Author Topic: ACM for Elite Or Just Newbie Piloting? (Read 799 times)

BlckMgk · « **on:** January 23, 2003, 01:24:28 PM »

Last night I was flying and pushed my p38 a little to far to end up having it snap roll.

After I regained control it put me in a very adventageous spot (where I wanted to be, as far as heading) but at almost three times the rate than a normal under control roll.

So my question is, do expert pilots learn to intentionaly snap roll their plane to manuever more quickly? or Is this a big No No as far as ACM's? If this is used by the elite and takes time to learn, anyone have a tip?

If I'm miss naming(using a misnomer ?) "snap roll", what I'm reffering to, is at the edge of a stall one wing will dip into an accelerated roll, faster than normal.

-BlckMgk

lord dolf vader · « **Reply #1 on:** January 23, 2003, 01:43:26 PM »

shhhhhhhh

Ghosth · « **Reply #2 on:** January 23, 2003, 01:55:02 PM »

Use it if it works.

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #3 on:** January 23, 2003, 01:55:57 PM »

Snap rolling to gain an advantageous position is risky and unnecessary in my experience. Yes it works - but its a gamble for me whether or not I end up where I wanted to be.

You could do the same thing with more "standard" ACM anyway - just takes a little longer.

YMMV

gofaster · « **Reply #4 on:** January 23, 2003, 02:00:27 PM »

Intentional stalling and snap rolling to gain an advantageous position has been around since WW1. Doing it in a sim has been around at least as long as Air Warrior 1.0. FW190 pilots could do it at will. P-38 pilots could almost do it at will, but they used flaps to retain control.

BlckMgk · « **Reply #5 on:** January 23, 2003, 02:24:10 PM »

If anyone is apt at performing these manuvers please shoot me an e-mail with some tips psyc11@aol.com it would be much appreciated.

Btw Vader I enjoy telling the "secrets" etc just because it raises the level of the playing field making it that much more difficult, and atleast for me that much more fun. So any tid bits I learn otw I'm more than happy to teach the new folks in the arena (hopefully they stay on my side though hehe!)

Thanks for the responses...

-BlckMgk

Nifty · « **Reply #6 on:** January 23, 2003, 03:18:25 PM »

yeah, but how much alt did you lose in that accelerated stall?

popeye · « **Reply #7 on:** January 23, 2003, 03:22:58 PM »

Ah, yes....brings back memories of Zy's instantaneous 180 degree FW spin turns.

sheesh.....

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #8 on:** January 23, 2003, 04:35:13 PM »

Like all maneuvers, the 'snap roll' has its time and place. As an everyday maneuver like the Yo-Yo, it will get you killed really fast. As a maneuver to force a reversal, it's one of the best if you can recover it quick enough. When I'm being bounced by a higher bandit, I'll do a snap roll reversal to force the higher speed bandit to overshoot or if the bandit chops throttle to avoid the over shoot, the snall roll can be used to force the reversal. Go offline and practice them until you can recover after a 1/2 and full spin and then try it out in the MA once you fee comfortable.

Ack-Ack

MrLars · « **Reply #9 on:** January 23, 2003, 06:19:14 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by popeye
Ah, yes....brings back memories of Zy's instantaneous 180 degree FW spin turns.

sheesh.....

AW had a real problem with their spin model.

The missuse of it forced AW3 to modify their spin model, once they did the accusations of 'spin warrior' stoped for the most part.

I wouldn't be a bit suprised if some of the old 'spin warriors' are plying their trade here and have figured out how to take advantage of AH's stall model in the same way.

ALF · « **Reply #10 on:** January 23, 2003, 06:45:41 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MrLars
AW had a real problem with their spin model.

The missuse of it forced AW3 to modify their spin model, once they did the accusations of 'spin warrior' stoped for the most part.

I wouldn't be a bit suprised if some of the old 'spin warriors' are plying their trade here and have figured out how to take advantage of AH's stall model in the same way.

Aw had such a simplified spin model (before the fix) that you could reliably predict each and every spin. It was easy to misuse. The spin model in AH appears to be much more complex, and not nearly as gamey. A good F6 pilot can use a controled spin in several ways, and recover at will.