Author Topic: 1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me  (Read 1351 times)

Offline Lephturn

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #45 on: October 09, 2001, 07:55:00 AM »
I just wanted to point something out:

Lots of folks are pointing out that it would be better to have more ack that was less accurate.  Think framerate.  You CAN'T have more ack.  Don't you think HT has thought about that?  Of course he has.  For framerate reasons we need a relatively small # of AAA guns firing over a field.  The only way to balance the small number and still make it tough enough to capture a base is to make the acks we have more accurate and/or more damaging.

It's easy to suggest more acks that are more realistic... but it's not so easy to implement.  If it was that easy, you can bet HT would have done it by now.

Offline Rude

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #46 on: October 09, 2001, 07:58:00 AM »
$14.95/month.

Let it go.

Offline Jochen

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #47 on: October 09, 2001, 08:11:00 AM »
Voss, if you don't like AH then why dont you make your own sim?
jochen Gefechtsverband Kowalewski

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Offline Ripsnort

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #48 on: October 09, 2001, 08:16:00 AM »
Couldn't resist jochen?   :rolleyes:

Offline Westy MOL

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #49 on: October 09, 2001, 09:09:00 AM »
It seems to me HTC supports the fight and die concept.

 <shrugs> So what. All I can think of is what you said to me in the beta forums just a short time ago (regarding external sounds in flight) "It's a game!  :rolleyes:  "

 Westy

[ 10-09-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]

Offline LePaul

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #50 on: October 09, 2001, 09:46:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Zygote:
Err LePaul, crying cause 1.08 has a few minor bugs, many that you mentioned now have been fixed btw, after all the screaming and crying for HTC to release 1.08 asap is kinda stupid.  If you work for a software company then you should realise that with mass distribution on thousands of individual machines running different hardware and software combinations that bugs will pop up which did'nt manifest themselves on your test machines.  Just common sense m8.


I couldn't disagree more, since the bugs that were so rampant effected all configurations....re-read what was mentioned...the trees, 1 ping ack, etc...these things effect all systems, not just some and not the other.

I dunno, I just hold I higher standard in regards to the software we make.  We wouldn't release software, no matter how anxious the public was for it, without thorough testing.  Its one thing to hurry up and get it out, its another to wait an extra day/week/whatever and make sure there isn't anything blatantly mesed up.  1.08 seems like it was shoved out the door to beat the con.

Overall, its a nice release and I havent installed Patch 2 yet, figured I'd let the servers quiet down a bit before diving in.  I just pains me to see such a nice update marred by some really stupid, easy-to-find bugs.

Offline Superfly

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #51 on: October 09, 2001, 10:25:00 AM »
LePaul, we never "shove" any release out the door.  We release a new version when we feel it is ready, and it is definitely not determined by how anxious players get.  It was very possible that 1.08 would have not gone out before the con.
We are only human, so for you to expect that a release is to be abosulutely bug free with every new version is ridiculous.  Now matter how stable you may believe a software to be, more often than not, it will have a few bugs.  Given the enormity and work put into this release, I thinks it's gone rather well.  It wouldn't have gone so well without the beta testers <S>.  Don't worry, all will be well in the land of AH.  ;)
John "Superfly" Guytan
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Offline BOOT

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #52 on: October 09, 2001, 10:44:00 AM »
Wow... Great Thread...

I agree totally with Tac and Whirl...
One shot ack is ridiculous... at least make it where your AC can sustain a couple of hits... I understand the necessity of having a few acks be powerful enough to represent more than the actual number on the field... But C'mon...  Fly 2 sectors to a base... one ping and your tail rips off...(yes I fly the P-38) or a wing...  One shot gets both engines???  That is extreme...

Tilt is right on the Money !!!

The city buildings are too soft... The more Strats the better...  With strong strategic elements, the game provides a platform for all players...  The player that doesn't have an Ubber Puter can work at buffing or ground attack...  Those that do have the latest state of the art machines can concentrate on H2H air combat...  This game is filled with all kinds of people with all kinds of likes and dis-likes...  My particular preferences are more in line with what Tilt was saying...  I like organized missions with strategic importance...  I am going to have to stay with Ground Attack until I can upgrade my system, since the release of 1.08... But I am excited about doing just that...  This game is awsome...
The best I have ever played... I have been playing WW2 Flight sims for 6 years now...(Unfortunately I still suk as a fighter joc)
AH is undoubtedly the Best of the Best...

All AH Needs, Are Player Designed and Run Scenarios Then AH will have reached Perfection...

My hats off to HT...  keep the strats coming.

BOOT

Offline LePaul

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #53 on: October 09, 2001, 11:00:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by SUPERFLY:
LePaul, we never "shove" any release out the door.  We release a new version when we feel it is ready, and it is definitely not determined by how anxious players get.  It was very possible that 1.08 would have not gone out before the con.
We are only human, so for you to expect that a release is to be abosulutely bug free with every new version is ridiculous.  Now matter how stable you may believe a software to be, more often than not, it will have a few bugs.  Given the enormity and work put into this release, I thinks it's gone rather well.  It wouldn't have gone so well without the beta testers <S>.  Don't worry, all will be well in the land of AH.   ;)


Good to hear.  

