Author Topic: To fly with honour ...  (Read 333 times)

Yosus

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To fly with honour ...
« on: July 30, 2000, 09:20:00 PM »
Recently, I heard an exchange between a cultural compatriot, and a squad member of mine which appeared to me to be based upon ignorance, and could be construed as a lack of respect towards my squad mate. I will not name names, but it shamed me, and I developed a strong desire to convey to my squad mate (from a different culture) to let him know that I at the very least respected his online abilities and persona. While "flying with honour" was not the voiced issue, the person in question did not "honour" my squad mate by his comments and method of delivery. Therefore, in my opinion, the individual concerned was not "flying with honour". For what its worth, this is the result of my introspection.

Quite often, I hear references to "flying with honour" while flying in the Main Arena of Aces High, usually within the context of disapproval by one party over the actions of another. I began to think about the phrase, and it interests me enough to investigate further. What are the real implications of flying with honour, what is the loaded sentiment behind such a statement? How exactly does one fly with honour in a virtual world? How much of our conduct and expectations of reciprocal treatment do we take for granted in the cyber-space of Aces High, or with any other online experience for that matter. In other words, what assumptions do we make as representatives of our own cultures, of the behavioural norm of other on-line inhabitants? With the popularity of timely global communication (the Internet), every culture with access to the Internet is now able to scrutinise the values of its neighbours, while being scrutinised themselves. Of course the degree to which this happens is restricted by the medium.

My copy of the "Australian Oxford Dictionary" defines honour as :
1/.   High respect, glory, credit, reputation, good name, nobleness of mind.
2/.   Allegiance to what is right or to conventional standard of conduct.

To my mind, number one of the definition relies entirely on what is agreed to with regards to number two, an allegiance to what is right or to a conventional standard of conduct. What we agree to as individuals, is shaped largely by the perceptions and values inherent within the social structures we live, which we then assimilate and mould to suit our characters over the period of our lives.  Convention within a social group, or a social perception of how to deal with something, is shaped by the combined experience of that social group over a period of time. Typically, they will learn through experience (which now includes the Internet experience), that some actions and attitudes are necessary to maintain the harmonisation and strengthening of their social group, with the implied notion of survival for that group. For a rather simplistic example, a social group who is fighting for its temporal existence, surrounded by hostile (or anti-social) groups, might conceivably prize and develop those attitudes where the military arts are viewed as a premium skill, which in turn colours and directs social behaviour.

Now within the context of Aces High, we effectively have a melee of many cultures, involved in a representation of what is arguably one of the most emotionally laden practices we are capable of as the human animal. Killing someone (in a virtual context to be sure) and ensuring the survival of our group. Here we encounter a phenomenon where "our group" is an artificial construct brought about by restrictions of game design, and we make a decision to join Bishops, Rooks or Knights. Within these three, we encounter another possibly parallel grouping of Allied vs. Axis. It is perhaps understandable that people bring with them the baggage of real life historical cross-referencing, influenced by the perceptions and conventions of their particular culture, into the arena. Particularly as the game itself loosely draws on a chapter of arguably the bloodiest conflict the world has ever experienced.

While this might be a natural approach, it is not one which is conducive to long term harmony within the new and artificial (meaning that we choose to be part of, rather than are born into) community which is Aces High. Aces High allows a large amount of latitude in how we choose to play our game. The design supplies very few restrictions, allowing the players to construct their own game. If you have followed me this far, you might recognise that this feature lends itself to massively diverse interpretations on how the game should be played, and incidentally, how an individual should "fly with honour"!

We should ask ourselves the question. Are we here to validate the past? If so from which point of view? I hope that I have succeeded in promoting the idea that attempting to validate cultural attitudes of what is right and what is wrong based on the accepted history from our own backgrounds, is fraught with difficulty and not a little danger. Yet maybe unfortunately, our concepts of honour are for the most part influenced by these very same historical references  . This is not the arena where the past stands on trial. Hopefully we are here to communicate our interest in the techniques of air combat, and not in "weltanschauung". In fact, if we are sensitive to it, this experience could open a new vistas in our methods for more humane interaction with other groups of human beings ... face to face.

In my opinion, we should learn to view the past dispassionately when acting as a member of the Aces High culture. World War II is not here. Here we play in pantomime, it is not real except that it conveys an astonishingly impressive environment for us to play our parts convincingly. An important facet of this new culture, is that we have the opportunity to overcome some myopic views inculcated by our back-grounds, and open our psyches and be sensitive to the birthing pains of our own understanding, tolerance and respect for others.

