PLANES U WOULD LIKE TO C IN AHII

[F4i]

Originally posted by MrWimpy
Which model of the F6F Hellcat had 20mm cannon??

Later models could substitute two 20 mm guns for the two inboard .50 calibers.

  I want it!  
It'd be sooooooo easy for HTC to make.


F4i

[rshubert]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
It never saw any combat service and by the time the US jet was ready, most prop planes in the ETO were just as fast, if not faster.  If we do get it, it would probably be the only non-perked jet fighter in the game.


Ack-Ack

You are absolutely right about the service issues, but don't underestimate the performance of the P80A (first production version)  Follow this link to information:

http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/p80_4.html

Quoting from that link:

"Specification of the P-80A:

Engine: One General Electric J33-GE-11 or Allison J33-A-9 turbojet, rated at 3850 lb.s.t. Later production blocks powered by 4000 lb.s.t. Allison J33-A-17. Dimensions: wingspan 38 feet 10 1/2 inches (without wingtip tanks), length 34 feet 6 inches, height 11 feet 4 inches, and wing area 237.6 square feet Weights were 7920 pounds empty, 11,700 pounds gross, and 14,000 pounds maximum takeoff. Fuel load: 425 US gallons normal, 885 US gallons maximum. Performance: Maximum speed was 558 mph at sea level and 492 mph at 40,000 feet. Initial climb rate was 4580 feet/minute, and an altitude of 20,000 feet could be attained in 5.5 minutes. Service ceiling was 45,000 feet. Normal range was 780 miles, and maximum range was 1440 miles. Armament: Six 0.50-inch machine guns"

Comparing that to the Me262:

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap11.htm

 Quoting from that link:

SPECIFICATIONS
Span: 41 ft.
Length: 34 ft. 9 in.
Height: 11 ft. 4 in.
Weight: 15,600 lbs.
Armament: Four 30mm MK-108 cannons, plus 1,000 lbs. of bombs.
Engines: Two Junkers Jumo 004s of 1,980 lbs. thrust ea.
Crew: One


PERFORMANCE
Maximum speed: 540 mph.
Cruising speed: 460 mph.
Range: 650 miles
Service Ceiling: 38,000 ft. "

Do I think a P80A could take on the Me262?  Probably, unless it was an unmanueverable sled.  It was lighter, faster, had almost exactly the same thrust, and had a higher service ceiling.  The performance numbers aren't that different, though.  

Should we have it in AH?  No.

PS.  You may have been thinking of the Meteor, whose figures go like this:

Nicknames: Meatbox; Meaty potato; Phantom Diver (T7 version); Reaper (Meteor GAF version)

Specifications (F.Mk I):
        Engines: Two 1,700-pound thrust Rolls-Royce W.2B/23C Welland turbojets
        Weight: Empty 8,140 lbs., Max Takeoff 13,795 lbs.
        Wing Span: 43ft. 0in.
        Length: 41ft. 3in.
        Height: 13ft. 0in.
        Performance:
            Maximum Speed at 10,000 ft: 415 mph
            Ceiling: 40,000 ft.
            Range: 550 miles
        Armament: Four 20-mm cannon

[Hornet1]

Sorry, P-61 was a night fighter but could also carry a 6,400lb load(Not too shabby). It would be a welcomed addition.
It would be nice to see some more choices for heavy bombers. ...B-29,B-24,Ju188,He111.
P-39 or P-63 would be great to see also.
Do 335 would make a great perk plane:-)
Nakajima Ki-84
Mitsubishi J2M Raiden
La-9,La-11
Fiat G.55
Reggiane Re 2005
Just a few lol.
I have specs and data on all of the listed above plus some.

[_Schadenfreude_]

Originally posted by MrWimpy
They have the Yak-3 in Fighter Ace.  It doesn't rule there.

Get a guy called Ajax to show you how to fly it.

[MajorDay]

I would like to see(Only bomber):

Consolidated B-24 Liberator(USA)
North American B-25 Mitchell(USA)
Avro Manchester(Great Britain)
Short Stirling(Great Britain)
Dornier Do 17, Do 215 and Do 217(Germany)
Savoia marchetti SM 81(Italy)
Douglas A-26/B-26 Invader(USA)
Heinkel He 177(Germany)
Blackburn Skua(Great Britain)
Fairey Barracuda(Great Britain)

[Furball]

Originally posted by MajorDay

Avro Manchester(Great Britain)
Blackburn Skua(Great Britain)
Fairey Barracuda(Great Britain)

Just out of interest, why these 3?

I understand the Stirling, but the Manchester was a failure (until they modified it to make the Lancaster. Only 190 or so Skua's were made and these were quickly taken out of service. The Barracuda was ok but i think the Fairey Firefly would be much more useful in AH


And rshubert, those meteor specifications are from the Mk.I, only 20 of them were built before switching production to the Mk.III (210 built during the war)

[MajorDay]

Originally posted by Furball
Just out of interest, why these 3?

