Author Topic: wulfies idea... (Read 992 times)

lazs2 · « **on:** February 28, 2003, 08:25:12 AM »

"An alternate idea to my p.s. above - allow players to spend perk points to get fuel, ammunition, etc. above what the current base has available - in effect you are turning your Yak-9U into a '15 perk fighter' because you are rolling with 100% fuel at a field that has 25% fuel available. And just like a perk fighter - if you land, you get the perks back maybe?

Mike/wulfie"

I think this is a great idea and a way to use the normally unused perk points. Plus if it thwarts the "missun dudz" and suicide jabo guys then it has got to be good... I would go further and say that when the hangers are down, 15 perks will give you that plane they had hidden in the revetment... something to make building battling as worthless as it should be.
lazs

Tarmac · « **Reply #1 on:** February 28, 2003, 08:44:32 AM »

I second that. Great idea.

Always found it amusing that an unlimited number of 25% fueled B-17's could up, but not one 50% fueled 109.

ed: would this apply to goons too? would kind of counter-pork the whole barracks porking strategy to prevent captures, but would give us something to spend bomber perks on. I'd take up a 20 or 30 perk goon... there's nothing else to spend those perkies on right now. Might encourage people to escort goons a bit more if they knew someone had 30 perks on the line. Maybe you could only do it if the strat grunt training facility was up and running at near 100%, to encourage people to do some strategic bombing to prevent this.

Innominate · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2003, 08:45:07 AM »

I have to say "yea" to anything which would make perks usefull.

Ripsnort · « **Reply #3 on:** February 28, 2003, 08:45:55 AM »

I like that idea.

gofaster · « **Reply #4 on:** February 28, 2003, 09:17:26 AM »

No way! That's like saying its ok to simulate a black market or something. What, you think there's an active native population loitering around with horsecarts full of petrol and .50 cal still in crates?

If you want a better way to stop the jabo bastages and burn perk points, then perk the P-51D, F4U-1D, F6F, P-38, P-47 (all models), Typhoon, Mosquito, and Me-110. Maybe then we'll start seeing divebombers being used on a wider scale like they were in the real war.

Let the fighters do the fighting and the bombers do the bombing.

If you prevent the jabo runs, you won't have to worry about overcoming porked fuel problems. Therefore, perk the jabo fighters and see how many Stuka, Dauntless, and IL-2 raids you get.

GScholz · « **Reply #5 on:** February 28, 2003, 09:30:45 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by gofaster
No way! That's like saying its ok to simulate a black market or something. What, you think there's an active native population loitering around with horsecarts full of petrol and .50 cal still in crates?

I think you're missing the point. If an AF has the fuel to launch a B-17 with 25% fuel, it prolly has the fuel to launch a squadron or so of Bf109's. The fuel availability should be in lbs rather than %.

Anyways on the perk thing. If a LW base was low on fuel and could not launch all its planes with 100% fuel, do you think Adolf Galland would still get a full tank? ... I do. He definitively had the perks for it.

Shiva · « **Reply #6 on:** February 28, 2003, 09:58:07 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by gofaster
No way! That's like saying its ok to simulate a black market or something. What, you think there's an active native population loitering around with horsecarts full of petrol and .50 cal still in crates?

No, it's like giving Richard Bong or Greg Boyington or Erich Hartmann full ammo and fuel loadouts while the rest of the squadron gets a reduced loadout.

Virage · « **Reply #7 on:** February 28, 2003, 09:58:31 AM »

suprise, lazs wants to water down an already weak strategic model. The current system is nothing more than a minor inconvenience at best. And only to the other strat guys. It sure doesnt stop a good furball, which is the ultimate form of gaming right? It can limit vulture time tho, I guess that sucks.

But this whole argument is moot with a Dueling Arena specifically designed for those who would like to play in a strat free environ. But i guess it is more fun to b*!ch on the BB than fly there.

Innominate · « **Reply #8 on:** February 28, 2003, 10:06:17 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Virage
The current system is nothing more than a minor inconvenience at best.

When it comes to fuel porked at a field, 25 fuel essentially shuts a field down for an hour or more, and requires only a couple of lightly armed jabos to kill.

The country-wide strategic model is a mess IMO, and serves no purpose but to give buff pilots something cool to blow up.

The 'strat' targets at the fields however are soft, easy to kill, and capable of rendering a field impotent for long stretches of time.

