Spit XIV flight trials Vs. Tempest, Mustang III (P51D), FW-190D and 109G

[VO101_Isegrim]

Originally posted by Sancho
which 109G was it tested against and which 190?

The 109G in the test vs. the Spit14 was a Me 109G-6/U2/R-6/R-3/N ... in other words, a G-6 with 20mm gunpods, 300 liter droptank (droptank was prob. removed for tests, don`t know for the bombrack...), with taller tail unit with improved rudder controls, and electrical equipment for blindflying.

No MW-50 injection at all, and I believe they used 1.3ata limited boost for the tests, which gave 618 km/h max. speed only. On the top, the  gunpods were pretty bad for climb and manouverbility because of their weight. In brief, the worst config for the G-6 I can think of.

The 190A was a fighter-bomber A-4/U5?, the A-3 was out of service by that time. Boost limits are unknown, perhaps 1.3ata, as we speak of an A-4 and not an A-5 or A-8.

BTW, Eric Brown flew both planes.

[Furball]

Originally posted by VO101_Isegrim
The 109G in the test vs. the Spit14 was a Me 109G-6/U2/R-6/R-3/N

How do you know that?

__________________



418 'Hornet' Squadron RCAF

[VO101_Isegrim]

Originally posted by Furball
How do you know that?

__________________



418 'Hornet' Squadron RCAF

Hi! Check this out:



From:

http://www.fourthfightergroup.com/eagles/109gtacvspit14.html

I also have the report about when this plane was captured. It mislanded in the UK after a night sortie against RAF bombers, together with another 109, but that second one run out of the landing zone and crashed IIRC, and couldn`t be used in the tests.


The G-2 was also used for comparisions, but only against the Tempest, but by that time it was in very poor mechanical condition and soon become unservicable. Otherwise, yes, it`s the same "Black 6" as it`s known today. It was captured in late 1942 in North Africa, after it took some battle damage and was not repaired in time to be evacuated. Given that it was a pre-1943June plane, it is likely (that`s means 95%)  that it was limited to 1.3ata only, or for 1310HP for Takeoff.

The G-2:

http://www.luftwaffe-experten.co.uk/rn228.html




The G-6/U2...etc.  took it`s place, and was tested vs. Spit14, Spit9LF, Mustang III. etc. That plane too met a premature end when it crashed in November 1944:

The G-6:

http://www.luftwaffe-experten.co.uk/tp814.html

[MiloMorai]

Here are the Air ministry Numbers for captured German a/c

Allocations made at place of surrender (AM 1 to AM 123 inclusive)

am.no/type/w.nr/code & unit/fate

AM 1 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622983 - coded 4R+RB of NJG2 - scrapped?

AM 2 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.620560 - coded 4R+CB of NJG2 - struck off charge April 1946

AM 3 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622838 - coded 3C+AN of II./NJG4 - scrapped?

AM 4 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.322127 - coded BU+PP - unknown unit - fate unrecorded

AM 5 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.321523 - unknown unit - scrapped at Miles Aircraft factory in 1948

AM 6 - Junkers Ju290A-1 - W.Nr.110186 - coded A3+OB of III./KG200 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 7 - Dornier Do217M-9 - W.Nr.0040 - factory coded KF+JN - prototype - not flown to the UK, fate unknown

AM 8 - Junkers Ju352A-0 - W.Nr.100010 - coded KT+VJ of unknown unit - also coded VP550, scrapped December 1946

AM 9 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.621965 - coded 4R+DR of III./NJG2 - srapped March 1950

AM 10 - Focke-Wulf Fw190A-6/R6 - W.Nr.550214 - coded PN+LU of III./NJG11 - shipped to South Africa November 1946, on static display at South African Museum of Military History, Saxonwold

AM 11 - Focke-Wulf Ta152H-1 - W.Nr.150004 - coded 6+ of JG301? - allocated AM11 but not shipped to the UK, replaced with AM 11 below

AM 11 - Focke-Wulf Ta152H-1 - W.Nr.150168 - coded 9+ of Stab/JG301 - scrapped December 1946

AM 12 - Siebel Si204D-3 - W.Nr.351547 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 13 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.251922 - no code recorded - struck off charge November 1947

