Author Topic: Questions Regarding the New Tiger... (Read 546 times)

Seagoon · « **on:** September 24, 2002, 04:15:24 PM »

Well, I've been chomping at the bit for some time for a Perk Vehicle, and now we finally have our Michael Wittmanmobile about to be delivered.

However, I do have some questions related to fears about the modeling...

Nowhere on the front, side or rear of this tank was the armor thin enough to be penetrated by a .50 calibre bullet (even .50 Cal AP) and even the top and belly had 26mms of armor. Now, I'm willing to deal with thrown tracks as a result of a strafing run from a P51, but I am not looking forward to dealing with a dead turret as a result of strafing with 12.7s or worse 7.9s.

Also, will we the new Tiger be vulnerable to the HE 37mm rounds fired by the Ostie? Personally I always thought it rediculous that the Ostie could destroy a Panzer IV with rounds that aren't designed to penetrate armor, but losing perks as a result of this will be a real pain.

Just wondering.

- SEAGOON

SpinDoc1 · « **Reply #1 on:** September 24, 2002, 04:21:14 PM »

I agree about your comment of the ostie killing everything. I haven't had a victory in a panzer for who knows how long, and it is all because those damn ostwinds keep destroying me. Good luck to HT reworking the damage model!

Jason

brady · « **Reply #2 on:** September 24, 2002, 06:26:44 PM »

What was explaned to me when I brought up a simmilar point on GV damage modeling with the 50 cal killing the Panzer IVH from the front which has 80mm hull and 50mm turet armor was this " the 50 cal rounds are not pentrating" they are killing the gun's rendering them unusable by damaging them, I asume the same is true for the osty, it is not pentrating but damaging the gun. This is what I was told, now If you can or anybody can explane this to me and my thick head on how this is haping I would realy appricate it.

Another issue is the MG tracking one which imo is well lets kepp this "G" rated. Now acording to what I have read this simply did not occure with any frequency espichaly on the heaver vhecials, yet it is commonplace in AH, imo this is a gameplay feature.

john9001 · « **Reply #3 on:** September 24, 2002, 06:39:26 PM »

the gun barrel does not have 80mm of hardened armor??

brady · « **Reply #4 on:** September 24, 2002, 06:57:44 PM »

john9001, good try~~...NEXT~~

Urchin · « **Reply #5 on:** September 24, 2002, 08:27:28 PM »

Here, I'll answer your questions.

1. Yes, .50 caliber and Hispano will still be able to kill the Tiger. How do I know this? Because they can kill the Panzer IV. I've raised a HUGE fuss over this several times, we've had ballistic charts posted that HT himself commented on which showed that the .50 caliber could indeed penetrate the top armor of a Pz IV, if fired from like 300 yards away at 0 degrees deflection. The Hispano actually had LESS armor pentrating ability than the .50. Which means that shortly after the Spitfire fires through your top armor, he becomes a smoking hole in the ground. Except he doesn't.

2. Yes, the Flakpansie will be able to kill the Tiger. See explanation above.

Amboss · « **Reply #6 on:** September 25, 2002, 01:27:55 AM »

In which case they might as well not add it because people won't spend perks on a so called heavy tank that can be taken out by peashooters.

-Amboss

Shane · « **Reply #7 on:** September 25, 2002, 01:47:42 AM »

tanks can shoot a helluva lot further than an osty can. an di'm sure the tiger will shoot hella far.

what's hard to grasp about "tactics? ?

yeah, yeha, osty's pull up close to spawn, yada yada... well how about "coordinated tactics" ?

personally i think the osty should have a small perk price, like say 3 perkies. simply because of it's affect on gv gameplay.

til then i'll use it when the situation warrants.

Amboss · « **Reply #8 on:** September 25, 2002, 09:32:15 AM »

What tactics? Driving 30 minutes countryside to get behind the spawnpoint camping ostie?

How about just fixing something that's obviously broken? An ostie can shoot all it wants with 37mm low velocity, soft projectiles against the sloped armor of a tank and it's not gonna do a whole lot except maybe at such close a range that the tank is gonna pump it full of 80mm AP rounds while blindfolded before it could statistically land a killing blow.

I am sure the Sherman Crews would cheer to heaven if they knew they could take out Tigers with calibers as low as .303...

Nothing short of a direct hit with a bomb or several hits of AP tank rounds should take out a Tiger tank, especially if it's gonna be perked.

-Amboss

Seagoon · « **Reply #9 on:** September 25, 2002, 11:59:49 AM »

Ok here is an act of blatant begging, a whine, a heartfelt plea against doing something I see coming.

PLEASE, O PLEASE, DON'T GIVE THE TIGER AN ICON SAYING "TIGER"!!!

Please give it an Icon saying PNZR and let the pilots identify the kind of Panzer via eyeballs. Giving the Tiger a gang-bang tag will make this exactly the kind of bomb and Ostie magnet that we fear it will become. Driving a ground based Spit 14 isn't going to be much fun, and with NO significant ground cover and a penchant for giving desert camouflage to vehicles that will be predominantly used on Green backgrounds these beasts are going to be easy to spot in any event.

Besides the Tiger was the Panzer VI anyway.

- SEAGOON

BTW - Amboss, just being nitpicky, the Panzer IV had a 75mm high velocity gun, not an 80mm. But I get your point.

HFMudd · « **Reply #10 on:** September 25, 2002, 12:25:53 PM »

Quote

the gun barrel does not have 80mm of hardened armor??

No it doesn't, but is it made of pretty good chunk of hardened steel all by itself. Further, since it is round it should count as having sloped armor.

My conjecture is that in AH any round that penetrates armor does some about of damage no matter what is underneith the armor. So, if the gun is not armored, then a 7.62 round will do some damage to it even though the 7.62 should have simply bounced off. Ping it with enough 7.62 and the damage accumulates till the gun is destroyed.

Amboss · « **Reply #11 on:** September 25, 2002, 01:20:23 PM »

Seagoon, I was thinking about the Tiger when I wrote that, but then that would be 88mm. In any case, I stand corrected

-Amboss

vorticon · « **Reply #12 on:** September 25, 2002, 01:29:58 PM »

why should a ostie be able to take out a panzer. ive shot the panzer with about 30 ap shots from my panzer and all i get is deflection. but with the ostie i shoot (same spoot) 5 shots and the panzer is dead. does something seem wrong there.

hopefully this cant happen with the tigert or it will be a total waste of nates time.

ne way getting rid of osties is easy

1 well dropped 500 pound bomb = one dead ostie

xHaMmeRx · « **Reply #13 on:** September 25, 2002, 06:57:09 PM »

I'll add one more question to the list:

Given that most GV missions can end at a friendly field only with an excessively long drive, is the perk penalty going to apply? If so, the Tiger will be used only for base defense since it won't be worth taking it to an enemy field.

My recommendation would be to allow it to ditch undamaged without losing perks.

HAMMER
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brady · « **Reply #14 on:** September 25, 2002, 08:11:43 PM »

Why not just remove Icons from GV's entierly.