The Iraq-Al Queda connection

[miko2d]

Hortlund: And what exactly was "the honourable thing" France did 50 years ago? I mean after all not only did they surrender, they also fought on the German side.

 They? The country that stood up  for Poland was defeated and it's government removed. So I gues "they" were not the same people as the other "they".

[straffo]

Originally posted by Hortlund
And what exactly was "the honourable thing" France did 50 years ago? I mean after all not only did they surrender, they also fought on the German side. Where is the honour in that?

We fought , we lost , we have done something (more than you can say).

After the defeat some french were still fighting the Nazi ,some french were collaborating with the Nazi  ,no swedish did ever fight the Nazi  and some were colaborating.

French fought the Nazi more than one time it's a lot more than ZERO don't you think ?

[NUKE]

Originally posted by straffo
We fought , we lost , we have done something (more than you can say).

After the defeat some french were still fighting the Nazi ,some french were collaborating with the Nazi  ,no swedish did ever fight the Nazi  and some were colaborating.

French fought the Nazi more than one time it's a lot more than ZERO don't you think ?

France did nothing to stop Germany when it could and should have. This attitude doomed France and this attitude seems the same today.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by straffo
We fought , we lost , we have done something (more than you can say).

After the defeat some french were still fighting the Nazi ,some french were collaborating with the Nazi  ,no swedish did ever fight the Nazi  and some were colaborating.

French fought the Nazi more than one time it's a lot more than ZERO don't you think ?

There were Swedes fighting for the allies straffo. You are only displaying your ignorance when you say what you did. Many many died on merchants on the convoy routes. Some fought in the British army, some fought in the US army.

And the correct sequence of events would be:
You "fought", you lost, then you "fought" on the German side, then you lost again.

After the defeat some frenchmen did fight the Germans sure...but there were thousands who joined the German army and fought for them. There were hundreds of thousands of french workers who worked for the Germans. But I dont have to tell you all this, you already know it.

[straffo]

And the super-power who pretend now having won WWI didn't move either.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by miko2d

 They? The country that stood up  for Poland was defeated and it's government removed. So I gues "they" were not the same people as the other "they".

wow, this discussion sure took a philosophical turn...

Ok, so who are "they" then? And what criteria should we use when we categorize all french guys into either one of those categories?

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by straffo
And the super-power who pretend now having won WWI didn't move either.

Yeah, because Germany 1936 was defintively a US problem and a US responsibility mr Versaille treaty.

[NUKE]

Originally posted by straffo
And the super-power who pretend now having won WWI didn't move either.

France can't own up to it's responsibilities, just like in the past.

Germany borders France, yet America had to come over and save France after France hand-wringed while Germany ( bordering France) Illegally and openly re-armed after wwI

France can't take care of itself, let alone anyone else.

[-dead-]

Originally posted by Hortlund
Just because an area is "kurdish" on a map over ethniticity, it doesnt mean it is controlled by kurds.

I'd agree with you if only the area on the map was marked "Kurdish". But it isn't. It's marked Controlled By Kurds[/i]. Call me gullible, but that suggests to me that it does mean that the area in question is controlled by the Kurds.

If you look at the map posted in this thread, the area marked as Kurdish was definitively NOT kurdish controlled before the invasion.

The big map with the area marked "Kurdish controlled area" was culled from this article on CNN dated thusly: August 14, 2002 Posted: 11:21 AM EDT (1521 GMT). Before the invasion, I think you'll find.

To steal a phrase: "Is it just me or is it becoming really pointless to try to talk to these people...?"

[straffo]

Originally posted by NUKE
France can't own up to it's responsibilities, just like in the past.

Germany borders France, yet America had to come over and save France after France hand-wringed while Germany ( bordering France) Illegally and openly re-armed after wwI

France can't take care of itself, let alone anyone else.

Mister know it all  what were the country asking france to evacuate the Sarre ?

[straffo]

Now as I don't want to start again a BBS fight with mister I was pretending to be a judge Hortlund.


I'm still waiting your clever demonstration .

[NUKE]

Originally posted by straffo
Mister know it all  what were the country asking france to evacuate the Sarre ?

Are you saying that France defers it's national interests to another nation?

France borders Germany, yet you state that America didn't move against them?

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by -dead-
I'd agree with you if only the area on the map was marked "Kurdish". But it isn't. It's marked Controlled By Kurds[/i]. Call me gullible, but that suggests to me that it does mean that the area in question is controlled by the Kurds.
 The big map with the area marked "Kurdish controlled area" was culled from this article on CNN dated thusly: August 14, 2002 Posted: 11:21 AM EDT (1521 GMT). Before the invasion, I think you'll find.

To steal a phrase: "Is it just me or is it becoming really pointless to try to talk to these people...?"

On the map, is Kirkuk and Irbil marked as Kurdish controlled? Are Kirkuk and Irbil Kurdish controlled? But I see what you mean ...If you cant trust maps made by CNN, who can you trust eh?

But yes, it is pointless to talk to people like you and straffo.

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by Ripsnort
Some crow served up fresh for some of you, but I'm sure its just all propoganda
http://www.msnbc.com/news/895185.asp?cp1=1

I'm sure it is quite factual...there is only one problem, as others have pointed out that area is not under Saddam's control.  

The area where the lab was found is under the control of the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan (PUK).  This is a group that is "friendly" with the US along with the Kurdistan Democratic Party (shi'ite...they got Democrats there to ).  The KDP controls the Kurdistan Regional Government (KRG) in the very northern two governances of Iraq.  The PUK controls Suleimaniyah Governance, where the lab was located.

However...it appears that this enclave of Al Ansar is not controlled by anyone but perhaps UBL.  The Iranian government does not like them and tipped off Dutch authorities to the whereabouts of the Ansar leader, Mullah Krekar, leading to his arrest in The Netherlands.  Saddam does not like them because they are Al Qaeda backed and UBL has explicitly stated that Muslims should depose his secular government.

But the PUK doesn't like them either...Ansar is blamed for an assassination attempt on the leader of the PUK last year.  Evidently, these extreme Wahabbi'ists don't want the PUK or KDP in power as they think they would create a secular government for Kurdistan.

Given this last case...if the US had said to the PUK, we would like to come in and take care of that Ansar problem for you, they would have been more than happy to be host to a few US Special Forces.  And we have known about those Ansar camps and their link to UBL since before 9/11.  More than that, we knew that these Ansar guys may have been the ones that were testing gas on animals (recall the video of the gassed dog).

[straffo]

I'm pretending that to preserve their interests in this region of Germany Two speaking English (one across the channel, one across the atlantic) country asked france to evacuate the Sarre.

And just after a strange party leaded by a almost as strange Autrichian started to grow  ...




Ps : Should I recall  that the Sarre was part of France before the 1870 war and what was the amount of the reparation France had to pay in 1871 ?
And that Wilson didn't want the France to get his own territory back ?

I guess that will be an insult to your historical knowledge.