IMO the strat targets need to be more important, and the field 'strat' targets less-so.

gofaster · « **Reply #9 on:** February 28, 2003, 10:14:34 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Innominate
When it comes to fuel porked at a field, 25 fuel essentially shuts a field down for an hour or more, and requires only a couple of lightly armed jabos to kill.

The country-wide strategic model is a mess IMO, and serves no purpose but to give buff pilots something cool to blow up.

The 'strat' targets at the fields however are soft, easy to kill, and capable of rendering a field impotent for long stretches of time.

IMO the strat targets need to be more important, and the field 'strat' targets less-so.

Another reason to (a) perk the jabo fighters and (b) introduce a second vh at the airfields.

Innominate · « **Reply #10 on:** February 28, 2003, 11:30:37 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by gofaster
Another reason to (a) perk the jabo fighters

*COUGH*(Or, inno's jabo solution)
Somewhat tougher field 'strat' may be usefull...(500-1000lbs) to make it tougher to strafe.

Second VH though is a bad idea. One is plenty for handsomehunkes attacking the field to ignore. The problem strat at fields is the stuff that any fighter can kill by simple strafing.

wulfie · « **Reply #11 on:** February 28, 2003, 11:32:25 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Virage
suprise, lazs wants to water down an already weak strategic model. The current system is nothing more than a minor inconvenience at best. And only to the other strat guys. It sure doesnt stop a good furball, which is the ultimate form of gaming right? It can limit vulture time tho, I guess that sucks.

But this whole argument is moot with a Dueling Arena specifically designed for those who would like to play in a strat free environ. But i guess it is more fun to b*!ch on the BB than fly there.

Technically speaking - in terms of MA, power projection in the MA, etc. - perk points are a strategic resource.

Think of it this way...when thinking of the MA in 'strategic' terms, i.e. field capture and field defense to 'win and reset the map and earn bonus perk points doing so' - if one side's players had a large # of perk points and the other side's players did not, as it stands now the side with an abundance of perk points could field an attacking force that outmatched the 'weak on perk points' side: Ar 234s, bombing from altitude, escorted by Me 262s and Ta 152s. The 'strong' side could conduct numerous fighter bomber missions with Tempest Mk. Vs and F4U-4s that a side not able to deploy 'perked' fighters would be hard pressed to defend against. The 'weak perk' side would have an almost impossible time in the attack - due to facing Me 262s and Me 163s.

The perk points are out there as an effective strategic resource. The main reason that this isn't 'obvious' at present is because they aren't being voluntarily used as much as they might be, because some people don't like to fly Ta 152s, Me 262s, etc.

Mike/wulfie

lazs2 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 28, 2003, 02:33:33 PM »

exactly... perk points are useless to me and to most people. Now if you are saying that I am unskilled and that I can't earn perk points then ok... But... how much "skill" is required to jabo the fuel? None. certainly, if I earn perk points by flying slow or inferior planes in a late war arena .... I wshould be entitled to have some effect on the "strat"? Certainly my skill in earning perks is at the very least.... on a par with that of the building battlers? Perhaps a reward that suits me would be in order?

besides.... It is just me taking off... how many no skill buildning battlers can i kill befor I run out of ammo anyway? doubt if I would average more than about 4 or so.

I am also for either perking every fast plane or.... better yet... every bomb over 100 lbs should be perked.
lazs

Mini D · « **Reply #13 on:** February 28, 2003, 02:43:35 PM »

Seems like a pretty good idea to me. I actually think it would lend to a slightly more realistic aproach to some areas.

MiniD

gofaster · « **Reply #14 on:** February 28, 2003, 02:51:03 PM »

I'm hording my perk points in the hopes that some big wonderful omnipotent vehicle will be introduced that will change the face of combat as we know it.

Like a player-controlled lone-wolf battleship.

Or submarines.

Or a Sherman Calliope.

Or a P-61 Black Widow.

Or Superfortresses.

Or commandos/pilots with handguns.

The only side that would benefit from using perk points to create raw materials would be Bishops, who won a majority of the map resets prior to the load-balancing perk expenditure system was implemented. So there.

I like the idea of perking the 500 and 1000 pound bombs, but still prefer a 2nd vh, particularly at Vehicle Baseswhich should, by their name, have more than one hangar. Harder structures would just mean longer vulch cycles before base capture.