AM 14 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.620788 - coded C9+AA of NJG5 - damaged beyond repair July 1945

AM 15 - Messerschmitt Bf110G-4/R8 - W.Nr.180560 - coded 3C+BA of NJG4 - struck off charge May 1946

AM 16 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622311 - coded 3C+DA of NJG4 - fate unknown

AM 17 - Arado Ar232B-0 - W.Nr.305002 - coded A3+RB of III./KG200 - scrapped November 1945

AM 18 - Junkers Ju352A-1 - W.Nr.100015 - coded G6+WX of V./TG4 - scrapped December 1946

AM 19 - Junkers Ju252A - W.Nr.unknown - coded G6+YX of V./TG4 - scrapped Germany

AM 20 - Heinkel He219A-3 - W.Nr.290126 - coded D5+BL of I./NJG3 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 21 - Heinkel He219A-2 - W.Nr.310109 - no code recorded - unknown unit - scrapped January 1948

AM 22 - Heinkel He219A-5/R2 - W.Nr.3101089 - coded D5+CL of I./NJG3 - scrapped December 1945

AM 23 - Heinkel He219A - W.Nr.310200 - coded D5+DL og I./NJG3 - crashed at Grove, Denmark, July 1945

AM 24 - Arado Ar234B-2 - W.Nr.140466 - coded 8H+HH of AufklGr.33 - crashed at Farnborough and scrapped November 1945

AM 25 - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr.140608 - coded T9+GL of 3./Versuchsverband.d.OKL - also coded VK880, struck off charge October 1948

AM 26 - Arado Ar234B-1 - W.Nr.140476 - coded 8H+DH of AufklGr.33 - scrapped

AM 27 - Focke-Wulf Fw189A-3 - W.Nr.0173 - coded 3X+AA of unknown unit - scrapped 1947

AM 28 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.221558 - coded BJ+90 of unknown unit - struck off charge August 1947

AM 29 - Focke-Wulf Fw190F-8/U1 - w.Nr.584219 - "Black 38" of unknown unit - static display RAF Museum, Henson

AM 30 - Messerschmitt Bf110G-4/R3 - W.Nr.730037 - coded D5+DK of I./NJG3 - scrapped December 1946

AM 31 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.623193 - coded C9+HB of NJG5 - scrapped November 1946

AM 32 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622960 - coded +VH of unknown unit - crashed on landing October 1945

AM 33 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622186 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 34 - Messerschmitt Bf110G-4/R6 - W.Nr.730301 - coded D5+RL of I./NJG3 - static display RAF Museum at Hendon

AM 35 - Junkers Ju188D-2 - W.Nr.150245 - no code recorded - shipped to the US and became FE-1597/T2-1597. Presumed scrapped 1946.

AM 36 - Focke-Wulf Fw190F-8/U1 - W.Nr.580058 - coded "55" of unknown unit - not delivered to UK

AM 37 - Focke-Wulf Fw190S-1 - W.Nr.582044 - coded "54" of unknown unit - crashed November 1945

AM 38 - Messerschmitt Bf110G-4/R8 - W.Nr.180551 - coded D5+DM of II./NJG3 - not shipped to the UK

AM 39 - Messerschmitt Me410A-1/U2 - W.Nr.420439 - no code recorded - not shipped to the UK

AM 40 - Focke-Wulf Fw190F-8/U1 - W.Nr.580392 - coded "51" of unknown unit - not shipped to the UK

AM 41 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622054 - coded 7J+OV of NJG102 - not shipped to the Uk, replaced with AM41 below

AM 41 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622461 - coded 7J+CV of NJG102 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 42 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.251147 - coded 7J+XL of NJG102 - scrapped

AM 43 - Heinkel He219A-2 - W.Nr.unknown - no code recorded - scrapped?

