Fighting v. Running – hmmm...

[-Concho-]

well said Pepe  

[acetnt]

The thing is I have only been playing this game for a 6 or 7 months and for the first month and a half I pretty much got shot down on my every attempt at combat.

One of the first things I learned after reading some of the posts here and info on a few websites was basic ACM -- know your plane and know the plane you're fighting.

The thing is I always try to use any advantage I have. If there are friendly acks - I will use them, if I can get alt - I will use, I will not get into a turning battle with a spit unless I am in a similar plane etc.

I am not afraid of dieing because frankly my scores are not good enough to worry about. The thing is I don't see why it is necessary to purposely put myself at a disadvantage just so the other guy -- the one who shoots me --- is happy. I still engage in many fights and loose lots but I am starting to win a few more.

As they say - All is fair in WAR :-)

Oh well -- I will fight my way and the other guy is entitled to his....

[devious]

If I can fight them, i fight them.

If there are too much, and I`m fast enough,  I run.

If you`re in a fair fight, you have made a mistake. It`s still fun, but LA7 N1K SPIT LA7 on my tail, and I run.

[moot]

fight or die.
if the reds are not dead, you've made a mistake and should die for it.

yadda yadda about a game, about real life this or real life that, you take up a challenge, you win or lose, you kill or die.

not live or run.

[Shane]

Originally posted by acetnt
The thing is I don't see why it is necessary to purposely put myself at a disadvantage just so the other guy -- the one who shoots me --- is happy.

well, imho, i think you'll learn much faster and before you know it, using those evasives (not simple running or split-essing) to reverse on the guy who is on you.  and you'll learn that and alt/e disadvantage is no big deal that requires you doing your best to hightail it out of dodge crying for help or running to acks - or getting shot down. it'll help you get better at both judging e-sates and improving your SA while you keep an eye on the guy on you, and anything else that may be inbound.

on the converse, you'll learn how to use alt/e to your advantage knowing what to look for in the other guy, whether you can aggressively latch on or take a little more care vs someone who seems to know what they're doing.

it's real hard for someone for force an overshoot on me, on the other hand, i force overshoots all the time.


nothing beats busting the 1 or 2 guys who have every advantage over you and sending them back to tower with a "you friggin' cheater - no way you can do that!" coming over channel 1.

[rshubert]

Originally posted by nopoop
Different worlds.

The fight, when engaged as you stated, is the best from a "fighters" point of reference.

It can end with your demise ( in my case more than not ), but a good fight is worth the price of admission.

And if you come up victorious, there's the speeches and advertising endorsments.

But in the end..

If it was a GOOD fight.

It takes a place in your mind.

Win or lose.

In no way is it "same'o same'o".

The "light" burns.

Really, really different.  Nopoop, this ain't a Zen experience, nor is it a martial arts contest.  It's a GAME, and has absolutely no attachment to any objective reality.  Don't take it so seriously, man.  And, if you're measuring yourself against your performance in this game in any serious way, you need to get a life.

[Soda]

Gotta go with Shane on this one.  Beating someone you should (because of your superior alt, or whatever) is nowhere near as good as beating someone you shouldn't (because you were at a disadvantage to start).  The only way to learn to beat people on equal, or worse, terms is to put yourself in those situations.  Sure, you'll die a bunch of times doing it, but you'll also learn a lot of tricks and get your timing on evasives which will save your butt.  Guys who cherry pick from high alt never learn those skills and once their alt advantage is gone they tend to have no option but to run.

Not saying you have to stay around in every situation like that where you are at a disadvantage, but I think it's a better measure of skill than simply climbing to an alt higher than anyone else and then fighting from there.  I know I never fly over 10K unless I'm chasing someone who is higher than that.

-Soda
The Assassins.

[acetnt]

Originally posted by Shane


nothing beats busting the 1 or 2 guys who have every advantage over you and sending them back to tower with a "you friggin' cheater - no way you can do that!" coming over channel 1.

If I could do that I wouldn't run

I agree that this may the way to learn how to truly dogfight but don't forget how frustrating it is when you're not that experienced like me, up a fighter, fly 10mins to a fight only to go down 5 sec later and then repeat this for the entire night.........

All I am saying is that I make up for my inexperience by coming to a fight with an advantage --- or that I will use any advantage I have in a fight -- I don't fly just to run -- hate running but I always like to set myself up in a good position for a fight......

[bustr]

Manx was very instructive to me one night of how E and alt are a false sense of superiority. And an additional strategy lesson not to follow his smoking PJ low over his ack while fixated on the kill. He judged me and I was found wanting due to my ego thinking I had an easy kill.

By the way, our first engagement he was in a Mossi low and I was in a spit9 hi with E. Blew my kester to peices. I thought it would be a cake walk.

Next night I stayed low around my feild and had more fun with a 262 than a cat with catnip. I was out of ammo but kept low trying to get him to auger. I even chased him while he was attacking other fiters to mess up his aim. Finally killed his c47 near the ground that he was escorting by clipping off the tip of my wing to kill one of its engins making it auger into a canyon wall (no ammo for last 10 minutes dueling with the 262). All of this while staying at an alt disadvantage and giving him my 6 at all opportunities to attack me. I augered..came up again after the 262 and it ran home. So I started attacking everything not "Green" over my feild. Lotsa fun.

I find if I troll and let people get close, I can get some good fites. Just need to play possum till they closer than 4800 and commited.

[nopoop]

Originally posted by rshubert
Really, really different.  Nopoop, this ain't a Zen experience, nor is it a martial arts contest

Ahh grasshopper but you are SO mistaken. Fighting well is a martial arts exersize. Think of it like judo. Using your plane and it's strengths to defeat a different plane with different strengths. Move and counter move. Taking an enemy that has the altitude and has the "plane" and breaking him down to equal territory where you can kill him is a martial arts in it's strictist sense.

I don't fly one hundred hours a month rshubert. If I bust 20 hours I'm flying ALOT.  I would suggest that I'm not the one that needs to get a life.  

I work on stuff. I'm working on reversals now, I find them difficult, but slowly I'm improving. To work on reversals you have to hang your bellybutton out there, you get killed.  And with that comes some great fights where I practice my craft. Have four reversals this tour so far, eventually died but I have "four" reversals. I'm improving.

I learned quite awhile back that I couldn't learn to swim in the wading pool. I had to jump in the deep end. Swallowing all that water sucks, but damn if I don't learn along the way.
 
Killing a con that holds all the cards is a wonderful thing, makes my day.  But it ain't zen.

Zen is eating a great cheeseburger.

Rare.

[Shane]

Originally posted by nopoop
I work on stuff. I'm working on reversals now, I find them difficult, but slowly I'm improving. To work on reversals you have to hang your bellybutton out there, you get killed.  And with that comes some great fights where I practice my craft. Have four reversals this tour so far, eventually died but I have "four" reversals. I'm improving.
 

if you see me up - i might be found in CT til pizza goes away, ask me to take you to the DA and show you some reversals.

on a side note:  you guys, lazs in particular, are missing some real great close fur in CT this week, even tho the planeset is kinda "uberish" it's pretty balanced.  there's even a zeke.... err spit9 for lazs...

spit14/p51 a very good matchup... then you have the f4u-4 and temp available to one side, with the spit9 being with the spit14 and the pony being with the former 2 planes.  bases pretty close, instense low level action... not too many 262's for the most part.

[nopoop]

Reversals are coming, tracking the con from the rear to the front during the reversal and then being in a position to kill him when he "first" pops out front is the challenge.

Tell you what, I never get bored with it.

[moot]

wait till your hat switch flakes out.