Author Topic: Murder/Crime Rates, US/ UK (Read 743 times)

NUKE · « **Reply #15 on:** November 17, 2002, 09:44:12 PM »

Gatso, show me the stats and give a link.

And, attempted murders are not murders.... you in there? "knock knock..." An attemped murder means nobody died...get it?

Number of cases know to police is the number of murders.

So, using what is know as a brain and the listed stats:

UK England, Wales Population 52,010,160 murders 1428 = 2.75 per 100,000

Scotland Population 5,112,00, murders 730 = 14.26

same goes for NI stats.

I guess you dont understand how to read the stats on the site

gatso · « **Reply #16 on:** November 17, 2002, 09:53:48 PM »

Quote

And, attempted murders are not murders.... you in there "knock knock" An attemped murder means nobody died...get it?

Yes I do. Evidently you do not.

Using the Scotland doc as an example. First column shows - 'Number of cases known to the police' 730

Next column shows - 'Attempts %' 87%

730 total. 87% of which were attempted murder. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out 95 murders and 635 attempted murders.

Works the same for the other two documents.

Gatso

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #17 on:** November 17, 2002, 10:05:53 PM »

87% failure rate? That's the problem with not having enough guns. You guys need some practice.

By the way, why is attempted murder a lesser offense than full blown murder? That's like the judge saying, "Come back when you can hit something."

Sharkm8 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 17, 2002, 10:17:59 PM »

i just sit and look at all this and wonder "what does it all mean"? its all numbers people. it means nothing in real life, there are always discrepencies and of course HUMAN ERROR. obviously none of you are wrong here, and should continue analyzing numbers in front of your computer. on the other hand, those of us who realize it is all just numbers will go out and do our best to stop violence with actions.

wait i just wasted 20 minutes reading this, dang

oh yea, one more thing i hope you realize, the victims that provede those stats arent just numbers to their loved ones.

gatso · « **Reply #19 on:** November 17, 2002, 10:21:09 PM »

http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/statistics23.pdf

This document backs up the Interpol figures for 1998. Page 104 gives a figure of 748 homocides in England/Wales.

Have a nice day Nuke.

Shark, I totally agree. The only reason I'm still here is because there has yet to be a single correct number or fact posted by the thread starter. The numbers are useful for comparitive purposes only if they are correct.

Gatso

thrila · « **Reply #20 on:** November 17, 2002, 10:22:30 PM »

I thought you didn't want anymore anti country threads, Nuke. Yet you decided to try and bash the UK although some what unsuccesfully.

Instead if bashing the UK you have just made yourself look like a tard that can't do Maths.

Ohwell better luck next time Nuke.

Dowding (Work) · « **Reply #21 on:** November 18, 2002, 02:29:20 AM »

Nuke:

Statistics for Dummies - Amazon.com

beet1e · « **Reply #22 on:** November 18, 2002, 02:39:02 AM »

NUKE. I'm a little short of time this morning, but I repeat my quote of the link as you apparently did not read it in my Dubya thread.

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs/hosb601.pdf

Open the above link, and turn to page 10. The document was published May 2001, but contains data through to the end of 1999. Thrila, Gatso, Nashwan, Pei & Swoopy are right - and you can't just add up numbers and extrapolate averages the way you did.

Some Americans on this board like to cite that our crime has "rocketed" since the 1997 gun ban. From 1997 to 1998 the number of homicides rose by 2. Looking to page 12 of the Home Office document, you will see that the United States has more violent crime than any other country in the list.

bounder · « **Reply #23 on:** November 18, 2002, 03:31:51 AM »

Nuke, I just wanted to add some reasoned thoughts to this interesting and illuminating thread.

a)you're a dingbat.

b)however many people get murdered, whereever they get murdered, they're usually killed by someone they know. Got nothing *at all* to do with guns, gun crime, banning guns etc.

c)you're a dingbat

d)avoid being murdered, slaughter your family. (premptive strike)

e)you're a dingbat

er...that's it

lazs2 · « **Reply #24 on:** November 18, 2002, 08:54:31 AM »

so... even the murderers are incompetent in the Uk? Probly all lucas workers.
lazs

H. Godwineson · « **Reply #25 on:** November 18, 2002, 10:22:59 AM »

Beetle,

You are wearing your feelings of cultural superiority on your sleeve. In addition, you are reaching the wrong conclusions based on the "official data" you are so fond of quoting.

As a famous man once said "There are lies, damned lies, and then there are statistics."

The mere presence of firearms does not guarantee that a society will become violent. Homicide rates in shooting-conscious Norway, Sweden, and Switzerland are extremely low compared to the U.S. That fact alone casts doubt on your conclusion that the presence of large numbers of firearms leads to the high homicide rate of the U.S.

The population of the U.S. is almost five times that of the U.K. In addition, we are much more culturally diverse. If you study the demographics of crime in the U.S. closely enough, certain "trends" will become evident. Much of the violent crime in our country is concentrated in specific ethnic or cultural groups. African-Americans are much more likely than European-Americans to be the victims of homicide or other violent crimes. In our politically correct culture, no one wants to draw the wrong kind of conclusion from that fact. Nevertheless, the fact remains that if the crimes from that cultural group were left out of the equation, the violent crime rate of the U.S. would appear much lower than it does.

Violent crime rates in the U.S. have not always been as high as they are today. The onset of the drug culture during the 1960s, and the turf wars between rival gangs for control of the drug trade in the inner city areas led to a drastic upswing in every category of crime.

The problems associated with drugs and Black-on-Black crime would remain even if every gun in the U.S. magically disappeared. They might even become worse. Criminals and psychos will always find a way.

Do you remember the incident last year when an idiot threw a one gallon molotov cocktain into a bunk house filled with teenage boys in a south African country one night and killed 50 of them? The nut cases and criminals WILL find a way.

Regards, Shuckins

lazs2 · « **Reply #26 on:** November 18, 2002, 03:05:04 PM »

guess if we sent all of our "diversity" over there then we would halve our murder rate while doubling theirs... not only that but... with our murderers over there they would raise the dismal Uk murder per attempt stats. Nothing like a little American can do attitude to bring those brit stats up.
lazs

Nashwan · « **Reply #27 on:** November 18, 2002, 04:40:57 PM »

Quote

guess if we sent all of our "diversity" over there then we would halve our murder rate while doubling theirs

Do you think Britain doesn't have it's criminal classes? You think muggings and street robberies are committed equally by all social groups, or by the inner city poor?

Quote

so... even the murderers are incompetent in the Uk? Probly all lucas workers.

Perhaps it's because they don't have guns. After all, any idiot can kill someone with a gun, no matter how "culturally diverse" they are.

NUKE · « **Reply #28 on:** November 18, 2002, 09:49:39 PM »

Brits kill each other by more humane means than guns.... they are civilized.

Bodhi · « **Reply #29 on:** November 18, 2002, 11:17:07 PM »

You folks in the UK are more than welcome to keep your non gun policies, while we here, will keep the ability to defend ourselves as our Constitution so rightly provides....

Btw, can I interest you in any anti-gun liberals for your parliament??? (points to Clintons, Gore, and Jackson)