Author Topic: Situation in Chechnya (Read 752 times)

Martlet · « **on:** April 01, 2003, 11:19:31 AM »

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While Russia has described its actions in Chechnya as a tightly focused counter-terrorism operation, it has produced vast civilian casualties. The first phase of the conflict involved the bombing and shelling of dozens of towns and villages to dislodge Chechen fighters. Research by Human Rights Watch and other organizations showed the shelling and aerial bombardment by Russian forces to be highly indiscriminate and disproportionate, causing about 3,000 civilian casualties. Between December 1999 and February 2000, Russian forces committed massacres after taking control of three villages, killing at least 130 people. During this period they also rounded up thousands of people, mostly males whom they called "potential terrorists," took them to detention centers, and tortured them to compel confessions or testimony.

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This cycle of abuse, well established before September 11, continues to this day. Hundreds of people have "disappeared" since that date after being taken into Russian custody. Increasingly, Russian forces conduct targeted night operations, in which masked troops raid particular homes, execute targeted individuals, or take them away, never to be seen again. In December 2002, Human Rights Watch documented nine extrajudicial executions and seventeen forced disappearances by Russian forces, most of which had taken place in the two months following a mass hostage taking in Moscow by armed Chechens. Among these cases was the November 29 killing of Malika Umazheva, who had previously been dismissed from her post as village administrator, had been an outspoken critic of Russian abuses, and a trusted source of information on abuses for human rights organizations. Masked Russian troops shot her at point-blank range during a night raid of her home. Among the many individuals who have "disappeared" is Issa Abumuslimov, a fifty-two-year-old engineer, whom Russian forces detained in a December 11 night raid of his home.

http://hrw.org/editorials/2003/chechnya030103.htm

We can all find propaganda to make the other side look bad.

Boroda · « **Reply #1 on:** April 01, 2003, 11:27:26 AM »

Martlet, "Human rights watch" is no more then a bunch of looneys supporting terrorists.

On March, 23, there was a referendum in Chechnya, with international inspectors and all things, to vote for a constituion. So now Chechnya has a Constitution. Not Shariat law.

Another wave of withdrawing troops from Chechnya started in February. Block-posts are being removed in Grozniy and other towns.

Putin promised an amnesty for terrorists who are not accused in crimes against humanity.

Everything is quiet. I hope that Arabs we were fighting for last two years already went to fight in Iraq, nothing to catch here.

The last thing to do is to catch Basayev. Or better simply kill him. With bayonet. Like a pig.

Martlet · « **Reply #2 on:** April 01, 2003, 11:31:07 AM »

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Originally posted by Boroda
Martlet, "Human rights watch" is no more then a bunch of looneys supporting terrorists.

My point was that if you can find a trash rag point out all the horrible things that happens to/in/because of the US, I can find the same.

For every trash quote from a propaganda rag you post, I can find one too.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/1433802.stm

Boroda · « **Reply #3 on:** April 01, 2003, 12:16:46 PM »

Martlet, I think HRW bastards are my personal enemies. Remember their reaction on Nord-Ost hostages terrorist act.

Say whatever you want about Chechnya, Russians fight there to protect their land. Intervents in Iraq now faced same problems, and from what I saw on Euronews - they behave even worse then Russians on "zachistka".

N1kPaz · « **Reply #4 on:** April 01, 2003, 12:27:22 PM »

I think Russia has every right to do what it takes to protect their country. I am not a big fan of their position on the War with Iraq, but I am very supportive of their efforts to deal with those scumball terrorist bastards in Chechnya. Roll the t-90's in and mop em up!

Martlet · « **Reply #5 on:** April 01, 2003, 12:29:48 PM »

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Originally posted by N1kPaz
I think Russia has every right to do what it takes to protect their country. I am not a big fan of their position on the War with Iraq, but I am very supportive of their efforts to deal with those scumball terrorist bastards in Chechnya. Roll the t-90's in and mop em up!

AHHHH, so it's ok to wipe out civilians as long as they're YOUR civilians. I get it now.

Sixpence · « **Reply #6 on:** April 01, 2003, 12:51:56 PM »

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Originally posted by N1kPaz
I think Russia has every right to do what it takes to protect their country. I am not a big fan of their position on the War with Iraq, but I am very supportive of their efforts to deal with those scumball terrorist bastards in Chechnya. Roll the t-90's in and mop em up!

I have to agree to a point. If Nebraska wanted to be it's own country it would never happen.

Chechnya is russian territory and they should secure it, and the sooner the better. Chechen warlords are saddam but ten times worse.

P.S. Think of them as bin laden, you can back them one minute, the next minute they take down a skyscraper.(or 2)

Martlet · « **Reply #7 on:** April 01, 2003, 12:55:59 PM »

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Originally posted by Sixpence
I have to agree to a point. If Nebraska wanted to be it's own country it would never happen.

Chechnya is russian territory and they should secure it, and the sooner the better. Chechen warlords are saddam but ten times worse.

P.S. Think of them as bin laden, you can back them one minute, the next minute they take down a skyscraper.(or 2)

Chechnya has been trying to gain it's independence for almost 100 years. Understandable during the USSR existence, but after it's fall, why not be allowed to go it's own way, like so many other areas?

Sixpence · « **Reply #8 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:02:09 PM »

Texas tried for independence too. If America falters, should they go their own way?

Martlet · « **Reply #9 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:03:40 PM »

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Originally posted by Sixpence
Texas tried for independence too. If America falters, should they go their own way?

Ask me again when the USA breaks up.

miko2d · « **Reply #10 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:06:49 PM »

Sixpence: If Nebraska wanted to be it's own country it would never happen.

Don't give away our little secret. The Constitution still formally reserves to The States the rights not specifically reserved for the federal government - including the right to seccede. Wink, wink.

Chechnya is russian territory and they should secure it, and the sooner the better. Chechen warlords are saddam but ten times worse.

In fact, we should help russians subjugate the Finland which was a part of Russian Empire - however bad Saddam was, he did not come up with a swastika design like those finns. And the Poland - don't forget them too, back to Russia. And Ukraine never even had it's own state - back to Russia it goes as well.

And join Hungary back to Austria too.

miko

Sixpence · « **Reply #11 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:09:18 PM »

That is not the point sir. And I hope the russians take care of business there. The chechen warlords make bin laden and saddam look like altar boys.

Miko, you beat my reply to martlet

miko2d · « **Reply #12 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:20:44 PM »

mar.. who?

Martlet · « **Reply #13 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:24:14 PM »

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Originally posted by Sixpence
That is not the point sir. And I hope the russians take care of business there. The chechen warlords make bin laden and saddam look like altar boys.

Miko, you beat my reply to martlet

Noone said the chechen's were any better. The point was that for all the preaching about our actions in Iraq that the Russian contingency was doing, they were committing attrocities in Chechnya.

Sixpence · « **Reply #14 on:** April 01, 2003, 01:27:12 PM »

Agreed, understanding is a two way street.