LaGG 3

[Sakai]

Since the La5-7s were derivations of the Lagg3, that is the airframe was basically the same, shouldn't it be somewhat easier to model the LaGG (as oppsoed to a new type) for an early war Soviet fighter?  

Would require slightly different artwork due to engine and nose tho . . .

Sakai

[udet]

yeah, model the Lagg3 and remove the La7

[Dowding (Work)]

The spitfire accounts for more kills than the La7 and the P51 is a more popular ride. Yet why do people always focus on the La-7?

I'd like to see the LaGG-3 BTW, for scenarios etc. It was an atrocious fighter.

[GRUNHERZ]

I donno Dowding, I find the La7 quite easy to defeat in my Bf109G6.   I guess it's because La7 is so fast and accels too well so it runs down the standard no skill MA run away from the fight gangbanger..

[Wotan]

an earlier LaGG5 or La-5f would be good too

[Tilt]

Originally posted by Dowding (Work)
I'd like to see the LaGG-3 BTW, for scenarios etc. It was an atrocious fighter.

From the Russian "varnished guaranteed coffin".... very under powered......although VVS pilots preffered it to the Hurricane.

There were no production aircraft designated Lagg5....... although the 1st few months runs of the La5 (sometimes refered to as the Lag5 used wings(especially) and some fuselages taken off the Lagg production lines originally intended for Lagg's. (both the "G's".....Gorbunov & Gudkov......had left the bearau by the time of the La5)

[Dowding (Work)]

I'm a Yak-9U dweeb, Grunherz - I eat La-7s for breakfast.

Tilt - were the two 'Gs' purged? If not, what else did they design?

[Innominate]

Originally posted by Dowding (Work)
The spitfire accounts for more kills than the La7 and the P51 is a more popular ride. Yet why do people always focus on the La-7?

It's because most fights deteriorate into a low/slow furball.  The la7 completly dominates at low alt.  The spitfire and p51 have weaknesses in a co-e matchup.

The la7 at low alt can outrun anything, and outturn anything that can keep up with it.  It can keep up with anything in a zoom climb.  While most la7(and spit/pony) pilots suck, the la7 is the most lethal of any of them.

The only way to beat a co-e la7 is to get high enough to get out of it's ideal altitude range.

[Tilt]

Originally posted by Dowding (Work)
I'm a Yak-9U dweeb, Grunherz - I eat La-7s for breakfast.

Tilt - were the two 'Gs' purged? If not, what else did they design?

I have a potted history here


http://www.btinternet.com/~fulltilt/deshist.html

Gorbonov seems to have faded back to the Tsagi........Gudkov and Lavochkin were rivals.............

Infact Gudkov was the 1st to bolt the Ash82 onto the Lagg airframe but he used the cowling and exhaust/intake straight of the Su2 without modification........... it looked promicing but was lost (en route) when Gudkov moved factories .......he then went onto armament design work somewhere and faded from history.....

[whgates3]

...so it seems the LaG-5 was just slapping the nose end of the Su-2 onto the LaGG-3, while the La-5 is an actual redesign of the LaGG-3 (or LaG-5) to take the M-82 engine (and other improvements, including 360° view canopy, bomb racks & ~400 lbs of weight reduction)

Su-2


LaG-5


La-5


actually that Su-2 cowling looks a bit different than LaG-5 - maybe they were just canibalizing the engines from the Su-2 (Su-2s were decomissioned in '42 & Il-2 used instead.  some Su-2s were remade into Su-4s using the M-90 & AM-37 engines around the same time the LaG-5 was made)
the other G from the original LaGG ggang - Mikhail Goudkov - did make one interesting plane before fading to obscurity, called the K-27 - it was a LaGG-3 armed only with a 37mm firing through the prop shaft. about 20 were made and at least one was effectively used in combat, knocking down 2 Me-110s, by a fighter pilot named Pereskokov

[HoHun]

Hi Tilt,

>Infact Gudkov was the 1st to bolt the Ash82 onto the Lagg airframe but he used the cowling and exhaust/intake straight of the Su2 without modification...........

After the end of the series production, the MiG-3 was developed into a radial-engined fighter, too.

The first prototype, called I-210 and powered by the M-82A , flew first in December 1941. It turned out to be inferior to the original MiG-3.

External and internal aerodynamics of the I-210 had to be reworked with the help of Tsagi, and the new M-82F was fitted in the improved I-211, which after its first flight in 1943 and subsequent combat trials of 10 pre-series aircraft was considered a success.

However in 1942, even before the I-211 had flown for the first time, MiG was ordered to turn over their research to Lavochkin, who obviously was much quicker to get it into series production with the La-5. Apparently, the leading-edge slats of the La-5 were based on the MiG I-211, too (at least according to Belyakov/Marmain, "MiG - Fifty Years of Secret Aircraft Design").

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

[Sclew]

Hmm, My information from Oleg Maddox some time ago re: the Lagg-3 development was that both of these people were involved with redsigning and improving the LaGG airframe and engine for some time after Lavochkin left.

Gudkov in fact was responsible for the LaGG-3 remaining in production for such a long time after the La-5 should have replaced it. AFAIK it was in development and production right up until '43 ?

[Ike 2K#]

Originally posted by Dowding (Work)
The spitfire accounts for more kills than the La7 and the P51 is a more popular ride. Yet why do people always focus on the La-7?

I'd like to see the LaGG-3 BTW, for scenarios etc. It was an atrocious fighter.

LOL because la7 in AH has good performance at low to med alt compare to 51's slow climb rate and its slow acceleration at low alt. La7 has low wing load and has good cannonz compare to 50 cals.

[Karnak]

Originally posted by Dowding (Work)
The spitfire accounts for more kills than the La7 and the P51 is a more popular ride. Yet why do people always focus on the La-7?

From a Mossie pilot's perspective, its because I can outrun the Spitfire and out turn the P-51, but the La-7 out performs my Mosquito in every flight charactaristic.  If I run into an enemy La-7 I have to hope he accepts the HO, or that he truely sucks as a pilot.

[4343]

I personally only fly two fighters on Aces High when i can help it (although, i am no longer in the main arena, im too poor ), one is the Bf-109G10 and the other is the LA7.   I've found that in a co-energy (if it is above 250 mph) i can hold with and defeat an LA7 without much trouble (once in a while of course i actually come across a really good LA7 dweeb and he gives me a run for my money).  The only time i fly the LA7 is when there's a big furball right outside my own base and i've already been shot down in the G10 several times on takeoff.   I find that the reason this is so is because the G10 and the 109 in general is VASTLY underrated.  i've held turns with yaks, LA7s, spits, mustangs, all those goodies without trouble IF i have co-E above 250mph.  of course...under that it's really anyone's game, usually with me stalling out and having to make a run for it...as the 109 accelerates beautifully...but back to the lavochkin...
the LA7 is truly a beautiful airplane to fly below 15,000...and be  honest: how often are battles above 15k?  that's why the LA7 fared so well on the eastern front: most air engagements were below 15k.  it's the same reason the P-39 did so well there and mediocre everywhere else.  109 and the LA7 ran hand in hand for a long time, even to the point where pilots said the only difference between the two in combat was the loose nut behind the glass.  good climb, good guns, good maneuver, GREAT speed...what else does anyone look for in an airplane.  if u ask me...there's just too many spitfire dweebs .