Author Topic: K7AMA Mainboards SUCK!  (Read 612 times)

Offline eskimo2

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K7AMA Mainboards SUCK!
« on: October 12, 2002, 04:41:00 AM »
They are junk!

eskimo

Offline 6string

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« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2002, 07:12:50 PM »
Actually, after reading your descriptions of the problems you've been having, I'd be willing to bet that yes, your K7AMA does suck.
 
I've built a few Athlon systems and whatever problems I've encountered have always seemed to have come from the motherboard or the chipset rather than the processor itself. In particular the problems your are describing (dificulty installing a OS, general instability, errors in the registry every time you look) sound an awful lot like a problem with data corruption I encountered when I combined a 1.4gig Athlon with another ECS made motherboard, the K7S5A. While the board you have uses a different chipset than the K7S5A  (ALi vs. SiS), the problems I ecountered with the K7S5A were not present in any other manufacturer's versions of boards with that chipset.  It was ECS specific problem which came from a change to from the refence design which ECS made and which disapeared when ECS (in later revisions of the board) changed the resistors in question back. Now, as I mentioined earlier, your board has a different chipset than the one I used, so there's no guarantee it's the same problem, but I wouldn't put it past ECS to screw the same thing up twice.

One way to check for this problem is to download and run Memtest86 from http://www.memtest86.com  With the K7S5A the problem appeared in the form of a few thousand errors in parts 3 and 4 of this test.  Now it should be noted that this test is actually designed to test memory for errors, not motherboards. But if it is as it was in the case of the K7S5A and you can take the memory out of your computer, install it in another one, and run the test again without any errors, then the problem is probably the motherboard, not the memory. (ECS didn't agree with this logic and later bios versions for the K7S5A prevented the board from running Memtest properly).

One thing that you can try if the test does return errors when run on your computer but not when you run it in another machine withthe same memory, is to underclock your CPU from 133mhz FSB to 100mhz.  Becasue the K7AMA lacks the ability to run the CPU and the memory asychronously, when the CPU is underclocked, the RAM is as well. If you can run the test again at the lower speeds with fewer or no errors, you might want to consider reformating your hard drive and reinstalling everything (to get rid of any files that might have been corrupted durring the previous install).  You'll then be running your 1400mhz Athlon at a rather pokey but more stable 1040mhz.

To underclock your FSB speed you need to change the JP2A jumper.  This jumper is located in the lower right hand quarter of the board near the IDE connectors.  It is in a block of three sets of jumpers (with JP2B and 2C) and it's exact location can be found on page 13 of your motherboard's manual.  When pins 1 and 2 of this jumper are connected it is running at 133mhs, you will need to switch the connector over to pins 2 and 3 to get 100mhz.  One other thing to note, while checking on some other tech support boards I've noted that the most common problem people seem to be having with the K7AMA is the lack of the JP2A jumper. I have no idea why ECS would choose to remove this jumper, but if it is missing on your board, then you can pretty much just disreguard the previous few paragraphs.

While I'm on the topic of jumpers, the K7AMA can use either SDRAM or DDRAM. I'm not sure which kind you are using, but which ever it is, there are jumpers which need to be set for the board to work properly.  The J5-J14 jumpers tell the motherboard which kind of ram is being used and which slots to look for it. If these were set improperly, I rather doubt that the board would even post. The JP1 jumper, which is located directly above the memory slots, controls the voltage that the RAM is being run at. For SDRAM pins 1 and 2 should be bridged, for DDRAM pins 1 and 2 should be open.  The board might still work with the RAM at the wrong voltage, but it wouldn't be working very well.

In addition to these two things, I have checked a couple different boards (the most useful of which was the ECS board at http://www.ocworkbench.com you might want to post your problem there and see if they can be more helpful) and have put together a short list of suggestions that have been given for similar problems.