AM 44 - Heinkel He219A-2 - W.Nr.310106 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 45 - Junkers Ju188A-2 - W.Nr.180485 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 46 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.unknown - no code recorded - scapped December 1948

AM 47 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.620968 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 48 - Junkers Ju88G-6 - W.Nr.622811 - coded 3C+MN of II./NJG4 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 49 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.251104 - coded D5+OM of II./NJG3 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 50 - Messerschmitt Me262B-1a/U1 - coded "Red 8" of IV./NJG11 - static display South African Museum of Military History, Saxonwold

AM 51 - Messerschmitt Me262A-2a - W.Nr.112372 - coded "Yellow 7" of I./JG7 - static display Aerospace Museum at Cosford

AM 52 - Messerschmitt Me262A-2a - W.Nr.500210 - coded "Yellow 17" of I./JG7 - shipped to Canada and scrapped 1947

AM 53 - Bucker Bu180 - W.Nr.unknown - unknown - possible mistake, could have been Me262B W.Nr.111980

AM 54 - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr.140113 - coded F1+AA of KG76 - struck off charge October 1948

AM 55 - Siebel Si204D-1 - W.Nr.321288 - no code recorded - struck off charge October 1948

AM 56A - Siebel Si204D - W.Nr.251190 - no code recorded - possible duplication of AM 56 above

AM 57 - Junkers Ju290A-2 - W.Nr.110157 - coded 9V+BK of 2./studmuffinr.5 - scrapped 1950

AM 58 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120221 - unknown code of JG1 - allocated serial VH526 used for spares and scrapped December 1946

AM 59 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120076 - coded "Yellow 4" of JG1 - allocated serail VH523, shipped to Canada and on static display at the Canadian national Aeronautical Collection, Ottawa

AM 60 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120074 - coded "White 11" of JG1 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 61 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120072 - no code recorded of JG1 - crashed November 1945

AM 62 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120086 - no code recorded of JG1 - stored Canada

AM 63 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120095 - no code recorded of JG1 - struck off charge August 1947

AM 64 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120097 - no code recorded of JG1 - allocated VN153, scrapped December 1946

AM 65 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120227 - no code recorded of JG1 - allocated VN679, on static display at RAF Museum Hendon

AM 66 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120091 - no code recorded of JG1 - fate unknown

AM 67 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.120098 - no code recorded of JG1 - allocated VH513, scrapped 1946

AM 68 - Heinkel He162A-2 - W.Nr.unknown - no code recorded of JG1 - static display Imperial War Museum, London

AM 69 - Blohm und Voss Bv138 - W.Nr.unknown - unknown code of unknown unit - possible AM S-1, AM S-2 or AM S-3 - fate not known

AM 70 - Blohm und Voss Bv138C-1 - W.Nr.0310081 - unknown code of FA 125 - allocated serial VN881, scrapped October 1948

AM S-2 - Blohm und Voss Bv138B-1 - W.Nr.unknown - coded "B" of unknown unit - allocated serial VK895, struck off charge January 1948

AM 71 - Blohm und Voss Bv138 - W.Nr.unknown - unknown code of unknown unit - possible AM S-1, AM S-2 or AM S-3 - fate not known

AM 72 - Messerschmitt Me410A-1/U2 - W.Nr.420430 - code & unit not recorded - static display Aerospace Museum at Cosford

AM 73 - Messerschmitt Me410A-1 - W.Nr.130360 - code and unit not recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 74 - Messerschmitt Me410B-6 - W.Nr.410208 - code and unit not recorded - scrapped December 1946

AM 75 - Junkers Ju88H-1/Focke-Wulf Fw190A-8/R6 Mistel S 3B - Ju88 W.Nr.unknown, Fw190 W.Nr.733682 - IV./KG200 - Ju88 scrapped 1945, Fw190 on static display at Imperial War Museum, London


from http://www.luftwaffe-experten.co.uk/raf-airmin.html

[MiloMorai]

AM 76 - Junkers Ju88H-1/Focke-Wulf Fw190A-8 Mistel S 3B - Both W.Nr. unknown - IV./KG200 - neither delivered to UK

AM 77 - Junkers Ju88/Focke-Wulf Fw190A Mistel S 3A - Ju88 W.Nr.2492, Fw190 W.Nr.733759 - IV./KG200 - both scrapped

AM 78 - allocation untraced

AM 79 - Messerschmitt Me262A - W.Nr.unknown - code & unit unknown - not flown to the UK

AM 80 - Messerschmitt Me262A-1 - W.Nr.111690 - coded "White 5" of I./JG7 - shipped to Canada and scrapped circa 1949