Bugs, like toejam, happen.  I was just disappointed at what *seemed* obvious to me.  I appreciate your response and hope you understand my opinion(s).  Glad things are getting fixed.

Now can you fix Tac's P-38?   :)

Offline hitech

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #54 on: October 09, 2001, 11:28:00 AM »
Quite frankly I don't understand your opinon LePaul. Thowing stones at other devlopers ( which this insn't your first time) is in bad taist, and Smacks of elitissm.

Your opinion in no way takes into account the different needs of software based on it's  industry.

Btw lets take your tree example. We beta tested the clutter. Did you see even one post of trees at the end of the runway beeing a problem?
That was with at least 300 people testing it.

Now if you would wrather us take 6 months to a year for releases, and 1 month to release a bug patch, we could play it your way.

I would wrather continue with the methods we currently use.


HiTech

Offline LePaul

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #55 on: October 09, 2001, 02:06:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hitech:
Quite frankly I don't understand your opinon LePaul. Thowing stones at other devlopers ( which this insn't your first time) is in bad taist, and Smacks of elitissm.

We're going to disagree a lot, so we can either make this thread really long, so all the cheerleaders can throw their 2 cents in, or we can take it to private email.  Its completely up to you.

Call it elistist, bad taste (note the spelling, thank you) or whatever.  Every company does things their own way.  As a customer of your program/service, I have just as much a right to cry foul at what I feel are incredibly assinine problems.  Customers, like it or not, are allowed to complain.  You can shrug it off, accept it, or, entertain a discussion on why I feel that way.

You claim elitism, I say bull feathers.  Again, we can mud wrestle here or in private email.  

 
Quote
Your opinion in no way takes into account the different needs of software based on it's  industry.

I think quality testing is essential in any application sold to the public.

 
Quote
Btw lets take your tree example. We beta tested the clutter. Did you see even one post of trees at the end of the runway beeing a problem?
That was with at least 300 people testing it.

Yes, I saw lots of people posting about trees at the end of the runway being a problem.  In the General Discussion and Bugs areas.  However, you fixed that in patch 2.  If I'm so out of line, and you had 300 people claim no problem, why'd you fix it?    :)  Ah ha, so perhaps it was an overlooked issue?

 
Quote
Now if you would wrather us take 6 months to a year for releases, and 1 month to release a bug patch, we could play it your way.

I would wrather continue with the methods we currently use.

Oh sure, rile up the community will ya.  Your development cycle is completely up to you.  I enjoy the new updates like all your other customers.

Its the testing before the product hits the public I question.  And again, we can ram heads on that in private email, if you are up to it, and/or care to discuss our differing views in a respectful manner.

Again, overall I enjoy the game.  There are just some issues, like 1.08s release, I find maddening.  If you want, again, we can chat privtely.

[ 10-09-2001: Message edited by: LePaul ]

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #56 on: October 09, 2001, 02:41:00 PM »
1.08 is a good drastic update, the only thing that does stink in a way, is the fact that an ENTIRE airfield can be taken with less than a third of previous efforts.

Also the Frame rate has gone down noticably, and the graphical advances, from what I have seen implemented (comparitivly speaking of other sims) should not have done anything to bring on such a noticable difference.


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Offline Skuzzy

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #57 on: October 09, 2001, 02:57:00 PM »
Ahhhh, come on LePaul.  I am a software developer too, and I can say categorically that 3D games are much tougher to debug than any other application around.
The plethora of hardware/software configurations out in the real world make it impossible to thoroughly test any 3D game.
Trying to find a bug almost requires matching the system configuration the bug is reported on.
You can look at code all day long and you might see the bug, then again, you might not.  Debugging a 3D game is a bear, as you cannot do it as a full screen dedicated app, it has to be run as a windowed app, which can fix an anomaly that would only show up in full screen mode.
Maybe you know all that, I do not know as I do not pretend to know what you develope.  I do know HTC does not knowingly ship thier product with bugs.
Online games are just a bugger to debug.  I will say they do fix things in a timely manner, whether they are bugs or adjustments in the game, they do get them done pretty fast.
Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
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Offline Ripsnort

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #58 on: October 09, 2001, 03:02:00 PM »
You think 3D games are bad, try being a analyst for a CADD/CAM application that designs both commercial and military aircraft!  To date, no fewer than 17,000 "bug reports" in this latest version since 1994.  :)

Offline Voss

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1.08 is an interesting concept, but not for me
« Reply #59 on: October 09, 2001, 03:19:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Jochen:
Voss, if you don't like AH...

I obviously LIKE AH, or I wouldn't be here EVERYDAY, nor making suggestions on how to make things even better (IMHO).

You either don't post under your flying handle, or don't fly here at all, so you will be ignored!