Powersupply- Your Antec 300 should be fine in this department, but whenever anyone mentions a stability problems, the first suggestion always seems to be "upgrade your powersupply". The only thing you need to check here is the sticker on the side of the powersupply. Look for a note about the Total Combined Output of the 3.3v and 5.0v lines. Any TCO over 180w should be sufficient (some would say 230w, just to be safe) and I'm sure your PS shoud have at least that.

Memory- Actually, after the motherboard this would be my most likely suspect.  The K7AMA bios doesn't seem to have any way of adjusting memory timings for extra speed or stabilty, so there's really nothing you can tweek there.  I also haven't read about any particular problems the ALi chipset has with any specific manufacturer's RAM.   I don't know who made your RAM, or even what the specs are on it so I can't say for certain, but it could be that while your RAM might not necessarily be bad, it might not be good enough.  The RAM you have might not be capable of running at the default timings (which cannot seem to be adjusted) at the speed your motherboard wants. This could definatly be the case if the problems you experience at a 133mhz FSB go away when you lower it to 100mhz.  The best way to check this is to get your hands on some other RAM (I'd borrow some from another one of your computers or a friends before I went out and bought more) and try that. Which ever kind you end up trying make sure that it is rated at least CAS 2.5 (3 is more common, but if the mobo's trying to run it at higher than that, and that can't be changed, CAS 3 RAM could produce errors) and PC133 for SDRAM or PC2100 or DDRAM and check that all the necessary jumpers are set properly.

Heat- The Athlon 1.4 puts out a lot of heat, and your cooling might not be up to the task. While I've seen Athlons running seemingly stable at 70 and even 80c (although I'd never recomend letting them get that high) I've also seen them flake out at just 50c. Another suggestion is that the motherboard's Northbridge might be overheating. The Northbridge is where the memory controlers are and if it gets to hot, data corruption could result. ECS likes to attach their North and Southbridge heatsinks with a substance whose color, texture and (I'm willling to bet) thermal conductivity resemble those of bubblegum. It is suggested that you could remove your motherboard's Northbridge heatsink, scrape off the pink stuff, and reapply it with a good aftermarket thermal adhesive like Artic Alumina Adhesive. It should be noted however, that this will void whatever warrently you still have on the motherboard.

BIOS- A newer bios version for your board might solve the problem, but I rather doubt it. The most recent BIOS is dated 8/12/02 and can be found at http://www.ecs.com.tw/download/k7ama.html  There is also has a link to where you can find the necessary flash utility and a pretty good list of instructions (with pictures) of how to use it.  Flashing a mobo BIOS isn't that hard or that risky if you do everything exactly right and your computer doesn't have any problems with stability or data corruption. Unfortunatly your computer does seem to have data corruption issues and most defianatly has stability problems. I'd recomend not trying to flash anything until you're certain these problems have been resolved.

In the end I had to resort to soldering a resistor on to the back of my board to get it working right at 133mhz FSB.  In your case, especially since I'm not sure that the resistor trick would work, if nothing else seems to help I'd suggest just getting a new motherboard, preferably one not made by ECS. This could be a problem however if you are on a tight budget, as ECS seems to make some of the cheepest boards around. But hey, you get what you pay for.

Long winded but hopefully helpfull,
6string

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2002, 08:55:35 PM »
6string,
WOW!

Your first post ever and already your my hero!

Thanks for all the info.  Unfortunately, my little retarded brain is about to explode after reading it all.  Ive been thinking the mobo and/or RAM are the most likely culprits at this point.  I know my power supply was fried, and I'm pretty sure my HDD was damaged, but still, things don't work like they should.  I'm ready to blow some bucks on a CPU, mobo & Ram.

I tried the memtest thing, but couldn't get it to run (seriously, I'm retarded.)

My ram is;
DDR 266
256 MB      on a single stick.

My power supply is; Total Combined Output of the 3.3v and 5.0v lines = 230W.

I'll look at the ECS board.

Again,
Thanks for all the help/advice.

eskimo

Offline Turbot

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K7AMA Mainboards SUCK!
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2002, 09:02:44 PM »
K7S5A  I have made three systems out of recently - so far so good.  I orginally got it because of all the good reviews.  I am starting to build more Pentium machines now though, the speed difference is huge now.