AM 81 - Messerschmitt Me262A-2a - W.Nr.500200 - coded 9K+XK "Black X" of II./KG51 - in store Mitchell Annex, Australia

AM 82 - Junkers Ju86P - W.Nr.5132 - coded T5+PM of Aufkl.Gr.100 - written off August 1945

AM 83 - Junkers Ju388L-1/V6 - W.Nr.500006 - coded PE+IF and "6" of unknown unit - scrapped 1948

AM 84 - Messerschmitt Bf108B - W.Nr.1547 - coded GJ+AU of unknown unit - fate unknown

AM 85 - Messerschmitt Bf110G-5/R1 - W.Nr.420031 - no code recorded - struck off charge August 1947

AM 86 - Messerschmitt Bf110G - W.Nr.unknown - no details recorded - possible not delivered to UK

AM 87 - Messerschmitt Bf108D-1 - W.Nr.3059 - coded VE+LI of unknown unit - exported to US circa 1968

AM 88 - Messerschmitt Bf110 - W.Nr.unknown - code not known - possible not shipped to UK

AM 89 - Messerschmitt Bf108B-1 - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit not known - fate unknown

AM 90 - Arado Ar196A - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - not shipped to the UK

AM 91 - Arado Ar196A-5 - W.Nr.127 - code and unit unknown - allocated serial VM748 and scrapped November 1947

AM 92 - Arado Ar196A-5 - W.Nr.514 - code and unit unknown - allocated serial VM761 and scrapped November 1947

AM 93 - Arado Ar199 - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - not shipped to the UK

AM 94 - Focke-Wulf Fw200C-4/U1 - W.Nr.176 - Himmlers personal aircraft coded GC+AE and "5" - scrapped December 1946

AM 95 - Focke-Wulf Fw200C - W.Nr.unknown - code unconfirmed - possible Fw200C-4/U1, W.Nr.0240 coded TK+CV and "1" which was Hitlers personal transport - not flown to the UK

AM 96 - Focke-Wulf Fw200C - W.Nr.0111 - coded D-ASVX Thuringen "1" of DLH - scrapped 1948

AM 97 - Focke-Wulf Fw200C - W.Nr.0181 - coded GC+SJ and "8" - used for spares

AM 98 - allocation untraced

AM 99 - Fieseler Fi156C-7 - W.Nr.475099 - coded VD+TD of unknown unit - shipped to South Africa and allocated SAAF serial No.200. possible airworthy today

AM 100 - Fieseler Fi156C - W.Nr.2008 - coded CV+KB of unknown unit - scrapped August 1947

AM 101 - Fieseler Fi156C-7 - W.Nr.475081 - coded RR+KE of unknown unit - static display Aerospace Museum at Cosford

AM 102 - Junkers Ju52/3m - W.Nr.6840 - D-AKUA of DLH - scrapped March 1948

AM 103 - Junkers Ju52/3m - W.Nr.6567 - D-AGAC of DLH - scrapped March 1948

AM 104 - Junkers Ju52/3m - W.Nr.641038 - D-AUAV of DLG - scrapped 1947/8

AM 105 - Dornier Do217M - W.Nr.unknown - not shipped to the UK

AM 106 - Dornier Do217M-1 - W.Nr.56527 - coded U5+HK of I./KG2 - scrapped December 1946

AM 107 - Dornier Do217M-1 - W.Nr.56158 - coded U5+?? of KG2 - scrapped December 1955

AM 108 - Junkers Ju188A-1 - W.Nr.230776 - code and unit not recorded - scrapped circa 1947

AM 109 - Junkers Ju352A - W.Nr.unknown - coded G6+RX of V./TG4 - scrapped December 1946

AM 110 - Junkers Ju352A - W.Nr.unknown - coded G6+SX of V./TG4 - scrapped

AM 111 - Focke-Wulf Fw190F-8/R15 - W.Nr.unknown - uncoded - scrapped 1948?

