Author Topic: May 2nd, FRANCE 1940! on ASW's New Map (Read 1456 times)

Löwe · « **Reply #15 on:** May 02, 2003, 07:45:53 AM »

Actually in this setup I'd rather run into Spit Is than Hurri I's, or P-40Bs. The low amount of cannon ammo on the Emil, and the toughness of the Hurris, and P-40bs is the biggest problem for me. Bring on the Spit!!:D

Kweassa · « **Reply #16 on:** May 03, 2003, 02:59:47 AM »

One question:

How does the P-40B compare to the Bf109E-4??

and then, how does the Morane compare to the P-40B?

..

Is the pseudo-Morane so much in disadvantage as it absolutely would need the Spitfires to stand in for them??

Karnak · « **Reply #17 on:** May 03, 2003, 03:40:31 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Slash27
I don't think the Spitfire should be in the list.

Give me a break.

pangea · « **Reply #18 on:** May 03, 2003, 09:42:56 AM »

Nice setup. Thanks Brady!

Doesn't really matter too much to me, but I don't think the allies "need" the Spit for balance. They held their own very nicely last night without it since all of the fighting was too far to the east for the Spit to enter the fray. At any rate I don't think the Spit will come into play very much as the "front" will probably not progress far enough to the west to make it very useable. Of course, I'm sure some people will ferry it all the way across France. If they want to go to that much time and effort just to fly a Spit I say have at it. I do not see the axis having a huge "upper hand" here vs. only the P40B and Hurri I. IMO the 109E is not an easy plane to get kills with and the 110 is basically just a HO machine as a fighter. The Hurri I and P40B compete very well when flown correctly, and complement each other when flown together. I think this setup is pretty well balanced without the Spit.

oboe · « **Reply #19 on:** May 03, 2003, 11:09:23 AM »

Just out of curiosity, what is the correct way to fight a 109E, 1v1, in a P-40B?

This is only after a couple hours of combat, but it appears to me the 109E owns the P-40B. I think the Messerschmidt has the advantage in level speed, rate of climb, roll rate, firepower, and sustained turn. It appears to me the Tomahawk has a slight advantage in instantaneous turn, but that's about it. I had several opportunities for solid snapshots, and really lit a couple 109s up, but the 40's gun package couldn't even damage the 109 visibly. If the dogfight lasts for more than a few minutes, the 109's advantage in gaining back lost E really starts to shine through. A few hard maneuvers in the 40B leave it gasping for breath and clawing to stay in the air (at that's with 25% fuel)...

This is not a whine at all - historically the 109 probably owned anything the French threw at it. I generally fly for the underdog and enjoy seeing the French roundels out there on the wing. Just wondering if anybody has found an effective way to use the Tomahawk?

Kweassa · « **Reply #20 on:** May 03, 2003, 11:53:53 AM »

I think anykind of sharp scissorong would leave the 109E pretty dumbfounded..

I remember fighting a F4F-4 in a Bf109E this one time. The E-4 had advantages in speed, climb and acceleration, and it wasn't too hard forcing the fight into a style I was best at. But the problem came after that - I just simply couldn't get a gun solution on the Wildcat!

Considering my gunnery is like only 6~8% average, to get a lethal hit to shoot something down, I have to maneuver a lot and try to force the enemy plane into a low alt low speed situation(I just can't get those snap shots in..). Since I can't get a snapshot in, I almost always try to outmaneuver my foe - and guess what, I was able to corner him down low, but wasn't able to follow him when he decided to keep changing his direction of the roll - it felt like a bad joke, when another friendly plane came and shot the Wildcat down, which I worked so hard to sucker low and slow, but couldn't get a right position to fire at, because of the diabolical roll rate.

... The P-40B, I think, is a pretty terrific rolling plane compared to the SpitI or the 109E-4.. maybe it has a pretty good chance in forcing an overshoot by rolling..

Löwe · « **Reply #21 on:** May 03, 2003, 12:12:12 PM »

Oboe-san.

The fight you and I had this morning, well the second one, after that great bounce you did on me.....

I was 100% fuel low and slow. Your plane would out turm me easlily, I managed to get enough alt to start using zoom climbs but still the fuel wieght was playing against me. The hits you had on me must have been ther lighter of the P40B s guns 30MM?? They had the gravel on tin roof sound. The only chance I had was using the energy advantage you had against you. I don't know if you remember but I forced you to over shoot 3 times putting me on your six, the third time I finnally got a gun solution when your energy bled off and you were forced to attempt the split S.