Offline Turbot

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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2002, 09:04:46 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eskimo2
6string,
WOW!

Your first post ever and already your my hero!

Thanks for all the info.  Unfortunately, my little retarded brain is about to explode after reading it all.  Ive been thinking the mobo and/or RAM are the most likely culprits at this point.  I know my power supply was fried, and I'm pretty sure my HDD was damaged, but still, things don't work like they should.  I'm ready to blow some bucks on a CPU, mobo & Ram.

I tried the memtest thing, but couldn't get it to run (seriously, I'm retarded.)

My ram is;
DDR 266
256 MB      on a single stick.

My power supply is; Total Combined Output of the 3.3v and 5.0v lines = 230W.

I'll look at the ECS board.

Again,
Thanks for all the help/advice.

eskimo



My power supply is; Total Combined Output of the 3.3v and 5.0v lines = 230W.   This is your problem that is a woefully (sp?) underspec power supply

Offline Rotorian

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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2002, 09:14:48 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Turbot



My power supply is; Total Combined Output of the 3.3v and 5.0v lines = 230W.   This is your problem that is a woefully (sp?) underspec power supply


I agree with the turbo man.  230W only and with a GF4 it WAY   underpowered

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2002, 09:29:22 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Rotorian


I agree with the turbo man.  230W only and with a GF4 it WAY   underpowered


Crap, really?

Its a Antec 300W.

230W was a responce to the +3.3V / -5V output.

Still bad?

could that be my problem?

The one I took out was a 250W VPower.

Thanks,

eskimo

Offline Rotorian

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« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2002, 09:44:55 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eskimo2


Crap, really?

Its a Antec 300W.

230W was a responce to the +3.3V / -5V output.

Still bad?


Ok, so it is an Antec 300w p/s?  If so, you should be ok, but you are cutting it close.
I have an Antec 350w P/S and it all works w/o a hitch.

We are back to probably being your mobo.

Offline 6string

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« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2002, 06:47:56 AM »
Yeah, I guess it was kind of a big post for my first time.  The really funny part is, that's probably more typing than I've done in over a year of actually playing Aces High.  Okay, so that's not that funny. Really rather sad actually...

Anyways, I wouldn't worry too much about not being able to get Memtest working. It seems a lot of people are having problems using the newest version, all they get are a lot of scrolling numbers. I'll have to download it and try it out again later tonight. The only real problem with not having Memtest working is that, if this is a data corruption issue, it's rather hard to tell if any changes you make help or fix the problem without reformating and reinstalling again and again.

As for the RAM, even generic DDR 266 should be capable of running at 133mhz FSB without any serious problems. That is, unless the default memory timings on the K7AMA are set to some outragously fast levels. But seeing as the timings can't be adjusted (although it seems that later bios revisions allow both for this and asynchronous CPU and memory clocks), and the K7AMA is more a budget than a performance board I kind of doubt that.  I was mostly worried that it might be a stick of DDR200 or PC1066 DDRAM.  It sounds ike your RAM is a generic brand or from a no name manufacturer.  And while no name RAM does tend to have a reputaion for causing all sorts of stability problems, the scope and severity of the problems you seem to be having make me think that I might be something a bit more than just cheap RAM.

Still if you were looking to replace the RAM, I'd advise going for a brand name.  RAM and powersupplies are the two things that can really cause headaches if you go cheap and generic. Corsair has has a reputaion for making very high quality RAM, but ECS does not appear on their list of tested and supported motherboard vendors. Mushkin also make very good RAM, and through their online store http://www.mushkin.com/cgi-bin/mushkin.storefront you can get a 256meg stick of PC2100 DDR (DDR266) that they guarantee to work with motherboards that have the ALi Magic-1 chipset like yours. Crucial (or Micron, same manufacturer, different brand names) makes also good RAM that might not overclock as well as the more expensive stuff but, at the speed it's meant for it should run just fine in most motherboards.  Crucial's online store http://www.crucial.com/store/listmfgr.asp?cat=RAM also allows you to enter your motherboard manufacturer and model and it gives lists of compatible RAM.

