Suggestion on Views..

[Kweassa]

I've been thinking of this for some time now.. I think it'd help quite a bit if we can get TWO 12 views and TWO 6 views.

 What I mean by this, is that currently, we can get the 'default' look front view with the hat key in neutral position, and program an alternate view to use, by pressing the hat key forward.

 How about if we get to program one view that comes out from the use of hat keys in "left forward -> forward" configuration, and another view in "right forward -> forward" configuration, so we have two 'forward views' to program and use?

 It is hard to explain with just words.. so I took a pic to explain what I mean:

[Kweassa]

Much in a simular manner, I suggest two 6 views. Some people have pointed out that the 6view of AH planes are too lenient, and I do tend to agree with them. It has become relatively more strict in recent planes(such as the F4F-4 or the FM-2), but in older ones you can adjust head position up to a point that you get a 6 view as if the pilot is sitting in the cockpit backwards

 So... I suggest very strictly limit the 6 views.. almost no forward/backward head movement possible.. but limiting it in the "IL-2" fashion, without any 6 views, is pushing it too much.

 So..  to compensate for it, give us two programmable 6 views as suggested by the pic above, which would differently come out with different hat key movements.

 ...

 Flame away~!

 

[SKurj]

I have been having thoughts along the same lines.  The 6 view especially.  As it is now we can choose to look over the one shoulder for the 6, it would be nice to have the option to quickly check the other shoulder as well.

It might be a simple change for the forward view as we already have 2 forward views, the KP8 and the hat in neutral.  perhaps KP8 with KP9 could give fwd fwd right, and fwd fwd left as in Kweassa's screenshots.  Dunno what could be done for 6...


Skurj

[ergRTC]

I would be careful here.  I like your forward view idea, but i dont think limiting the 6 view is a good idea.  As htc has stated before, the little monitor in front of us already makes looking around difficult.  Making it any more so is not any more realistic, just more difficult.  If I thought there was a 190 on my tail, I woulda been crawling all over that cockpit trying to get a view.

[Kweassa]

... and that's exactly what my suggestion would have you do , instead of the one-touch panoramic wide-vision 6 view we have currently.

 At first, I really didn't like the restrictive IL-2 6 view system. I still don't like the fact that you have no 6 view at all(!). But the one thing I did like, is having to keep switching your views into the correct direction as scissors maneuver goes on..

 "Look over left shoulder, switch directions, look over right.. oops! He ain't there!! Where'd he go!!?? (* panic in progress *)" Of course, this is impossible with AH 6 view, since the "panoramic width" of the 'LindaBlair-View' makes it far too easy to track the enemy on your six.

 So, bascially, my suggestion is that allow 6 views like currently in AH, but divide them into "left half" and "right half". You can see only one of them per time!

[ergRTC]

you dont think we have this now?  I tend to fly 'new' planes in the CT, like the f4f, hurricane1 spit 1 and p40s.  They are, like mentioned earlier, more restricted.  Planes like the zero and p51 should not have restricted views though.  Which is the way the game is now.  

Peripheral vision is sooooo hard to recreate.  


I just have nightmares of aces high going to that 'blind man in traction' view system in wwiionline.

[Kweassa]

erg, the restrictions are due to 1) human limitations and 2) structural limitations.

 In the case of the "new" planes of AH, 2) is represented, but 1) is not. In the case of the "old" planes, 1) and 2) are not both present(look at the Bf109G-10 for instance.. true, that the Galland Hood helped better the visibility..but it's too good. With head positions maxed out, you virtually get a one-look panoramic six view which covers 5 to 7o'c position in one touch!).

 In the case of WWIIOL, or IL-2, there are restrictions to both 1) and 2), but both excessive.

 What I am picturing is restrictions on both 1) and 2), but not as excessive as IL-2 or WW2OL. As you can see in the posted picture of the P-40B cockpit, that's the 'reasonable' level I figure. You will notice it is possible to check your six, but you will have to do that separately for the left half of your six, and the right half.

 In the case of the P-40 in IL-2:FB, you get only about half of the  visibility shown here in the pic. You have no 6 view at all, and it only a very very narrow 'glimpse' is possible by viewing your 5 and 7 oc - this, is not the case I'm suggesting.

