Stick Stirring—is it legit?

[MWHUN]

Well I was retired after AW went off-line until I was dragged out of retirement by my squadies… I logged onto AH a few months ago and unfortunately/fortunately got hooked.  Over the years I pretty much have seen every type of “move” out there—so I thought—as I ran up across some of the better sticks in AH I saw a move that I had never encountered before.  It was a crazy wobble move where they were just “flopping” around in front of me.

  I thought… “hmmm very interesting” so every time they did it I filmed it and then went off line to see if I could simulate the move.  I have a “floppy” move now in my arsenal—I’m not saying it’s the best one out there but it’s getting better.  BUT now I’m getting confused by some of the things I’m hearing on CH1 and on these boards… it appears some people think the move is dweebish, unfair, etc…  Remember… I learned it from some of the AH aces that have been acknowledged on these boards (for better or worse)

  But honestly it was the better sticks that introduced me to this move.  So my question--is this a valid “combat move” or a form of exploitation of the AH flight model?

[Kratzer]

Flopping around isn't necessarily stick stirring.

Stick stirring is making a whole bunch of tiny little stick moves very quickly, with the end result being lag that causes your plane to warp from where they think you are to where you are.  If that is what is happening, then yeah, you should probably knock it off, but if you are just jinking around to avoid getting killed, anyone who tells you there are rules against it is an idiot.

You will notice a lot of people trying to tell you how you can and cannot fly - don't listen to 'em.

[thrila]

Could pilots in ww2 make their planes do the warpy fish-floppy manouver? AFAIK know they couldn't.  It's just gaming the game, no skill involved at all- not a legit tactic IMO.  Usually catch a 190 doing this every so often.

[Wilbus]

Could pilots in ww2 make their planes do the warpy fish-floppy manouver? AFAIK know they couldn't. It's just gaming the game, no skill involved at all- not a legit tactic IMO. Usually catch a 190 doing this every so often.

Definatly agree, totally NOT legit, just gaming the game and show everybody how much you really suck since it's the only way you can survive (note, this does not go out to you MWHUN but to everybody who does it).

190's? Hell, I see more LA7's and Tiffies and spits do it then I see 190's. All planes do it, or rather, some pilots who fly certain planes. Stop it now before you get hooked.

[Curval]

When I was at the Con I was accused of the "worst stick stirring" one pilot had ever seen.  Ironically one of my squaddies was sitting next to me and watching the whole thing.  I wasn't stick stirring at all, merely barrell rolling and jinxing..we had a laugh about it and I thanked the accuser for the compliment.

[Wlfgng]

often the internet can not keep up with the speed of a rolling 190.  It can appear to do the 'floppy fish' maneuver, but this isn't the same as the one you described... I don't think.

[MWHUN]

Originally posted by Kratzer
Flopping around isn't necessarily stick stirring.

Stick stirring is making a whole bunch of tiny little stick moves very quickly, with the end result being lag that causes your plane to warp from where they think you are to where you are.  If that  

Okay I may be using incompatible word here to describe it—I thought a wobble was the same thing as what I heard referred to as stick stirring… my wobble is accomplished more by rudder control than by stick control…

[Sikboy]

In many cases "stick stirring" is a scapegoat used by people who don't know how they just got shot down.

I'm not saying that it doesn't exist, but I would wager that anyone who often uses a barrell roll to force an overshoot has probably been accused of stick stirring.

-Sik

[Kratzer]

Interesting that only two people seem to have actually read the original post.

The rest of you tards seem to just want an opportunity to piss and moan.

[AKSWulfe]

Stalling/spinning can also produce the same thing... it's not always stick stirring or moving the controls around too fast.
-SW

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by MWHUN
Well I was retired after AW went off-line until I was dragged out of retirement by my squadies… I logged onto AH a few months ago and unfortunately/fortunately got hooked.  Over the years I pretty much have seen every type of “move” out there—so I thought—as I ran up across some of the better sticks in AH I saw a move that I had never encountered before.  It was a crazy wobble move where they were just “flopping” around in front of me.

$10 says it was ManeTMP who was doing this to you.    He's king of flopping around in my book.

FWIW, this is not a very good move unless you're trying to cause enough of a delay that nearby friendlies clear the badguy off of your six.  Otherwise, it's just a matter of time before you buy it.  The secret to countering it?  Just hit the brakes and watch him flop right in front of your guns.  They never really expect that.

Is it a valid combat move?  I don't see why not, but it's also pretty dumb unless friendlies are around.  It's a massive E bleeder that's purely defensive with little possibility of turning the tables on smart opponents.  I prefer moves that are more likely to translate into guns solutions.

-- Todd/Leviathn

[gofaster]

I always thought it was just how the game displayed a stall.  If a plane is flopping around deliberately, then chances are its losing its E pretty quickly.

[Vermillion]

The floppy fish CAN be caused by over use of the rudder as much as stirring the stick, and is the same thing.

And no it is NOT a legitamate tactic.  It is quite simply a situation of taking advantage of the nature of lag/the internet, and the smoothing code in the game. Not to mention the near instantaneous control reversals that are possible with no stick forces and digital joysticks.  In real life this was simply not possible.

Todd, your counter is only good if your in a turnfighter with a nice low speed stall.  If your flying a BnZ plane the floppy fish is a very viable defense against you, as it will cause the attacker to repeatedly miss. And quite often even give the defender a chance at a reversal if the attacker gets impatient and overshoots at a slow speed.

If a person uses that kind of manuever, and gets called a "dweeb".... they shouldn't be upset, because thats what they are !

[Modas]

stick stirring, thats a good one.  If people think I'm gonna fly straight and level just cuz they are on my 6, their nuts.  I'm gonna kick the rudder, roll, dive, climb, etc etc etc, in as little space as i can.

The best compliment I ever got was..

"I'm out of ammo 205  

And he was back there LONG time throwing lead

Course I was out of fuel at that point or near it, so I couldn't go after him  People like to blame their crappy gunnery skills on stick stirring.  I know I do

[Curval]

Originally posted by Kratzer
Interesting that only two people seem to have actually read the original post.

The rest of you tards seem to just want an opportunity to piss and moan.

I hope I'm one of the two...because I read the thread...I just don't think there IS such a thing as stick stirring...let alone whether it is legit or not.