Author Topic: Fighter kill stats from Burma:  (Read 2333 times)

Offline Dead Man Flying

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Fighter kill stats from Burma:
« Reply #45 on: February 18, 2003, 09:12:13 PM »
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Originally posted by Widewing
I accomplished my purpose anyway. The Hurri got away, and you went kaboom :D
[/B]

Nope, the Hurricane I was on died messily.  Sticks was a latecomer to the fight (he was right behind you as you came in).  So you failed to save the Hurricane and died doing so.  That changes the complexion of the mission a little bit.  :)

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Indeed, if it weren’t for the strange damage model of the Zero, we wouldn’t even be having this discussion. But sometimes, those damn things won't die.... :mad:
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I've seriously never had any problems bringing down A6M2s, though I find cannon-equipped planes have a far easier time of it.  In your case, the best thing to have done would have been to disengage after your initial pass, because it was just a matter of time at that point.  I was already critically low on fuel as was.

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Call it your good luck or my bad luck, but either way; I would do it the same way next time.
[/B]

I wouldn't have changed a thing.  At the time you and sticks came into the fight, I was getting low on ammo and fuel.  I wanted to finish off the last plane from the high alt engagement, so I made a game out of seeing if I could get him before the latecomers got me.  It's not that I didn't know you were there, but I was trying to survive long enough to finish my primary job.  :)  I could have stayed high and engaged you and the sticks with alt, but where's the fun in that?

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Of course, everyone should realize that from now on any poor guy flying an SBD anywhere near Lev is gonna get his full attention :D
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hehe Nah, I had my hands full enough as it was.  I don't really consider SBDs a threat unless they're in a crowd... at which point I consider any plane a threat, especially one sporting .50 caliber guns.

Anyway, it seems like I will need someone to host the film after all.  Do you have an e-mail address where I can send the film?

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Fighter kill stats from Burma:
« Reply #46 on: February 18, 2003, 09:18:48 PM »
Send me the film please

pirci@bayarea.net

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #47 on: February 18, 2003, 10:22:54 PM »

Offline ergRTC

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Fighter kill stats from Burma:
« Reply #48 on: February 18, 2003, 10:35:27 PM »
wow, I saw the film.


nice flying dead man flying.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #49 on: February 18, 2003, 11:23:15 PM »
Looks to me that widewing made a mistake in turning after his last pass - BS it may be but we all know how long zeros can fight even on fire.

I do think the Zero is too resitant to fire damage - however I do not think its full flight performance advanatages over F4F4 are fully present in AH. Even US tests showed zero was as fast on deck and starting at 1000ft faster at all alts - not the case in AH at low alts in any strech of the imagination. This gives the F4F4 an added advantage it never had - being able to disengage at will at any altitude. In real life they could only dive away but in AH an F4F4 can simply run away even on the deck. I also think the loe speed manuverability advantage of zero is negligent over a light F4F4 - the wording of the USA test made it clear there was no need to even consider this aspect as the zero had a profound superirity. Roll rate on zero is very sluggish at any speed - this does not match the reports about finger light instant control response at low speed by Saburo Sakai who knew a thing or two about zeros. I feel these discrepencies give the F4?F4 a much greater 1v1 dogfight capability vs zero than what matches the hitorical record - the F4F4 defeated zero by teamwork and slahing diving attacks from a superior altitide position not by individual manouver as is now possible in AH.

Offline brady

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« Reply #50 on: February 18, 2003, 11:33:02 PM »
GRUNHERZ, I just quoted you and put it in that thread in Aircraft and Vehicals. I hope that is ok.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #51 on: February 19, 2003, 02:23:30 AM »
My lawyers will contact you shortly....  :D

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #52 on: February 19, 2003, 09:12:38 AM »
DMF... I been there..  My name was mentioned once as being a victim of superior skill... the guy let two other countrymen die before i lost enough energy for him to attack me.  wish I had film tho... that was .... precious.  
lazs

Offline ergRTC

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« Reply #53 on: February 19, 2003, 10:11:58 AM »
Really grunherz?  I have not noticed a speed advantage over 3k.  Remember neither of these planes has wep.

Offline Dead Man Flying

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« Reply #54 on: February 19, 2003, 11:31:59 AM »
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Originally posted by ergRTC
nice flying dead man flying.


Thanks, ergRTC.  I'm glad you enjoyed watching it.  I know I enjoyed making it.  :)

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Slash27

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« Reply #55 on: February 19, 2003, 05:10:33 PM »
Just saw the film myself.  That was good stuff. Your gunnery is awsome. <>

No longer impressed with Widewings SBD:D   j/k

Offline Matre

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Zeros in Burma
« Reply #56 on: February 21, 2003, 01:47:34 AM »
Saw that some people said zeros were not in Burma.  I thought this was true too until i saw a special on the flying tigers the other night.  so i looked it up.  turns out Claire Chennault and his tigers were the first to go up against the a6m2.  this being the case, Chennault was instrumental in warning his superiors of the flight characteristics of the zeke.  just thought id throw in my two cents. all.                                                                                                            
Matre

Offline Widewing

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Re: Zeros in Burma
« Reply #57 on: February 21, 2003, 07:30:09 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Matre
Saw that some people said zeros were not in Burma.  I thought this was true too until i saw a special on the flying tigers the other night.  so i looked it up.  turns out Claire Chennault and his tigers were the first to go up against the a6m2.  this being the case, Chennault was instrumental in warning his superiors of the flight characteristics of the zeke.  just thought id throw in my two cents. all.                                                                                                            
Matre


Your source is incorrect. Only 15 A6M of early production were sent to the China theater in 1940, long before the AVG was formed. These aircraft were withdrawn after a brief combat trial. One of three lost was recovered by the Chinese. This one was inspected by Chennault at the time, leading to his "white paper" which was sent to the USAAC, and basically ignored.

The AVG NEVER faced the A6M in combat, there were no IJNAF fighter units deployed to the theater during the brief tenure of the AVG, operational from December 7, 1941 thru July 4, 1942.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Matre

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Sources
« Reply #58 on: February 21, 2003, 02:18:22 PM »
my sources may well be incorrect, however i find it hard to believe that 4 books and 2 movie documentarys are wrong.  never meant to start an argument.  just wanted to share the results of my research.  thanks for taking the time to respond.

Matre

Offline Oldman731

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Re: Sources
« Reply #59 on: February 21, 2003, 02:22:51 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Matre
my sources may well be incorrect, however i find it hard to believe that 4 books and 2 movie documentarys are wrong.  never meant to start an argument.  just wanted to share the results of my research.  thanks for taking the time to respond.

Heh heh.  Believe it.

- oldman