 3 kills.

There were 4 or 5 typhs that wre intercepted and dofighting short of the field.

Thrawn · « **Reply #32 on:** September 08, 2002, 05:44:05 PM »

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Originally posted by Soda

Somewhat true, suiciding doubles your sortie rate since you don't have to waste time flying back to base. That's a big thing since these people need to get in multiple sorties, quickly, in order to get the job done. The game promotes it, so it will happen. How to tell someone who is intentionally throwing away aircraft though is hard from someone who just doesn't know how to get the job done any other way.

-Soda
The Assassins.

With muliple FH's it just not worth it for one guy to suicide bomb an airfield in my opinion. Even with just 3 FH's chance are that the first one will be back up, if not before, then very shortly after the third one goes down.

Now suiciding a CV is a diffent matter. Not only does it act as one FH/BH/VH, when it finally does go down it gets teleported up to hundred miles away.

Voss · « **Reply #33 on:** September 08, 2002, 05:59:09 PM »

Suicide against any imoveable target makes very little sense. While attacking a flak is suicide, sometimes it just has to be done.

Suicide in attacking a fleet, though, is ridiculous. The guys that do it often hold their bombs and/or rockets, until they can't pull off. Yet, it is really easy to hit a big ship like the cruiser, or the carrier. I know, because I do it regularly, and often I don't take a single hit (unless there's a manned 5" gunner that knows his weapon).

I have heard guys radio that their intention is to bail over the base after a succesful capture. I have never heard of anyone intentionally augering on their target. I have hit the ground myself, once pieces were knocked off, or because I took too long lining up. Still, 10 out of 13 guys sounds a bit high ratio.

Sever · « **Reply #34 on:** September 08, 2002, 06:09:18 PM »

Wasnt making a rebuttal Oedipus. Just asking a question so I can better understand where everyone is coming from. Being a relative newbie (2 months) i am still learning some things about gameplay.

By the way what does JABO stand for

Revvin · « **Reply #35 on:** September 08, 2002, 06:20:16 PM »

It's short for 'jagdbomber' the German term for a fighter-bomber aircraft but is generally adopted by most flightsimmers to describe any bomb carrying fighter aircraft.

Sever · « **Reply #36 on:** September 08, 2002, 06:35:20 PM »

Thank you Revvin

Karnak · « **Reply #37 on:** September 08, 2002, 06:55:18 PM »

Thrawn,

That's not quite true. I have seen a P-51 use the suicide Jabo method to stop a GV offensive. The GV offensive was being launched from a full fledged field, not one of the popcorn V Bases, and he was alone. Apparently he decided the best way to kill the VH was a couple of suicide runs with 1,000lbers in the P-51D.

I was flying a P-51B and was able to intercept him, along with a couple of other Rooks, after his first run. He missed the VH by about 500 yards on his first run.

A4c7i9d · « **Reply #38 on:** September 08, 2002, 08:33:43 PM »

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Originally posted by Oedipus
Sever, in that myopic rebuttal you conveniently left out the important piece. The part about how these "pile-its" don't even attempt to pull out or survive. To compensate for thier lack of skill and as proof of thier suckiness thier aim is to drive the bomb not ONTO the target, but INTO it. At the expense of thier virtual life and aircraft. THAT is what most people who talk about "suicide bombing" are refering to. And if you still don't get it then A4c7i9d can explain it better apparantly as he's accustomed to the practice.

Put a reload timer on ordinance. I think that would solve YOUR problem. No more bombs/rockets until 30 minutes after your plane hits the runway. I'll play whatever they give me as long as I enjoy it.

The best way to deliver large amounts of ordinance very quickly in a fighter is to drop, auger, and repeat. Often the most efficient way to do this is to ride the dang bombs into the target!

I use whatever tactic best suits the situation I'm in, and whichever one helps me have the most fun playing this game. The fact is that I: shoot chutes, climb to 30k, suicide bomb, and HO. I have no qualms about: Shooting bingo aircraft, damaged but flyable aircraft, aircraft attempting to land/ditch, aircraft taking off, augering with a whole flight of goons just to make the NME point and laugh, and if fragging was on would occasionally shoot my squaddies! <~~> :-) I'm sure I do alot of other dweeby things. If that makes me a bad pilot then all the better. I can have even more fun watching good pilots whine when a crappy one like me kills them. 8-D~~

lazs2 · « **Reply #39 on:** September 09, 2002, 08:45:16 AM »

wotan.. you may be on the right track so far as "perking" the bombs.. I say perk all the bombs on the bomber perk system. you get no perks if you get killed on a bomber mission.
lazs

Shiva · « **Reply #40 on:** September 09, 2002, 11:23:52 AM »

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you get no perks if you get killed on a bomber mission.

You should get no perks if you don't land your kills, regardless.

Voss · « **Reply #41 on:** September 09, 2002, 11:26:38 AM »

Time limiting the ordinance is an ignorant idea. How are you going to justify that to guys like me that like to egg gv's? No thanks.

Play the game. Quit whining. No matter the rule changes you make, someone will find a way to skirt around them.

AKDejaVu · « **Reply #42 on:** September 09, 2002, 11:37:12 AM »

Seems to me that there should not be a strategic advantage to dieing in this game. Things should be put in place to stress this, though not necessarily require it.

AKDejaVu

lazs2 · « **Reply #43 on:** September 09, 2002, 11:52:18 AM »

voss, I am simply saying that it would be fine to not allow people to load bombs unless they had bomber perk points. If they got killed on a bomber mission then they would lose bomber perk points. A jabo would be a bomber mission.

of course, the small bombs would have to be free.
lazs

beet1e · « **Reply #44 on:** September 09, 2002, 12:55:35 PM »

Lazs - How can you earn bomber perk points if you're not allowed to bomb in the first place until you have them? Please explain.

What I would suggest is to beef up the field guns, and have a mannable field gun in the towns. Right now, a swarm of Typhoons comes in, bombs the VH, bombs the mannable acks, and when a field reaches that stage it's pretty much Game Over. (Losing the VH is just a TILT) If we could keep the field guns for longer, we could deal with those hordes of vulchers that come in, with no intention of returning.

Or do what they did in WB: Triple points for actually landing your kills/target damage.