Author Topic: Forgotten Battles  (Read 1940 times)

Offline Kirin

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« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2003, 11:16:10 AM »
Yup, got  a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz myself after I got into IL2 seriously.

Although the FB beta had some issues with it... the sounds were really faint - not distorted or something like that - clear and precise (you gonna love the new outside sound) but just very faint - had to pump up the volume which was a problem when I was simultanously using a voice comm proggy...

Hope that is solved with the final version. Turtle Beach is a bit slow on the driver updates. OTH I waited like 2 years for a new SB driver... ;)
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Offline XNachoX

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« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2003, 05:30:29 PM »
I love my jug.

Offline XNachoX

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« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2003, 05:31:11 PM »
er... :)

Offline Russian

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« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2003, 08:14:01 PM »



;)

Offline XNachoX

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« Reply #19 on: March 07, 2003, 12:36:12 AM »
Bang. :)

Offline Creamo

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« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2003, 09:28:39 AM »
Finally got it and ran it through about 3 hours LAN'd with 3 guys and another hour in single play quick missions. It's super stable and plays fine on my GF3 system, but I can't run the "Perfect" setting on the ground, it's too much. Otherwise it's almost as smooth as Il-2 and way better looking if that's possible. The feeling of flight and height is done terrific.

It will takes weeks if not months to fully enjoy all the new planes even in quick combat as the AI is way better and sometimes brutal. The P40, P47, and Hurricane are awesome, and then there's the Dora too. This is all before you get into the Dynamic Campaign.

They did some damage model update, so it's almost like killing in AH, but seems to depend on where you hit. It will takes hours of playing to get a full scope on that but it is way easier to kill, and get killed.

There is too many good things to list, just go buy it as soon as the stores can restock it. Ground strafing in a P-47 is unreal and worth the price right there.

Offline Wlfgng

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« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2003, 09:43:39 AM »
I got it, loaded it.. got immersed in it..


however.. I still have one complaint...
and it seems to have gotten worse since IL2

the damned muzzle/flame-thrower flares..
cripes, I couldn't even see my target when I pulled the damned trigger with a large cal gun... wtf

Oleg is a hollywood wannabe with his damned gun flares.
even in broad daylight.
what a joke.    that feature alone takes a fantastic sim and makes it feel arcadish.  too bad I (or someone else) can't figure out how to 'replace' that particular graphic feature

try flying the 262 and fire it's guns.. seems more like flame throwers or self-propelled howitzers

one more thing...
what's with a P39 catching a dora with wep engaged?

Offline Hawklore

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« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2003, 09:58:35 AM »
LOL, Thanks for the teaser guys, *sighs* Im gonna buy it no doubt, but the problem is, I could never get IL2 to run at its full graphic compontes very very smoothly, Well, FB is a risk to be taken, I bid thee fare well useful computer, if thy does not turn out as I wish...








LOL! It better:mad:
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Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2003, 10:09:53 AM »
Oleg insists the muzzle flashes are modelled accurately- it's amazing no one on his beta team showed him otherwise. I've seen footage of Il2s, and the muzzle flashes for those cannons are correct. The .303s are entirely too long for the Il2, and all MGs for the Russian side are entirely too long except for the short stocked MGs (in the earlier planes)..

However, for the German side, American and British planes- it is completely diddlyed up.

It beats me how NO one on his beta team pointed it out to him, especially considering I know a couple of them on the beta team that would sit here at AH for hours on end discussing the how the Dora9's guns are off to the left a little, or how the Mausers are improperly modelled...

But whatever, I digress.

As for the P39 catching a D9... which model of the D9 were you in and what model was the P39? What altitude and was the P39 AI or was the D9 AI?

The '44 D9 doesn't have MW50, while the 45 one does... or maybe vice versa, I forget.

The AI seems to have taken a page from the "Online weenies combat book", popping flaps the instant you get on their sixes in planes at speeds that would of otherwise ripped them clean off.

Don't understand why there is still no flap limitations until you get into the absurdly rediculous realm (300+ MPH, only plane I know that can do that is the P51 using it's "combat flaps").
-SW

Offline Creamo

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« Reply #24 on: March 07, 2003, 10:13:08 AM »
I'm not really sure on the muzzle flash effects either. Oleg is a stubborn bastard and explained it in a link I found but have since lost. He seemed adament that it was correct, but it sure seems as pronounced at noon as midnight. I'd given up on wondering what was 'realistic' as that was one of my very few complaints, and it's not a show stopper. I sure hope it isn't due to 'hollywood', as you must have seen the same History Channel, or TLC episode where they load massive amounts of gunpowder in the blanks for movie effects. Like I said, I don't like it, but can't claim it's wrong either. I do know a 12 guage near dusk looks like someone let off a flash pot, I think a 50 cal on a machine gun might spew some serious fire, but at noon?