AM 112 - Junkers Ju88A-6/U - W.Nr.0660 - coded 1H+MN of II./KG26 - scrapped November 1947

AM 113 - Junkers Ju188A-2 - W.Nr.190327 - coded 1H+GT of III./KG26 - scrapped November 1947

AM 114 - Dornier Do24T - W.Nr.1135 - unknown code of SNG 81 - scrapped November 1947

AM 115 - Dornier Do24T-3 - W.Nr.unknown - unknown code of KG200 - allocated serial VM483 sank October 1945

AM 116 - Dornier Do24T - W.Nr.3435 - coded VH+JM of SNG 81 - allocated serial VN870, scrapped November 1947

AM 117 - Focke-Wulf Fw58C-2/U6 - W.Nr.2093 - coded TE+BK of Ekdo.40 - scrapped December 1946

AM 118 - allocation untraced

AM 119 - Siebel Si104A - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - crashed November 1945

AM 120 - Arado Ar96B - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - struck off charge May 1947

AM 121 - Bucker Bu181 - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - unknown

AM 122 - Bucker Bu181C-3 - W.Nr.120417 - code and unit unknown - civilian registration cancelled cira 1950

AM 123 - Arado Ar96B - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - struck off charge May 1947

AM 124 - Messerschmitt Bf108 - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - unknown

AM GD1 - Junkers Ju52/3m - W.Nr.5375 - code and unit unknown - unknown

AM GD - Siebel Si204D - W.Nr.unknown - code and unit unknown - unknown
Allocations made at RAE Farnborough (AM200 onwards)

AM 200 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191329 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 201 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191330 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped March 1946

AM 202 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191915 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped March 1946

AM 203 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.310061 - coded "Yellow 13" of JG400 - handed over to the French, fate unknown

AM 204 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191454 - coded "Yellow 11" of JG400 - shipped to Canada, scrapped circa 1957

AM 205 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191905 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 206 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191902 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 207 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191461 - unknown code of JG400 - static display at Aerospace Museum at Cosford

AM 208 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191912 - unknown code of JG400 - fate unrecorded

AM 209 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191315 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 210 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191316 - coded "Yellow 6" of JG400

AM 211 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191095 - unknown code of JG400 - static display Canadian War Museum

AM 212 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191965 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 213 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191954 - unknown code of JG400 - fate unknown

AM 214 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191660 - unknown code of JG400 - static display Iperial War Museum, Duxford

AM 215 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191659 - coded "Yellow 15" of JG400 - static display Royal Scottish Museum of Flight

AM 216 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191309 - unknown code of JG400 - fate unrecorded

AM 217 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191917 - unknown code of JG400 - fate unrecorded

AM 218 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191654 - scrapped August 1947

AM 219 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191904 - coded "25" of JG400 - static display Luftwaffe Museum, Oldenburg

AM 220 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191914? - unknown code of JG400 - static display CNAC, Rockcliffe, Canada

AM 221 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191961 - unknown code of JG400 - scrapped August 1947

AM 222 - Messerschmitt Me163B - W.Nr.191907 - unknown code of JG400 - static display/store Australian War Memorial, Canberra

AM 223 - Dornier Do335A-12 - W.Nr.240112 - no codes or unit - crashed January 1946

AM 225 - Dornier Do335A-1 - W.Nr.unknown - no codes or unit - scrapped December 1946

AM 226 - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr.140336 - unknown code of II./KG76 - fate unknown

AM 227 to AM 229 - all Arado Ar234's but AM numbers to W.Nr. are unknown

AM ??? - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr.140141 - unknown code of 1(F)/Aufkl.Gr.123 - fate unknown

AM ??? - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr.140493 - unknown code of 1./studmuffinr.1 - fate unknown

AM ??? - Arado Ar234B - W.Nr140581 - unknown code of 1(F)/Aufkl.Gr.123 - fate unknown

AM 229 - Messerschmitt Bf109G-14 - W.Nr.413601 - coded "Black 7" of unknown unit - fate unrecorded

AM 230 - Focke-Wulf Fw190A-8D/NL - W.Nr.171747 - coded "13" on rudder on ferry flight to JG26 - fate not recorded

AM 231 - Junkers Ju88G-1 - W.Nr.712273 - coded 4R+UR of III./NJG2 - fate not recorded

AM 232 - allocation untraced

AM 233 - Focke-Achgelis Fa223E - W.Nr.V14 - coded DM+SR - allocated serial VM479, crashed October 1945