I also seem to remember you saying in one of these threads (but I'm too lazy to go and look for it now) that this particular motherboard and processor were hand-me-down parts. Did the RAM you have now come with them? Or do you know if the previous owner was using DDR or SDRAM? If he was using SDRAM some motherboard jumpers might need to be reset.  I'm also still rather worried about the JP1 jumper.  After doing a bit more digging on the message boards at http://www.amdmb.com I found more than a few references to people changing the setting of this jumper to help with stability problems which came from running more than one stick of DDR (they'd bridge the jumper to give the RAM more voltage). If you could check this jumper really quickly, it's just two small metal pins sticking up out of the motherboard right in between the top ends of the DRR and SDR sockets.  For one stick of DDR266 these pins should be seperate or not closed with a little plastic and copper connector. Oh, and I should have mentioned earlier, before you go and start touching things, always be sure to unplug your computer and let it sit for about 30 seconds or so and be sure to ground yourself on something metal. Static electricity is bad.

As for the power supply, the 230w on those two lines is very good for a 300w powersupply.  The 350w HEC that I'm using right now is actually only rated at 185w on the 3.3 and 5 lines.  As Rotarian noted, 300w PS are starting to be considered to be the very minimum for running a stable AMD machine, but that's mostly because there are a lot of really bad 300w's (digging around here I found an old Enlight 300w that was rated at 165w and a Deer that was only 160w TCO). That Antec is a very nice PS and should last you for a while.

I still think the problem is in the motherboard, and your best bet still be to just replace the it and hope that no permanent damage was done to your hard drive. If you wanted to though, you could pick up another name brand stick of DDR and try that. If it works, problem solved, if not, then you'll just have 512meg of RAM for your new motherboard.  Only problem being that your RAM would only be DDR266 and most of the new motherboards can use DRR333 (PC2700).  As for motherboard replacements, I actually can't help you much there. I ran out of relatives and friends to build systems for a year ago and the last few were Intel anyways.  The last AMD system I built was the K7S5A (which from what I've read has become a very stable motherboard after the 1.04 revision, but then again it only ever had problems with 1.4gig Athlons, it always ran the XP's just fine) and the ones before that were all KT133A's. Both of these are fairly outdated boards now, and I really don't have any experience with anything more recent. Perhaps someone else could give you more up to date info on motherboards on the Hardware & Software board.  Speaking of which, it would probably be best if we were to take this discussion over there anyways, lest we invoke the wrath of the board police with continued technical talk.

Still talkin' too much,
6string

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2002, 08:51:04 AM »
Once again 6string,

Thanks and Salute!

The memtest ran, I don't know what to do with the info, but I ran it while I slept for 8.3 hours.  It had 9.600,000 errors.  I have no Idea if that's Ok or bad.  Sounds bad to me, but then again I'm not sure how many functions a PC can do in an hour...

The JP1 jumper is open, like you said it should be.

The entire system was a hand me down from my brother in law.  About a year ago, he bought it in parts/package over the net and built it himself (I think he got it on Ebay).  He upgraded 3 months ago and mailed it to me because he saw how pathetic my old P-II 350 was.  That's really where this story began.  He's a smart guy and knows alot about computers.

Thanks again for your help,
I do think a new motherboard is in order.

eskimo

Offline Hussein

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« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2002, 11:12:32 AM »
LOL..

Your memtest had errors and you still wonder whats the cause of your trouble?

Either your motherboard is bad or your RAM is broken. Get another stick ASAP and test it. You're not supposed to get even 1 error in that test.

Offline 6string

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« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2002, 04:22:39 PM »
Sorry for taking so long to get back to this. I Was out of town for much of the three day weekend. But anyways, I have not so good news, and some bad news.