This in my humble opinion, is what it truly means to "fly with honour".

Cheers
Yosus.


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Offline Ghosth

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2000, 10:13:00 PM »
Understanding, Tolerance, Respect, Consideration for others.

These are what it all boils down to. Without them we are savages, one step removed from the beasts.

Very well written post.


Offline Nash

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« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2000, 12:02:00 AM »
My God.. that is heady stuff... very thought provoking Yosus. I think though, that you can't get very far playing the past vs the present (aces high) in a discusion about honour. The goals are much different... and really.... isn't honour a discussion about the *way* in which goals are achieved?

I guess the best bet in applying the discusion of honour to Aces High is to bring all of this down to real world (aces high) examples.

For example, your countryman just flew into a hoard of bandits. Do you dive in there with him to help out? Or do you shake your head at your countryman's bad decision, and leave him for dead. Which is more 'honourable'?

or....

You're in the middle of a knife fight, and yer engine just konked out. You have perhaps one or two chances to put your nose on the bandit for a kill... two *iffy* chances... OR... you can dive out of harm's way and attempt to ditch. Which is more 'honourable'?

... This kind of thing.

To my way of thinking...  the application of the term 'honour' should end right there. It has nothing to do with the past.

I may be wading in deeper than I should... but lets look at a *past* example of 'honour' and that same application within' Aces High. Kamikaze was deemed an honourable tactic in WWII by the Japanese. In Aces High, loading up on 500's and rockets... grabbing to 25k then diving on the Knit's FH's would be considered just....dweebish.

I guess what I'm saying is that 'honour' cannot be without context. The context we're applying to honour now is Aces High. The examples of the past are of little use to us then. To me... my code of conduct is thus:

Do not make *any* expectations of how your opponent should fly. He does what he does, and you either counter it, or go home. To expect or demand otherwise is dishonourable.

Do unto others... this is self explanitory.

There's a lot more examples, no doubt. But I guess my point is that if you want to find honour in Aces High, you must look *within* Aces High. Applying templates of the past will not do.

(How can ya tell I'm bored? <g> )

Offline Hangtime

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« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2000, 12:07:00 AM »
What?? WHY YOU...

... considerate, kind hearted soul; please hold still while I flame yer plane and your psyche for MY national honor.  

Superb post.

Salute!

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Yosus

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2000, 01:54:00 AM »
Nash, it's not meant to be 'heady stuff'   .

To anyone else, in case you misunderstood me, I noticed some peoples action and reactions on Channel One (myself included), and took stock of how I was reacting on a personal level.

I am not lily white on this score, and have had cause to be ashamed of my own conduct, in real life and in virtual flying.

It doesn't mean that buffoonery shouldn't exist ... far from it. I'm a buffoon! But there is an obvious line that "we" know we're crossing when we cross it. This line might not be readiliy apparent to others, and still others might observe it earlier than some.

The prevailing observation is that some care and thought should go into how we communicate. Particularly as it isn't face to face, it becomes a matter of discipline and personal honour not to tarnish the dignity of our fellow men, in real life or in Aces High.

Personal honour is all about dignity, wherever it is found. It has little to do with how you react to a tactical problem, but how you act with fellow human beings.

In soiling the dignity of another, we soil ourselves and our humanity.

Ghosth said it all succinctly   .

Cheers
Yosus.

P.S. Thanks Hangtime  

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'One day, flight simulation will be so realistic, that you'll need to wear brown corduroy'
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[This message has been edited by Yosus (edited 07-31-2000).]

Offline Jekyll

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2000, 04:01:00 AM »
Wonderful post Yosus.

At the end of the day, no one will really remember who was the 'best' pilot in Aces High... who got the highest k/d ratio or best guns percentage etc.

The people who are respected in the community are those who fly 'with honour' .. who try to give a little bit more back into the sim than they take from it.

When faced with the 'dweebish' option - just think for a moment:  "Would I feel happy if my opponent did this to ME?" It tends to answer a lot of questions regarding things like chute-shooting, ackstarring etc.

