Can we get some simple engine management?

[rust]

I understand that most people don't want to contend with a realistic engine management system and all the controls and indicators that would come with it, although I do.  But what about a simple system like European Air War where if you leave the throttle at full for more than a set amount of time the engine overheats?
It would add another element of strategy.  You would need to keep an eye on your temps and climb out at a reasonable throttle setting.  In a fight you could push it to the wall but only for a short time.  
If you ignore the heat indicator and keep pushing your plane past the limit your engine will fail.
I just don't like the idea of taking off at full throttle, climbing at full throttle, fighting at full throttle, and coming home at full throttle with no regard for the engine temp.
Also, when WEP is engaged it shouldn't automatically disengage when the engine gets hot, the engine should blow.  Otherwise, what's the use of even having an indicator for engine temp?

------------------
RUST
 


[This message has been edited by rust (edited 08-03-2000).]

[Toad]

Yep, rust, you are right. Time to start phasing that relatively simple type stuff in.

[Jigster]

 

Originally posted by Toad:
Yep, rust, you are right. Time to start phasing that relatively simple type stuff in.

Mixture lever!

 

- Jig
--------
"Daddy Rabbit almost lost what would become 'Glamorous Glennis III' on his last mission. I was winging with him watching his tail almost more then mine, I really wanted that plane. We punched our drop tanks over Germany when all of a sudden he fell outta the sky like a rock. I dove with him, as he said 'hey, I'm thinkin about leaving this thing' as we went under fifteen-thousand. machine gun tracers were wizzing all around us at this point, and I quickly went over the controls with him and found out it was the mixture knob, he had hit it punching his drop tank. That P-51 roared to life as soon as he went to emergency rich. We climbed back to altitude and I said, 'you park that thing and hand over the keys', to which he replied, 'I know you wouldn't let anything happen to me, you want my plane too damn much!' " -- Chuck Yeager

[Westy]

Ditto!

-Westy

(but jabs Jigster in the ribs for the mixture control vote)

[popeye]

Gets my vote.

popeye

[gatt]

Uhmmm,

engine overheat is a difficult feature to introduce. In aircarft without a real WEP, when you firewall your throttle, you should get only the maximum continuous allowed rpm setting (without risk of overheat). In those a/c hitting "P" should give you the climb and combat rpm setting (for a limited time).

If this is correct, then aircraft with a real WEP (like some USAF kites or like the G-10's MW50) should have a second WEP level.

Just some thoughts. But I agree, driving around all the time at 100% throttle is really ... unreal.

[Suave1]

I fly typhoon alot so I get alot of radiator damage and one thing I've noticed, the temp guage really doesn't even work. Just an observation not an AH bash .

[Downtown]

Well not all aircraft had WEP either, so firewalling them should cause your engine to overheat.

I also hope that the Oil Pressure or Temp and Coolant Temp guages will start to work.  Especially in the Jug which will still fly with no oil and a bad cylinder or two for quiet some time.

How would you do a rough running engine.

Oh, backfires would be cool.  Blow a head, smoke a carb.  Yep they would be cool.

------------------

"Downtown" Lincoln Brown.
    lkbrown1@tir.com    
 http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1
Wrecking Crews "Drag and Die Guy"
Hals und beinbruch!

[funked]

Not all aircraft had lots of engine controls anyway.  The AH Fw 190 actually has a more complicated engine management system than the real one.  

[miko2d]

 You already have a simple engine management - on/off, throttle, even WEP.
 What you are asking for is sophisticated engine management.
 Otherwise I agree. Even in 1942 PAW you would get that engine overheat sound if not carefull.

miko--

[MiG Eater]

 

Originally posted by gatt:
Uhmmm,

In aircarft without a real WEP, when you firewall your throttle, you should get only the maximum continuous allowed rpm setting (without risk of overheat).

This is only true for an airplane with a fixed pitch prop and/or with liquid cooling.  If the airplane is equiped with a constant speed propeller/prop governer system, the throttle is only a "voting member" of the system.  Firewalling the throttle in this system does not prevent the engine from producing more power output.  The governer automatically increases and decreases manifold pressure to maintain an RPM setting depending on the load the prop is experiencing.  The greater the load, the greater the manifold pressure.  Increase manifold pressure too much (which would happen if the prop control was pulled back to decrease RPM's without reducing throttle first) would result in overheating, detonation and eventual catastrophic damage if continued for more than a short time.  With both controls full forward while placing a high load on the engine, say... in a steep climb at slow airspeed, an air cooled engine would not have enough airflow to prevent overheating.  Even liquid cooled engines will generate more heat than the cooling system can disapate.  I think that these are symptoms for the effect that Rust was looking for.

MiG

[Swoop]

And another thing.....when a radiator gets shot out.....surely the engine shouldn't quit so quickly....I mean surely the temp gauge would start to rise and you'd begin to hear it overheating before it actually blew......

?

Swoop

[Renfield]

Excellent post Rust.

Even with no WEP, there should be overheating. There was a lot of engine temperature management involved with those planes.

Heck, just sitting on the runway idling a P-51 will overheat. Also on a climbout the air is comparatively slow over the engine/radiator while the engine is putting out a lot of power and generating a lot of heat. A big plus were automatic cowl and radiator flaps but not all planes had them - the B-17 is one example. Forget to open them on takeoff and you'll lose engines.

[chisel]

Hmmmm Huh Wha.... Mig eater?

Gov. controls prop blade angle which increases/decreases load on the engine to maintain RPM


Would really like to see a sim do a full on engine model, with the proper advantages /disadvantages for each airplanes system. A place where the Kraut cans really excell.  

But will it be worth it?
Used to think so, but not so sure anymore prolly take quit a bit of CPU horsepower to do it right.

Still would like to see guys blow up engines on the deck tho  

BTW havent played AH in awile....Can you see(gauges)/ feel the blowers shift on the various planes in AH? 190/spit etc.