It's funny in that fight I felt like I was at a disadvantage until the third overshoot. perception it's a wierd thing!!;)

DiabloTX · « **Reply #22 on:** May 03, 2003, 05:47:03 PM »

Agreed. I was in a low fight with a P-40B yesterday and we both stuck to our strengths, he staying low turn-fighting and me doing the BnZ until I got his E bled off really low and I was able to cozy up right behind him. Then BBBB blazed in with guns opened and the 40 went . So you can get the planes to come down with the Emil, just make sure your are good and close and let 'em have it. All things considered this is one of the best set-ups that I have played. It really does focus more on pilot ability, than, say, hitting the weap in a G10 to escape.

ergRTC · « **Reply #23 on:** May 03, 2003, 06:36:56 PM »

good thing we dont have a jabo. Considering the french didnt have one either. Unless you count the bliens.

brady · « **Reply #24 on:** May 03, 2003, 07:05:14 PM »

The French had Br 693's witch were groud atack planes, amongst other's. The French had good stuff and they had generaly more of it, they just dident know what they heck to do with it.

ergRTC · « **Reply #25 on:** May 03, 2003, 11:02:37 PM »

never heard of the 693. Got any pretty pics brady? I know you do....

brady · « **Reply #26 on:** May 04, 2003, 02:28:34 AM »

Check this out:

http://www.vvs-regia-avions.com/AvionsHTML/abr69x1.htm

Br 693, this plane was built for close suport, and some of the mishions flow by these planes realy wreaked havoc on the German collums.

300mph

20mm Hispano 404 cannon, and 2 7.5mm MG's firing forward, one 7.5mm on defensive mount in rear.

Eight 50KG bombs in bomb bay

aprox. 275 of all types were delivered by the armisist.

The Bloch 174 was a good one to, but very few entered service before the end, they were used afterword by the Germans and by Vichy French forces.

329mph, two 7.5mm fixed forward,several defensive guns some fixed firing to the rear, and eight 50kg bombs.

The Potez 63 was a light atack plane as well, it saw service with various countries during the war, after France fell,the Greaks had some and Romaia did, and the Germans used some as well.

267mph

Some had Two 20 mm Hispano's and a ton of 7.5mm MG's( One for defenses in the rear and some in Gun packs under the wings for atack sorties) and up to 1,323 pounds of bomb's.

1,300 pluss were built and saw service.

They had some decent Bombers to, but thats another story:)

oboe · « **Reply #27 on:** May 04, 2003, 02:53:16 AM »

Lowe! Yes, I remember that fight! It was a great one - I think I must've caught a full brace of 20mm in the cockpit as I cut across, because I ended up in the tower rather suddenly! Yes, you are one of the 109s that I lit up solidly, without much effect. I wonder if there are convergence/drop issues between the .30 and .50 cal? I have all my guns converging at 250 yds.

The fight I'm really thinking of was the one against LUPO. We had a great fight lasting a couple of minutes, with him always in the advantage, controlling the fight, being patient - BnZing and then breaking hi to regain E. I was trying to run for help and avoid his passes at the same time. With each pass and break turn, he stayed in the saddle a little longer. I recall that fight ended when I pushed a little too hard and the Tomahawk just gave up and stopped flying. That never turns out well when you only have a couple hundred feet of air under you!

Its really just a quick first perception like I said. I need to fly the Hurri, and also try the 109 and 110 against a 40B. But my first experience is pretty much what Diablo described, except I bungled giving LUPO the satifaction of a gunkill by pushing the a/c too hard.

About scissoring- it seemed to work OK to a point, but it bleeds E pretty quickly and that leaves the Tomahawk in trouble, because it doesn't seem to gain E back very well? Man, I wish we had rollrate and acceleration charts in addition to the speed/climb data that HTC provides...

I'm looking forward to some more great fights this week! ~~all!~~

Saintaw · « **Reply #28 on:** May 05, 2003, 08:31:13 AM »

This week end was a hoot

I'm not in the CT that often, flew for both sides... got a little frustrated as allied, but very fun all in all!

(My squad's an MA squad... maybe someone has a slot for me in a week end CT squad?)

ergRTC · « **Reply #29 on:** May 05, 2003, 08:57:52 AM »

saw, anytime your up on a tuesday or thursday the vf would be happy to have you. problem is that would mean you were flying at 3 am or so. I dont know if we want guys flying that early in the morning near our planes..... enough dings in em already!