Author Topic: new plaines  (Read 379 times)

Offline rogerdee

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« on: November 22, 2002, 07:26:07 PM »
hi guys how about a new troop transport.
maybe ju 52 something with guns would be good,stop getting shot so much
490th battling bulldogs
www.rogerdee.co.uk

it does what it says on the tin

Offline brady

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« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2002, 08:19:03 PM »
Well that single 7.9mm would not do much, in the MA.

 The Tabby would imo be a better choice.

Offline Imp

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« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2002, 08:32:16 PM »
Wasnt the Tabby the japenese version of the dc3 (c47)?

Or am I completly off the track?

Offline brady

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« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2002, 09:26:05 PM »
Ya, but had more powerfull engines(faster), and a 13mm, and two 7mm MG's for defense.

Offline whgates3

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« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2002, 12:18:30 AM »
Maybe they should just add something like that described below:

"U.S.A.A.F. Combat Cargo Groups of the Second World War

3rd Combat Cargo Group, 10th Combat Cargo Squadron

 

'Spooky' - 1944

Col. Charles D. Farr

       Prior to be assigned as the Commanding Officer of the 3rd Combat Cargo Group, Col. Charles D. Farr was with the 443rd Troop Carrier Group.  It was while with the 443rd Troop Carrier Group, that Col. Farr had an idea to help in the defense of the the then defenseless C-47's   while on their low level drop missions.  While his aircraft were supporting British Brigadier General Orde Wingate's Chindit operation in Burma, C-47's of the group had come under fire from Japanese infantrymen, who were used to shooting a stationary targets.  When they fired at these low flying C-47's, they usually aimed at the cockpit area, not allowing for the aircraft speed and managed mostly to kill or wound the kickers and pushers in the rear.  
     The Colonel and Capt. John A. McCann, Group Intelligence Officer, had an idea, that if a 'gun-ship' (twenty years prior to the AC-47, 'Spooky' of Vietnam fame),  was fed into these drop patterns, a good spray job with a large caliber gun might keep the Japanese infantrymen's heads down.   Naturally .50 heavy machine gun was the gun of choice for this idea.  Initial thought began as to the mounting of these weapons, the nose, the first thought,  was quickly dismissed due to the amount of equipment located there.  Second thought was to mount them in the cargo compartment,   firing out through a side window, this idea was also dismissed due to the fact that it took up valuable cargo area.  Finally it was decided to rig tripod mount and cut a hole in the aft section of the cargo door for one gun and then cut a similar hole on the opposite side of the fuselage, but moved forward somewhat to prevent the gunners from interfering with each other (similar to the later model B-17G's, with staggered waist gun positions).  

    C-47, Sn# 315054, of the 315th Troop Carrier Squadron was the first C-47 to be converted for this use.  A large hole was cut in the aft section of the cargo door from waist level to about eye level.   A similar hole was cut in to the fuselage on the opposite side but staggered forward.  The tripod made of heavy angle iron was attached with set screws to the floor and the bottom of hole cut in the cargo door and fuselage.  These guns would have radius of action of about 160 degrees in transverse and about 80 degrees in elevation and declination, minus of course the contour of the tail and wings which the gunners would have to miss on his own.   Initial experiments with the .50 machine guns mounted were very successful and it was determined that a second C-47 would be modified in this manner.   Modifications to these C-47's was made on or about May 1944 just prior to the Col. taking Command of the 3rd Combat Cargo Group.

    At this point I have no other knowledge of the Col. or his exploits in the CBI and with the 3rd Combat Cargo Group."

the above from http://www.comcar.org/3rd_ComCar/col_char_d_farr_spooky_1944.htm

also, i think i've read that some C-47s had holes in the side windows so  the troops inside could fire their MGs  through them?
that could be 7 MGs on each side of the plane - probably small calliber or low velocity guns, though (tommy gun, BAR - - adding a O.45 pistol would be cool, them the pilots in chutes could shoot back)

Offline Wilbus

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« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2002, 03:30:14 AM »
Me 323 Gigant.
Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson

Liberating Livestock since 1998, recently returned from a 5 year Sheep-care training camp.

Offline Imp

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« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2002, 06:35:16 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Wilbus
Me 323 Gigant.


:D  Great idea Wilbus that thing was really hard to shoot down!

Offline bigUC

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« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2002, 06:47:54 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by brady
Well that single 7.9mm would not do much, in the MA.

 The Tabby would imo be a better choice.


I have seen Ju 52's somewhere with up to 5 guns (2 dorsal mg's (one gun a 13 mm mg 131) , 1 ventral mg (bathtub) and 2 mgs trough cabin windows.)  

Too lazy to look it up, tough...
Kurt is winking at U!

Offline brady

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« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2002, 05:00:04 PM »
I think you refering to the prewar bomber varient.

 AFIK the standard trop transport varient, had typicaly a 7.9mm MG in the Dorsal position, and ocashional 1 or 2 beam 7.9mm MG's.

Offline corey

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« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2002, 07:05:32 AM »
what about the C-130 Hercules. that thing is big.:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Offline corey

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« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2002, 07:54:29 AM »
b36 converted

Offline ra

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« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2002, 08:12:09 AM »
Quote
also, i think i've read that some C-47s had holes in the side windows so the troops inside could fire their MGs through them?


If you look at a C47 you may see that some of the windows have a small hole in the middle with a plug in it.  This is used as a vacuum system to clean the plane in flight.  The plug is removed and a vaccum hose hooked up to it.  The airflow outside the window creates a vacuum.  

ra

Offline corey

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« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2002, 08:08:20 AM »
they did shoot out of them if necisary :) :o :cool:

Offline gatso

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« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2002, 08:38:50 AM »
Did the He 111H-20 carry paras or just troops. Did it keep its armament? Possibilities?

Gatso