The not so good news involves 9.6 million Memtest errors, as Hussein noted, this is about 9.6 million too many. Without going into an overlong and uneccesary explanation of what Memtest tests (which I must admit I don't fully understand, but being a teacher I am trained in explaining things which I do not fully understand, that's why they call it a BS) that is just way too many errors, even for an 8+ hour run. The good part of this bad news (which is only good enough too warrant and upgrade from bad to not so good) is that now we have a tool to use to test any changes to the system to check for improvements in stability.  That is, if you still want to try and fix it, rather than just replace it.  That many errors suggests a serious enough problem that you could make improvements, and it still might be a long ways from being 100% stable.

You want the bad news now? Okay, I was wrong. About your powersupply that is. I was blinded by the old brand loyalty. Brief explanation time; the reason why the 3.3v and 5v total combined outputs are so important is because most motherboards use either one or the other for the memory, take juice from the 5v for the processor, and use the 3.3v for all the other motherboard circuits. Any shortage on these two rails is bound to cause stability problems. So the old rule was look to these two rails when you buy a PS, and look for at least 180w or 220w. Some of the cheaper powersupply makers used to try and fudge these numbers by alternating running one rail at maximum amperage (voltage x amperage to get watts) with the other at whatever was left over, then swithcnig them around, and then using the maximum values from each determine an inflated TCO. It should of occured to me right away when you said your 300w PS had 230w on just those two lines that Antec as doing the same thing now.  So where does this leave you? Well, I don't know. Theres no real way of telling what the actual TCO of your powersupply is without using a line tester. So it might be good enough, or it might be causing your problems. Upgrading to an even bigger PS might make the errors go away, or their might still be other problems.

Like your motherboard for instance. ECS gained quite a reputaion for using making motherboards that were very particular about what powersupplies were used with them.  Cheap voltage regulars on the motherboard might be enough to take a 300w powersupply that's boarderline and push it right over the edge.  Or it could still be your memory. It might be that your generic RAM doesn't have the tolerances to operate with the combination of a boarderline powersupply and a cheapo motherboard and that some higher quality RAM might. It could be that upgrading any one of these components might improve the situation. Or you might need to replace one specific one, or maybe all of them before you see any improvement. Real helpful, I know.

There are still a few more things that you could try to fix things without buying new stuff, but some of them would result in a loss of performance in an attempt to improve stabitlity, and one of them could actually cause irreperable damage to one or more components. I'll list that one last.  Also, I have noticed that the bulky blocks of text I use when trying to explain the steps to these possible "fixes" are almost enough to drive a reader crazy, or at the very least make him crosseyed. Out of old habit, I prefer to include bits of background and my rationale for the solutions in the descriptions.  It's clumsy and does tend to make it look more like a short story than a help quide. If you would prefer I could repost these in a simpler list form for easier, step by step use.

-Memory Timings

After redownloading and re-examining the K7AMA manual, I finaly found the memory timing adjustments in the BIOS (right where I was looking for them, I must be blind and stupid). Anyways, the least physically involved of the things you can try involves adjusting these settings. If your RAM is bad or just not good enough to run at defualt timings while possibly short of voltage then adjusting these timings could help. To get to these settings you need to get to the BIOS setup utility. I'm not sure if you know how to get here so;