[ergRTC]

I dont know man, I am still worried that it will make it more difficult and restricted than real life.  You know what would really cure this debate?  Somebody needs to let me into there old warhawk, so I can get a look around!  

One view that worries me is the up and six.  Which is crutial, and if your head is locked to that position you have in your pictures, up and six will not be much use.  You need to have more freedom to move foward (i know how cheesey the putting your bellybutton on the dashboard rear view is now though).

[Midnight]

Currently, you can have at least 5 direct foward veiws saved.

1. Home position
2. KP8 (I set this as face pressed up to the site glass)
3. KP8 + KP1 (I set this with head as far up, left and forward as possible. Simulates looking high left over the nose)
4. KP8 + KP2 (I set this with head as far up and forward as possible. Simulates leaning forward in the seat to look over the nose)
5. KP8 + KP3 (I set this with head as far up, right and forward as possible. Simulates looking high right over the nose)

For each one, you can move your head to a different position and save it. There may be more, but I haven't seen a need to have more than the 5 I use already.

As for 6 view, well... just the one I guess.

[addy]

I am all for limiting the Feild of vision on 6 view IF you can give me my rearview mirrors!!!!

[ergRTC]

I have heard (from stories by spit pilots i cant remember where) that those 6 mirrors were useless.  Something like, by the time you see a plane in it you are dead.

The way I do views is pretty slick,

I have a four way hat (2 actually) on my throttle.  I have the one set for trim the other is 5 forward 6 right 2 back 4 left.

Then the 8 way on my stick is set to normal pov hat setup, with the forward look as a partial up.  

By using both of these together I can get every view possible except the 'looking for the wiskey bottle views'.

All of my f10s are about as unrealistic as you can get.  bellybutton on the dashboard, in bombers I jump to the copilots seat.  Up views I am laying on the floor of the cockpit and so on.

[addy]

The six mirrors my be useless for checking your 6, BUT they would be great if you where defensive with a boogie already there. You would have your overshoulder views left and right and your mirror for the dead zone right behind you. Then you could have 3 six views with more field of vision directly behind. ( the mirrors obviously cant see hi and low six)

[Tilt]

Originally posted by Kweassa
I've been thinking of this for some time now.. I think it'd help quite a bit if we can get [

Seems to me this could be done with a std "right of" and "left of" view toggle........

We use the hat to set the centre view then a toggle to adjust left and right of it by a fixed movement.  We can pan with the arrow keys now but another hat (on the left hand) could be used to step the head a few inches left and right to cater for frames etc. The actual step (left or right) could be saved to F10 and could be small for the 12 (sufficient to keep the sight in the glass) and larger for the 6 view (to look round the rear bulk head and tail)

On my Hotas i use a throttle hat for up and down .......it would be neat if that same hat also canted stuff a little right or left of the existing view without flicking me into the other quarter view.

[ergRTC]

can you set your hat right and left to the arrow keys right and left?  That should do it shouldnt it?  Mine will do that but it is a sfs throttle (the best built dammit!).

[hazed-]

I dont agree here at all.

you could argue that the veiw system you want is the same as the one for IL2.That has a more realistic limit on your veiws.

The problem is thats the whole reason i dont play it.I loved everything about IL2 apart from the veiw system and the lack of an auto level or auto climb.

Im just not prepared to spend all my time adjusting this or that just to perform a mundane task. as for limiting the veiw angle being realistic I suggest you do a test in your chair now.

sit facing forward and dont move your shoulders. Look as far back as you can and pick an object on the edge of where you can see. then spin your head the other way and you will see that same object is now withing your veiw. thats 360 degrees of vision without even moving your shoulders! notice how much of the whole area you are able to veiw simultaniously. Compare that to the 17"'s in front of you with the paultry 8 veiws.

The only thing which should limit the rear veiw is how close the canopy is to your head and something we dont model in AH which is distortions and reflections on the canopy which would make veiwing through them at certain angles difficult in real life.

If they change the system of veiwing I really do feel id stop playing AH. Its the first simulator to hold my nterest for longer than a few weeks!. It must have something right.I think the veiw system is a huge factor in AH's success over all this time.Ive seen prettier, faster, possibly more accurate flight sims, I just havent found BETTER