Well said.. VERY well said  

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Offline Kieren

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2000, 10:04:00 AM »
Glad to see a such insight! Salute!  

funked

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« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2000, 10:34:00 AM »
"Kamikaze was deemed an honourable tactic in WWII by the Japanese. In Aces High, loading up on 500's and rockets... grabbing to 25k then diving on the Knit's FH's would be considered just....dweebish"

In my squad it's considered just... fun.

Offline Wanker

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« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2000, 10:44:00 AM »
Outstanding post, Yosus.

In my cynical opinion, honor has virtually no meaning in today's society. We've grown up in the "me" generation, where anything and everything goes, and the "Do unto others before they do unto you" mentality prevails.

And it makes me sad that this is what we've become.

Thus sayeth Ghosth:
 
Quote
Understanding, Tolerance, Respect, Consideration for others.

Talk about anything like that in today's AH arena or BBS, and you're instantly labeled as either "Sentimental, "Politically Correct" or just plain naive.

In today's world, all that matters is winning. Nobody seems to care "how you play the game" anymore.

Still, there are a few of us out there that care more about the friends we make while playing AH, than we do about how many times we've "won". It's these people that keep me paying my $29.99 every month.

The day that AH becomes populated with nothing but smack-talking, twitchy-fingered score freaks is the day that I cancel my account.



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Offline NineZ

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2000, 11:34:00 AM »
Great Post!  

JagdNine

Offline Ghosth

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« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2000, 04:04:00 PM »

Thus sayeth Ghosth:
 Talk about anything like that in today's AH arena or BBS, and you're instantly labeled as either "Sentimental, "Politically Correct" or just plain naive.

This is for all of those who would label me.
A Sentimental, about my pickup truck yes, anything else, ehhh, not likely.
B PC, Believe me if you'd ever had the chance to meet me I am NOT PC. (More like the opposite)
C Naive, no, more like innocent perhaps.
I know there are 99 dorkfish for ever kind considerate careing person in AH. I just prefer to give a damm about people. ALL people, includeing the dorkfish!

In today's world, all that matters is winning. Nobody seems to care "how you play the game" anymore.

Still, there are a few of us out there that care more about the friends we make while playing AH, than we do about how many times we've "won". It's these people that keep me paying my $29.99 every month.

The day that AH becomes populated with nothing but smack-talking, twitchy-fingered score freaks is the day that I cancel my account.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I like you too banana  

Fact is that it's the friends I've made that have kept me flying at all. Sure everyone gets hot streaks when flying rules. But, it's the friends that get ya through the slumps!

Offline milnko

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2000, 05:04:00 PM »
The old adage that "Famliarity breeds contempt" is unfortunatly quite true, oft times we get to know someone, and we lack to treat them with the same respect and politeness we would a perfect stranger.

I had a Supervisor tell me once, "That it is easy to impress the boss, but much, much harder to impress your co-workers"

The same applies here, if we examine a list of qualities in relation to those individuals  we are impressed with in this sim, I think we'd find that they are polite, concerned, and INVOLVED with the community.

I signed on around the 1st of the year, and while working thru my learning curve, I was welcomed by a few individuals that were quick to give me a Salute or Good Fight call, even if I got waxed miserably.
Since then I have "tried" to give a SALUTE or NICE SHOT message after every sortie, some may think I am being snide or condencending, but I believe that it doesn't cost a thing to give a compliment, and I know it bears a fortune back in good will.

I've always told my sons, that the world forgives alot if your just polite.

Good thread BTW!

 

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Offline Lizard3

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« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2000, 07:32:00 PM »
<Kerpunt>

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Offline pzvg

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« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2000, 10:23:00 PM »
Oh my, yes perhaps we are starting to emerge from the "growing pains" of this community,
Threads like this go a long way towards that goal of harmony.
banana, and all the other "nonPC" folks, don't worry about it, PC is, of course a label, like other less savory labels it is usually used by those who have run out of good arguements  
(being non PC, but very fair minded)
Honor? honor only relates to one's perception of one's self,national pride,family honor are mere extensions of the level of respect we accord our own ego.
I fight in the best way I can, and take my lumps when my best is not good enough, but my own honor is satisfied by my striving to do my best. For others, your mileage may vary  

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Offline Spatula

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To fly with honour ...
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2000, 11:09:00 PM »
Excellently written post yossus  

I guess my idea of "flying with honour" boils down to, do to others as you'd like them to do unto you. And try to remember that it is just a game  

Spat.

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