Return of the Death Star

[2stony]

When I first came to AH, I was disappointed that the buffs could only carry one gunner. It would be much more realistic if you could sign on as many gunners as the particular buff had guns. Figs would think twice about solo attacks on buffs if all the guns were manned.

"Bring the Death Star to AH"


Stony

[SFRT - Frenchy]

Originally posted by 2stony
Figs would think twice about solo attacks on buffs if all the guns were manned.

"Bring the Death Star to AH"


Stony

humm ... I don't think so.

[2stony]

What I meant was that figs wouldn't be able to swoop by as the cone of fire of the next gun(or gun from sisterships)would be firing on them. Or, more than one position at the same time would be firing on them.
     Currently, the gunner has to jump around from position to position, and by the time he does that, the fig is usually out of range.
     With a multi-manned buff, the fig would be succeptable to multiple fire.


Stony

[Furious]

I think it would make them easier to kill.

[Innominate]

One factor that makes buffs in AH so deadly is that all possible guns point at the target.

A player in the tailgun of a b17 doesnt just have the tail gun, he has the top and the ball gun too.  You have four to six MG's shooting at you, not two.

There is no effective delay in switching between gun positions.

Anyways Buff formations can have two gunners(the pilot, and an attached gunner)

[hazed-]

Now i cant be sure but i seem to remember HTC saying it wasnt possible to have more than 2 players joined together.

it was a LONG time ago but its something that seems to have stuck in my mind so i think im remembering right.

it is a shame as 10 man b17 crews would be fantastic! well, 7 men i guess, dont need radio operators or co pilots or navigators

[Pongo]

Naw. I think he said its not in the game because when they did it in another game it was almost never ever used. Which is a poor use of development time.
It would almost never be used here either. Gunners are almost never used now...

[Fancy]

Who'd have thunk figs were such a dangerous fruit.

[Kweassa]

The more gunners are, the less deadly they'll be

 Inn is right. All defensive buff guns within angular range fires its guns simultaneously at one single target point. It's like facing a P-51D or a P-47D in a head-on. The more gunners there are, the less "mechanically perfect" they'll be, and thus, lot weaker defenses.

[TheCage]

The more gunners there are, the less "mechanically perfect" they'll be, and thus, lot weaker defenses.

The other game was Air Warrior, and I flew in a five ship Death Star formation once.   We were attack very heavily from many directions, and because we had multiple gunners we were able to have better protection.  

By the time the bombers got to the target we had lost only two bombers but had a return of 14 fighter kills.   The three bombers destroyed their intended target.  

Other nights someone would up a B-17 flying deathstar and could on it's own most of the time get to the target.   I don't know how well it would work here though but think about it.   How many people that have had a gunner got shot down because they couldn't defend against fighters hitting from two different directions?  

BTW I was one of the two bombers that died.  I took an engine hit and couldn't keep up and stay in formation.   While the ship I was flying lasted a while it didn't take long to finish off a crippled bomber.    If any of you old AW'ers remember, correct me if I am wrong.  But I seem to remember that the gunners could be killed just like the pilots could.  

I believe currently in this game, gun positions are immortal.   Except until almost the end of AW, the pilot could not gun the ship at all.   No crew, no guns.   Without good fighter escort, bombers alone with no crew rarely made it to a target.

[Wilbus]

Guns or no guns, multiple gunners or not, buffs are just targets anyway.

[Pooh21]

yay multiple gunners! some not paying attention, some afk, some n00b who sprayed all his ammo at friendlys on takeoff. No more of this laser assisted all 10 nm they fixed it so only at least 6 guns on the B-17 point at you at once, so now those 6 guns will be pointing all over creation so when my 30mm rips the buff to shreds I get 7 kills? cool I want it!

[Turbot]

Putting a whole squad in bomber(s) was one of the most fun things you could do in AW.   With in plane intercom, everyone shared in the score, was a great team activity.

[Samiam]

Originally posted by hazed-
dont need radio operators or co pilots or navigators

Still could use a radio operator, hazed. A designated person to spew on channel 1 would take a great burden off of the pilot...

[MOSQ]

I flew in a regular buff squads in Air Warrior for years. A fully loaded Death Star with your squadmates was great fun ! We regularly flew Death Stars whenever possible.
I disagree with the automated targeting be more accurate. Having individual gunners at each gun would make the buffs much more dangerous !
1) The current formation model is next to worthless for getting the formations guns on target. The reason is convergence. The other planes do not account for the convergence problem.
2) The same applies to the guns on a single buff. Again convergence will only be accurate at your pre-selected convergence point. On either side of that point only one gun position is firing accurately.
Therefore only one gun on one plane is actually aimed at the enemy.
3) Mulitple attackers cannot be engaged from different directions with only one gunner. A fully staffed buff can handle multiple directions at once.

Again I want to repeat, having your squadmates all on one plane, each relying on the other for their virtual lives, with the intercom going full speed, is tremendous fun.

Fully staffed buffs is probably the single biggest thing I miss in the transition from Air Warrior to Aces High !