Author Topic: American Haters  (Read 1617 times)

Offline Martlet

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American Haters
« on: May 13, 2003, 03:48:04 PM »
It's funny how all these guys: dowding, miko, straffo, blitch, etc that all stood on their soapboxes, claiming to not hate america, that they were just against the war, have moved onto other anti american topics.  Once the war publicity peters out, it's time to find something else to cry about.

Offline SLO

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American Haters
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2003, 04:53:02 PM »
one day you shall understand that your PERFECT country is NOT so perfect.....

yet here you are squeaking about everyone else's country(France).....but you don't accept a little critizism about your own.....yet if they do....you automatically brand em anti-american

cry me a river sheep herder.....

Offline GtoRA2

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« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2003, 04:59:52 PM »
SLO

 Who ever said the United States was perfect, I know we have had black marks in our past.

 What is anoying is everytime someone tries to stand up and say I love the gold old US of A, he get smacked by a bunch of nay sayers who want to tell him how much of a ignorant ******* he is cause the USA sucks.

They are up here.

Hey I know you guys across the pond get it too, maybe we should just relax, and when I guy praises his country let him, you wana talk crap about the country do it in your own thread.

Offline Maniac

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« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2003, 05:07:00 PM »
Slo,

Its getting old, dont bite on the bate....
Warbirds handle : nr-1 //// -nr-1- //// Maniac

Offline Arlo

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« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2003, 05:25:56 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SLO
one day you shall understand that your PERFECT country is NOT so perfect.....

yet here you are squeaking about everyone else's country(France).....but you don't accept a little critizism about your own.....yet if they do....you automatically brand em anti-american

cry me a river sheep herder.....


One day you'll understand that we know about our country just fine and don't need your slant or views or commentary 24/7 even though you can't help it due to compulsive insecurity issues. ;)

Ohhhh ... Canadaaaaaaaa
our source of hockey playerrrrrssssss
their main export
enhance the sport
south of the borderrrrrr

And in returrrrnnnnn
fast food, cars , tv shows
we keep you safe, your only threat is an uprising of eskimos

AAaaaaaaa ...... meeeeeeen

:D

Offline Udie

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« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2003, 05:41:25 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Maniac
Slo,

Its getting old, dont bite on the bate....



 He can't help it Nr-1 :D  he hates America.....

Offline Montezuma

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Re: American Haters
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2003, 05:45:47 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Martlet
...it's time to find something else to cry about.


When Bill Clinton was president, were you an 'America Hater' also?

Offline vorticon

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« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2003, 06:16:46 PM »
ach 'n tup

Offline Nash

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« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2003, 07:01:07 PM »
"... it's time to find something else to cry about." - Martlet

There's an idea...

Offline cpxxx

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« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2003, 07:05:15 PM »
I think there are several what you might call cultural misunderstandings here.  A certain amount of S**t stirring and a bit of rhetoric.

Without claiming to be an expert. I would see it as follows. In America and to some extent in other new countries like Australia and even Canada sometimes there seems to be a need to express your nationalism. It is particularly prevalent in the USA. I think perhaps of neccessity. For such a big and diverse country to stay together there has to something to pull it all together. It nearly fell apart during the civil war and history might have been very different if the South managed to secede from the North.

I saw this when I first went to America. I used to get a lift every morning to flight school from a young guy, Andy, a fascinating character. He was very patriotic. I thought he was a walking talking American cliche. He drove a Camry but owned a Mustang and kept a picture of it and of his girlfriend on the dash of the Camry. One day he told me he had written a song which he had taped. Would I like to hear it? Sure, so he played it. It was country style and essentially it expressed his love of America.

I was torn between laughing at the song and it's sentiments and feeling touched that he would share it with me and being impressed at the pride he had in his country.

The reason being that in most countries, particularly cynical Europe you really don't have to express your love of country and sing songs about it. You just are who you are, you don't have to express it. I can trace my family name back a thousand years. I am of this country as much as the hills, lakes and the rain is. I'm just part of it.
If I went around expressing my love of country, people would look at me suspiciously and think I was some sort of fascist with some justification. That's the way it is in most old countries. You wear your identity lightly and really only become aware of it when you go abroad or meet a foreigner.  In fact you are far more likely to express pride in your locality or county than country. You may love or hate your country but it's as much a part of you as your hand and you never really leave it behind no matter far you travel.

It's different in America, a nation of immigrants often with little in common except a dream of bettering themselves.  They are not of the land and it has few marks of history. Even the oldest settlement is a new town compared to Europe. It's still a country in transition. Something has to keep it together. So pride in your flag, the country's achievements, the freedom and all the rest are emphasised.  Being American seems to be something you have to work on and anybody can be American if they believe hard enough.  Expressing your pride is encouraged. I used to wonder why cops and other uniformed workers has US flag patches on their arm when they never left the country. In other countries you woild only wear your national flag if you were going abroad.  In America you wear the flag to express your pride. In most countries you would be regarded as strange if you flew your national flag in the garden outside of national celebrations. In the USA it's common and normal. Now  I know you don't all get up every morning, salute the flag, sing the Star Spangled banner and read passages from the constitution to the kids before breakfast. But I betcha you know someone who does?

Now that's all fine and great. I like the idea of it and in fact I like America very much, it's people.

But what does annoy me and a few others here is when it goes too far. The 'my country's great and yours sucks' mentality. That will annoy me every time even when it's not my country being slated. Half the time to be fair the reason is that someone had a go at America fairly or unfairly. America is not perfect and it's foreign policy is often unpopular but it's the most powerful country in the world and everyone but everyone has an opinion on it. It's fair game for criticism.  We've seen the battles here and elsewhere.

Criticising America is not neccessarily anti American. I do it and I tend to be pro American. Americans do it too. It's part of deal.

So given the above, when Nuke or someone puts up a picture of a Space Shuttle and says 'Ain't we great' it's often interpreted as a veiled attack on every other country.  (Which knowing Nuke it probably is). But it is probably as much a defensive gesture from an American feeling under appreciated and under attack and even a genuine expression of national pride.

On the other hand the French may have been feeling the heat of US vitriol of late. But I think you might find it washes over them in a way that Americans don't fully understand. They know it will die down and Paris will be flooded with US tourists so the Parisiens can go back to being rude to them in person again. Not just Americans I might add, Parisiens are rude to everyone.

So that is my attempt at some kind of 'entente cordial'. You now understand where both sides are coming from which is good.

Now we can get back to attacking each other. Let the games begin!
« Last Edit: May 13, 2003, 07:38:17 PM by cpxxx »

Offline Arlo

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« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2003, 07:22:33 PM »


Ain't we great?

(I'm working on building up credit here)

Offline Nash

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« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2003, 07:52:18 PM »
Well said cpxx!

I think it goes a long way in explaining Martlet's avater, for example, and why I think it's perhaps the goofiest thing I've ever seen. :D

Offline Arlo

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« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2003, 07:55:13 PM »
Yet .... your ... avatar .... still ......


Wha?

Oh yes ... yours still ......


.......

Offline Martlet

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Re: Re: American Haters
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2003, 08:56:16 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Montezuma
When Bill Clinton was president, were you an 'America Hater' also?


I voted for Clinton both times, and I was on Gore's steering committee.    How does that fit into your rhetoric?

Offline Martlet

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« Reply #14 on: May 13, 2003, 08:58:31 PM »
so, what makes an avatar goofy?  The fact that I consistently expose your propaganda?  Is a flag goofy?  A car?  Bouncing tits?