Right after your computer starts up you should see a screen that says somethings about AMIBIOS, and probably has an EnergyStar logo in one corner. It also will have a bunch of other stuff writen all over the screen that probably doesn't make a lot of sense.  Somewhere on that screen it will say "press (del) to enter setup."  Press the Delete key  to enter setup.  I've also known a few monitors that take so long to get going that by the time you can see anything on the screen, this particular screen is long gone. If that seems to be the case with yours, just start tapping the Delete key right after you turn your computer on.  All Delete does here is take you to the startup utility, and one you get there it doesn't do anything, so hitting it a few extra times won't hurt anything.  Once you get to the setup utility, you should see a blue screen with a bunch of options listed. Use the arrow keys to select and highlight "Advanced Setup" and hit Enter. Once your in the Advanced Setup menu, use the arrow keys to move down to where is says "DRAM Time/Freq. by SPD", once you have this option highlighted, hit the Page Up or Page Down keys until the word next to it changes from "Enabled" to "Disabled".  This will allow us to customize the RAM's timings and frequency as we need to. Hit the down arow key again to select "DDR/SDR CAS Select"  I'm not sure what the defualt value of this will be, I don't acutally have the BIOS to work with, just an outdated manual.  It should say something like 2.5 or 2.5/3.  Use the Page Up or Page Down keys to chage this to 3 or any the highest combination of numbers you can get (like 2.5/3 if there is no 3 option). The lower the number here the faster the RAM tries to run, we want to try and slow things down by raising this number as far as we can.

Move down to the next option "Dram Performance" by using the arrow keys again and use the Page Up and Page Down keys to adjust this setting. The default here shoud be "Normal", there should be a number of other settings such as "Fast", "Turbo", "Ultra", or "Safe". Once again I don't have the acutal BIOS here to work with so I don't really know what the exact wording of the options will be.  Just notice that there is a progression between the settings from slowest to fastest and that it should wrap back around once you've gone through all the options.  Anyways, what we are looking for here is whatever is slower or below "Normal", usually this option is called "Safe" and usualy you get to it by hitting Page Down from "Normal".  It may have a different name however, or there may be more than one setting below "Normal". You'll need to find the slowest of them. You can just keep going down until it says something like "Ultra" or "Turbo" then you know it's looped back around and you've gone too far. If you can't find any settings that sound like they should be slower than "Normal" just set it back to "Normal" and move on.

Once you've done this make sure you have your Memtest disk in the floppy drive and press F10 to "Save & Exit." The computer should then reboot at the new, more conservative memory timings and try and run Memtest. There's no need to let it go for eight hours this time, just let it run for 15 minutes or so and check back. If there are still errors, you still have a problem. If there seem to be no errors, let it run for a bit longer, an hour or so. If there still aren't any then  you should be able to reformat, and reinstall everything. Once you do this, try and run Aces High or some other graphics intensive application.  You may have only improved your system to where it will run the bare minimums, stressing the system could still cause problems. Also reducing these settings will cause a perfomance hit, though not as severe as some of my upcoming suggestions. If you ever want to restore your the original memory timings, just go back into the BIOS setup and reset "DRAM Time/Freq. by SPD" to "Enable", this will override whatever other changes you made reguarding memory timings and frequency.  If your computer fails to boot back up after making these changes, then you need to clear the motherboard's CMOS which will force the motherboard to boot back up at all defualt settings. I'll describe how to clear the CMOS in detail a bit further down.  I'm not too worried about it here, ususally you only experience a problem when you set your memories timings too high, you were trying to slow them down.

-continued

Offline 6string

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« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2002, 04:23:24 PM »
-continued

To clear the CMOS you'll need to find jumper JP5. This one is located on the bottom edge of the motherboard (that is, if you condider the end when the processor goes to be the "top" and where the PCI slots are as the "bottom") towards the right hand side of center. It's near the SW1 header which is where the wires from power and reset buttons connect to the motherboard.  The bridge on JP5 should be set on pins 1 and 2 (out of 3) pull this bridge of and move it to pins 2 and 3. Leave it there for about 15 to 20 seconds, then pull it off and place it back on pins 1 and 2. This will erase any changes you've made in the BIOS settings and reset them all to default. Then, once you adjust the JP2A jumper as described in my first post and made sure that the JP5 jumper is set back to pins 1 and 2, plug the powersupply back in and start up the computer.  Afer you reset the CMOS, the computer shoud boot up and tell you that it needs you enter the BIOS setup screen and restore settings or something to that effect, just hit whatever key it prompts you to press (usually f1 or del) and enter the BIOS Setup Utility. Once there, you should be able to hit F6 for "Restore Optimal Values" and F10 to "Save & Exit".  Your clock will be all messed up, and your computer will spend time auto detecting all your drives with each reboot, but you can fix these problems later in the BIOS setup under "Standard CMOS Setup."