My other big complaint is the views looking back, and I think the view system, unlike most AH players commenting on Il-2,  is very well done. The mouse look is great, the TrackIR support better, but the look back doesn't take simple leaning into account. Still, again, no show stopper and a good middle ground to AH looking outside of the plane. Each is good for one reason or another and shouldn't kill your enjoyment.

In my limited play in FB, the AI Hurricanes seemed to stick on my LA7 way too well, but like a newbie calling 'cheat' online in AH, I just may not have had enough time in a new game to judge E and angles in that particular situation.

Time will tell, and for the record, the only constant complaints here on IL-2 and soon FB is interpretations of what works best translating a WWII combat sim onto a computer and 2D monitor, the views mostly. Considering all the other aspects of IL-2FB that just blow you away like a goodrun in AH online can provide, it's a sure buy and distraction.

When other complaints of FB by people that spend at least 1% of their AH time in FB show a trend, I'll be convinced to look at those points.

Still, FB has so many good points and "wow" moments, where it would take too much time to list them all, you should look over the few that you don't like, although being able to change them would be a sweet bonus. 'Gun Muzzle Flash = 0', save Notepad comes to mind.

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #25 on: March 07, 2003, 10:44:19 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Creamo
When other complaints of FB by people that spend at least 1% of their AH time in FB show a trend, I'll be convinced to look at those points.
 


If you're talking about me, I play way more Il2, and now FB, than I have AH the past 7 months.
-SW

Offline Wlfgng

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« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2003, 10:58:10 AM »
lol.. same here Seawulf.. I'm getting addicted.

It's more immersive
more 'cool' planes to fly and shoot down
awesome ground attacks and ground units
obviously the best graphics
engine management rocks
it seems that the damage model is much improved over IL2
atmospheric conditions, lightning - rainy messy crappy days
smoke and dust effects
etc etc

The most difficult thing to get used to , coming over from AH, is the limitation of views.  I think the limited head angles are accurate but I don't think the view system takes into account the "eyeball" factor.. I.E. the fact that my eyes swivel past the point of where my head swivels.
but like Swulfe, I agree that this is a minor point and one that most people can adjust to.  
The bottom line is, that like most online sims, the same limitations/capabilites exist for all pilots.. so it's a fair playing field.

oh.. for the record.  Our coast guard cutter had a 20mm cannon on it for 'boarding' parties.. it did NOT throw flame like IL2 does in broad daylight.. nightime, yes.. incredibly so.. but you couldn't see much of a muzzle flash during the day.
Kinda like a 45 automatic but to a much larger degree.
The only tell tale during the day was the huge ammount of smoke that spewed from the barrel.
(too bad we only got to fire it twice though)

Offline Creamo

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« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2003, 11:16:03 AM »
Not pointing at you SW, just saying that in AH BBS discussions on IL-2, unlike say Simhq.com, most guys are so used to AH that any posts regarding it are completely from the hip limited 1st impressions without any real time in IL-2 considering. I was the most guilty party to this a year ago, until like you, I spend 90% of my flightsim time in Il-2 lately. Everytime I play AH I love it, but it's almost apples and oranges. The simulation of Il-2 rivals the gameplay of AH is all.

I haven't even enabled realistic engines yet, but as that really interests me, it's just another great addition to FB that will consume more time and fun digging into. I'm still just going 'wow' on the P-47 aircraft including exhaust graphics, ground attack hit sprites and complete destruction that beast can unleash. Plus the P40 in FB is so sweet.

There are things I don't like, but there are so many I like it's impossible to post, so again, I just say 'buy it' to the AH crowd, and experience them yourselves.

There's plenty of time for both, as each has it's merits.

Offline Wlfgng

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« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2003, 11:47:55 AM »
oh.. almost forgot..
the Dora I was flying was the one with mw50 (not sure which year that one is) and the P39 had turned (hopefull with a little E loss).. we were about 3k and flat.. he was catching me...

Quote
There's plenty of time for both

damnit Creamo.. I wish!
« Last Edit: March 07, 2003, 11:51:33 AM by Wlfgng »

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2003, 11:51:46 AM »
Ah, okay.

Here's my brief take (as I said I would) on FB (and it's improvements over Il2) that I have noticed/messed around with since I bought the game (wednsday).
Keep in mind I've only invested maybe 3-4 hours on it so far.