I understand the Stirling, but the Manchester was a failure (until they modified it to make the Lancaster. Only 190 or so Skua's were made and these were quickly taken out of service. The Barracuda was ok but i think the Fairey Firefly would be much more useful in AH

Oh.  I didn't know Manchester was a failure and thanks for telling me that.

I found more bomber i like to add:

Heinkel He 111(Germany)
Martin Maryland(Great Britain)
Cant Z.1007 Alcione(Italy)

[GScholz]

Originally posted by MrWimpy
They have the Yak-3 in Fighter Ace.  It doesn't rule there.

Don't know what model Yak-3 they have. The 1942-1943 model didn't rule, but the 1944 one did. The LW issued orders in 1944 that no LW pilot should engage a Yak with no oil cooler under the nose (Yak-3) under 15k feet, under no circumstanses.

Fighter Ace prolly models the 1943 Yak-3 with the VK-105 engine (same as Yak-9T). It's performance wasn't stellar, but good. The 1944 (January)VK-107 engined (same as Yak-9U) Yak-3 had 1,650 hp in a 4,960 lbs shortened airframe. In comparison the Yak-9U weighs in at 6,988 lbs. It has more horsepower than the P-51D but only 2/3rds of the weight.

The Yak-3 (VK-107) has very impressive performance figures:

Maximum speed at sea level: 447 mph
Initial climb rate: 5,250 ft/min
Service ceiling: 35,450 ft

It's only shortcomming is it's dismal range, only 506 miles.

It was a very small point defence fighter (like the Mig-15 and 21 later on) with the most powerful liquid-cooled engine the Russians had, and had the same basic armament as the Yak-9U (1x20mm, 2x12,7mm).

[MrWimpy]

According to Encyclopedia of the World's Combat Aircraft, by Bill Gunston, the VK-107 engined version was too late to see combat in WWII.  

They Luftwaffe did indeed receive a directive to avoid combat below 5000 meters with Yakovlev fighters lacking an oil cooler under the nose.  

So far as I can tell from all the pictures I've seen of Yak-3 fighters, NONE of them had an oil cooler under the nose.

In Fighter Ace, the Yak-3 is described as being "...probably the most agile monoplane fighter of WWII."

In any event, it still doesn't rule.  Maybe it would, if someone formed a squadron and fought properly with it.  But since there are machines faster than it is, that is about the only way I see it happening.

Although, I had good luck with it against some guys flying P-51D Mustangs.  

I do love that picture you posted though.

[GScholz]

I'm reading the "Allied Fighters of World War II" also by Bill Gunston. It states that the service delivery of the VK-107 engined Yak-3's as "no later than January 1944".

Yes all the Yak-3 had the oil-cooler moved to the wing roots, that's how the LW identified it as Yak-3, however the order went out in 1944.

"On 14 July 1944 a force of 18 met 30 Luftwaffe fighters and destroyed 15 for the loss of one Yak-3. Small wonder that, offered all available Soviet, British or American fighters, the Normandie-Niemen Group changed from the Yak-9 to the Yak-3 and scored the last 99 of their 273 victories on these machines. It was natural that the more powerful VK-107 engine should have been fitted to the Yak-3, though the designation was not changed. After prolonged trials in early 1944 the Soviet test centre judged the 107-engined aircraft to be 60-70 mph faster than either a Bf 109G or an Fw190."

In my book it says nothing about it being too late, quite the contrary.

[MrWimpy]

In the History section, my book says the following:

first flight (-3) Spring 1943; service delivery (-3) about July 1943; (-3  with VK-107) not later than January 1944

Problem is, that leaves us assuming they meant service delivery without really saying directly, "service delivery.  In the main text I read the following:

It was natural that the more powerful VK-107 engine should have been fitted to the Yak-3, though the designation was not changed.  After prolonged trials in early 1944 the Soviet test centre judged the 107-engined aircraft to be 60-70 mph faster than either a Bf-109G or an Fw 190, but the re-engined aircraft was just too late to see action in World War II.  

What can I say, that's what it says!

In either event, it appears that even the first version of the Yak-3 was considered a worthy opponent for the Luftwaffe.

[Karnak]

The Yak-3 with the Vk-107 engine did not enter service in time to see action in WWII.  It's first action was in Korea IIRC.

They tested it a began building it during WWII, but it just missed out on seeing service in WWII.

[Replicant]

Originally posted by m109
the cannon pony did see action under the designation A36A Invader. It was a version of the P51A modified as a dive bomber.

The A36A had dive brakes, 6x.50s (4 in wings, 2 lower fuselage), 2x500lb bombs and to my knowledge it never had 20mm cannons.  There was one on loan from the US to Duxford museum a year or two ago - very pretty plane.

The US did keep 57 P51A's and redesignated them F-6A's, fitted with cameras in rear fuselage.

The RAF originally placed an order for 150 of the Mustang Mk1A (20mm cannons).  These were mostly fitted with cameras too and operated within Army-Cooperation (AC) squadrons.

[Beans101]

Replicant,

           I LOVE U !!!

Excellent Feed back man and i love the picture:p

<> Beans101 OUT!!

[Linz]

We have night, but no night-fighters...

And a Ju52, pls

He111?