-Video Card

Another thing you could try is if you have another video card, either an older AGP card or a PCI card, try replacing your GF4 4200. I remember reading that you upgraded the videocard, HD and then the problems started up, even after a PS upgrade. If I had to put money on which one of those was pulling enough power that it was causing stability problems, I'd go with the Geforce. If you can replace the card, try running Memtest again.  If there are still a bunch of errors, then  there's a greater chance that it's actually a problem with the memory or motherboard, not just a volatage shortfall.  If the problems are gone, then a powersuply upgrade might very well help the problem, or it might not. Either way, just leaving in the older card could hardly be considered a "solution" to the problem. What's the point of having a 1.4gig Athlon teamed up with a gimpy video card?

-Underclocking

You could also try underclockinhg the computer.  Again this would result in a loss of perfomance, and really couldn't be considered much of a long term solution.  I described in my first post how to do this, but I'd like to add acouple of other steps to the process here. First you'd want to unplug the powersupply and let the computer sit for a few seconds, then make sure to ground yourself.  Then you'll want to clear the motherboard's CMOS.  This effectivly whipes out any changes made in the BIOS and makes the motherboard forget anything it ever new, like what speed the CPU used to run at.   Afer you reset the CMOS, the computer shoud boot up and tell you that it needs you enter the BIOS screen and restore settings or something to that effect, just hit whatever key it prompts you to press (usually f1 or del) and enter the BIOS setup utility.  Here the main thing you will want to change is to go to the "Advanced Settings" menu using the arrow keys and enter and (using the arrow keys and Page Up and Page Down) change the "1st Boot Device" and "2nd Boot Device" to read "Floppy" and "IDE-O" in that order. This way when your computer restarts it will check the floppy drive first and find your Memtest disk before it tries to boot off the hard drive. For a refresher in adjusting BIOS settings just see above under the memory timings adjustment fix.
Then hit f10 to save and exit and let Memtest run again. Once again you should only need to let it run for about 15 minutes to half an hour to see if you get any improvements.  If you don't get any errors, reformat, reinstall, and try and stress your system to see if you get any crashes or odd blue screens of death. Even if you can complete Memetest without errors, you could experience stability problems with other applications.  And even if this fixes your stabiltiy problems, it does so by effectly reducing your computer's speed by one third. It's not really a viable long term fix unless you really can't afford to replace whatever components are causing the instabilty.

-RAM voltage badness

The previous three fixes all involved attempts to increase stabilty at the expense of performance, this one involves trying to increase stabiltiy at the possible and expence of stability with added risk of the damage to one or more parts of your computer. Normally this is the kind of thing I would advise against trying, unless that is you were already planning on replacing everying and didn't really care if your old parts lived or died so to speak. There's a very good chance you could damage your memory, and possibly your motherboard and CPU as well.  You could also end up ruining your hard drive (if it is still good that is) and maybe even your video card.  Now it's not like your computer is going to burst into flames as soon as you hit the powerswitch. Any damage this "fix" does will probably happen gradually over time, so you might not even notice at first. In fact, there's a good chance your computer might not even start up after this fix, at least not until you un-"fix" it. The rarest chance of all, however, is that this "fix" will actully fix your data corruption problems.

It's common practice among overclockers to improve RAM stability by adding more voltage. Many motherboards allow for RAM voltage adjustment for this very reason. The downside of this is that it also adds more heat, sometimes a lot of heat, and heat can damage the RAM.  Just how much heat and how much possible damage depends on how much you up the voltage. When I was asking about the JP1 jumper earlier, this was what I was worried about. The K7AMA doesn't allow for small adjustments to RAM voltage to help with stability, but because it can use two differnet types of RAM it does have a jumper (JP1) which will adjust the voltage to suit the kind of RAM you have.  The only two settings with this jumper are 2.5v (open) and 3.3v (closed), and that's a fairly big jump.  I was worried at the time that the jumper might be set wrong and as a result your DDR was slowly cooking.  The damage this could have caused would have explained the instabilty and the bazillion Memtest errors. It also would have explained how a computer that seemed to be working fine at one time slowly became more and more unstable until it reached the point where it could no longer load an OS. It turns out the jumper was open and this wasn't the problem.