Landing Lights/Navigation Lights- Something new, and interesting. It'll do wonders for online wars that have night missions, and also allows for something else to do if you get bored of combat (practicing night landings/navigation/formation flying). The AI will fly around with navigation lights while they are in, I'll call it, navigation mode. If you get too far behind them and can no longer make out their plane, you still see a slight glint of green/red off in the distance, so you can still locate your flight. The AI will also turn off the navigation lights when it goes into 'combat mode' and will leave them off. I did notice one glitch- once when attacking Pe8s, my AI wingman in a B-239 briefly turn on his lights while still right behind the Pe8. Dunno the cause of it.

The landing light is only on some planes, but is pictured above Russian's post. It also illuminates a small area in front of your plane and looks very similiar to how a real world flashlight would look on the ground... but not a flood light. It gets bigger and smaller, further out or closer in, bright or dimmer as you increase alt or get closer to the ground.

Spotter lights(?) are a very well done addition. They create beams in the skys and also illuminate the area around them on the ground (can also blind YOU if you look into them). They will track the targets to the best of their abilities, but every once and a while they lose lock and start scanning the skies for them- in the same area they lost track of the target. They also only illuminate the side of the plane facing the beam, and if you fly through the beam you can be lit up. Unfortunately the light shines through the bottom of the cockpit and reflects off your canopy, blinding you. They will also illuminate any clouds they pass through.

New planes- too many to list or go through, you can find the list on the Il2sturmovik.com website.. but I will say it's the most impressive list I've seen for any game with them all done in such great detail.

Campaign system is really good and done very well. Only two complaints- you can't choose the type of plane you fly in operations (or maybe you can, by editing the campaign ini files), nor will you be assigned different types of planes during the individual operations. Operations are ~30 missions long, and a full campaign can consist of 6-7 operations.

New maps- Very nicely done, great terrain, but one problem- on my machine (specs at bottom) flying over the city of Leningrad and zooming in on it caused a significant delay as textures transferred to, I assume, my video card from system memory. This caused problems later on in the mission as those building textures had to be unloaded from memory to afford room for each plane's damage textures. So for the first part of the fight, I was getting pauses any time a plane got damaged... but that went away after about 6 minutes. I didn't zoom in on Leningrad when I returned to base, and I didn't have any more problems. Also, going to external enemy view on the big maps is a bad idea. There's a pretty long pause as it loads the enemy side of the map into video memory, but after that you can switch between friendly and enemy external views pause free. It doesn't appear to degrade system performance in any way, except over areas with lots of different textures (cities on the new maps).

Damage model- much improved, it's a lot easier to down planes and damage critical parts. It's also easier to damage engines from side/rear angle shots, and planes catch fire more readily now than before.

Flight model- much improved at all alts, planes acceleration at low speed appears to have been tweaked. Planes also lift off into the air much more like AH than they did in Il2. As in they are actually catching more ground effect and generating more lift, before many of the planes took a lot of struggling to get into the air and keep it there (fully loaded Il2 for example).

Engine management- I haven't destroyed, damaged or otherwise hurt my engine by misusing it... and I did a lot of that as I tried to figure out how to operate some of the new planes. I can't really tell much of a difference in power output, but as the months wear on- I'm sure more testing will reveal optimum values for each plane, it's just too early to tell right now.

Negative G cut out, was rumored for Il2 v1.2 patch... but it either didn't make it, or didn't work. But it's in FB, and is very well done. No instant cut outs- but the engine will sputter, lose power and eventually die if you keep negative Gs on planes with gravity fed carberators.

Atmosphere, clouds, and terrain are all improved. The sunrise/dawn, sunset/dusk atmospheric colors and lighting effects have been vastly improved to make them much more believable and look fantastic. Something that Il2 really didn't do too well, but now it just has to be seen to be believed. The fogging in the valleys is also far superior to Il2. There are now more clouds than before, but they don't seem to hit the framerate any worse and they appear to me to interact with the game lighting better. The terrain distance has been pushed out much further, and now 20,000ft looks like 20,000ft instead of 60,000ft.

And that's all I have to say about that.

Forgotten Battles should definitely be on your list of games to buy if you really enjoy WWII aviation.
EDIT: Forgot system specs..
AMD Athlon XP 2000+ (233Mhz FSB)
768MB PC133
Epox 8kta3Pro+ mobo
PNY GeForce 4 Ti4200 (300core/545mem 41.09 drivers)
SB Live!
Windows 98
Running FB at 1152x864x32bit in OpenGL using Highest detail settings for Il2, except "Perfect" for landscape (which is the pixel shader setting)
-SW
PS: This plane in this paint scheme is my favorite:
« Last Edit: March 07, 2003, 12:09:25 PM by AKS\/\/ulfe »