What I advising now (or more specifically advising against unless you want to try and cook your RAM) is to close the JP1 jumper and increase the voltage going to your DDRAM.  The current jumper setting means that the DDR should be getting the 2.5v that it needs to operate corretly, however, if your powersupply is less than adequate, or if the voltage regulators on your motherbord are cheap junk, then your RAM might not actually be recieveing it's required 2.5 volts. By setting the JP1 jumper to 3.3v then, even if ther is a voltage shortfall, what does get through should be enough for the RAM to work properly. It could also be too much.  

To close this jumper you will need a bridge like those found on just about every other jumper on the motherboard.  The board actually probably came with a spare bridge just for this purpose, but I don't know if it would have made it all the way to you.  You can't just take one of the bridges off from the other jumpers on the board, as those are all probaly needed where they are. But if you have any other, old motherboards lying around that you aren't using any more, you could swipe a bridge off from one of those. There are also anumber of other ways you could bridge the jumper, but most of those usually tend to be either inefficent or very permanent. What you might end up having to do is to take a bridge off from some other part of the motherboard (but remember where it came from so you can put it back later) and take it down to a place like RadioShack and tell them you need more of those, they should have something that will work.  

Once you get anther brigde, unplug the computer and wait a few seconds. Make sure you ground yourself and bridge the JP1 jumper.  Then plug the computer back in and fire it up. Try and run Memtest again and see if there are any improvements.  If there are, you might still want to consider replacing some parts anyways as this solution is not likely to extend the life expectancy of your computer. If it doesn't work, you'll probably want to remove the bridge on JP1. There's no sense in doing any more damage.  And if your computer doesn't boot up with JP1 closed you will definatly want to remove the bridge.  If it comes back up after removing the bridge then the motherboard probably has some sort of built insafty feature.  If it doesn't then congratulations, you've just given yourself the perfect excuse to buy new hardware.

Yeah, I'm still talkin',
6string

Offline fullback

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K7AMA Mainboards SUCK!
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2002, 05:52:29 PM »
What a selfish waste of other people's time by eskimo. Good-natured people have tried to help him for what seems like 3 or 4 years now... and it's always something new.

I think he's just a troll.

Take your machine into a shop and have someone fix it. :rolleyes:

Offline eskimo2

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K7AMA Mainboards SUCK!
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2002, 08:44:11 PM »
6string,
I think that you've worked harder on my system than I have!

I'm not surprised that you are a teacher.  You've been very generous and willing to share your knowledge with a stranger, thanks once again, and Salute!
I'm an elementary school teacher.  What subject/grade do you teach? (English I bet! :)  What kind of school?  Where?

I just ordered a stick of Crucial Ram; 512 DDR, 2100 something?  It was $127 from Crucial, and I figure I can use it no matter what I end up doing.  I should have it in a few days, others have said that they ship fast.  Once I get it I'll quickly find out if my problems are beyond bad ram.

The old power supply on this system was a VPower 250.  The system ran fine when I got it, and even for a week or two after I put in the GeForce video board.  When things started going wrong, I was getting CTDs every few hours, and an occasional instant reboot once or twice a day.    CTDs and re-boots became more and more common over the next week or two.  When I finally replaced the power supply, I think that it had damaged the HDD (just my uneducated guess, I've heard that an improper shut down can damage a HDD).  Perhaps it gave the motherboard or Ram a bad jolt too.   I'm hoping that it's the Ram, because I already bought it and it's the easiest part to replace.

Thanks again 6string!

eskimo