Author Topic: Light and darkness (US related post) (Read 1634 times)

Naso · « **Reply #30 on:** July 03, 2003, 03:20:27 AM »

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Originally posted by Dago
Oh, I guess the 618,000 that died during our civil war don't count?

Maybe having 50.000.000 and more dead in two wars (the numbers I heard are 19 mil for first and 52 mil for second), with an high percentage of civilians in the second is a better hint of what can be a modern total war.

I know, someone is going to beat me for this kind of "mine is bigger", but I have understood than the common US citizen have no real idea of what WWII has been here, and sometime is so difficult to.... let this fact fade in the darkness.

Naso · « **Reply #31 on:** July 03, 2003, 03:29:19 AM »

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Originally posted by Eagler
we as Americans do not think the Iraq war was "a dark period" nor will the Iraqis going forward

I purposely used the "dark period" because Iraqi war has been the first time an US action has been largely questioned even in allied nations.

it's undoubitably an obscure thing without a clear and definite cause and with still unknown consequences.

So it's obscure, not implying moral judgement.

Remember, I am one of the idiots that think that a war is not a just war, with the exception of self-defence.

And preceiding you objection, the US military invation of a foreign indipendent nation, it's not easy to define clearly a self-defence.

Anyway what is done is done, let's hope for the better.

Naso · « **Reply #32 on:** July 03, 2003, 03:37:12 AM »

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Originally posted by Maverick
Just thought I'd throw this little bit of reality in for your edification.

ALL food commonly found in a grocery store is genetically modified. This was finally put into scientific terms by a little fellow named Gregor Mendell. It is STILL being practiced by farmers and livestock breeders. Let's hear the collective gasp as reality sets in........

You really wouldn't be much interested in the stuff in its original form after being accustomed to the food you were raised on now would you?

Mav, strictly speaking, all the food his genetically modified, using an "artificially accelered natural selection" (nice definition!

).

In the actual research and GMs there are two big differences:

first: the patent, in the hand of the single subject.

second: the fact that (purposely or not) theese GM organisms are in maximum part sterile.

a powerfull weapon in the hand of subjects that notoriously have no interests of people's good, but only in money.

I must confess, this worryes me.

Naso · « **Reply #33 on:** July 03, 2003, 03:38:57 AM »

Anyway, how in the hell a "pat on the back" type of post have been hijacked in a "no-gm + Euro bashing" thread ????

You guys are amaizing.

ra · « **Reply #34 on:** July 03, 2003, 06:37:32 AM »

America just wants Palestinian oil.

Dowding · « **Reply #35 on:** July 03, 2003, 06:47:16 AM »

Maverick - we're not talking about using breeding to isolate desirable traits, we're talking about interfering with the genetic data itself and bypassing natural safeguards that would reject the outcome - THAT is the GM food I'm talking about, and very little UK food involves that process.

Naso · « **Reply #36 on:** July 03, 2003, 08:19:27 AM »

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Originally posted by ra
America just wants Palestinian oil.

ra, man, how are you, I was missing your jokes!!

Naso · « **Reply #37 on:** July 03, 2003, 08:23:09 AM »

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Originally posted by Dowding
Maverick - we're not talking about using breeding to isolate desirable traits, we're talking about interfering with the genetic data itself and bypassing natural safeguards that would reject the outcome - THAT is the GM food I'm talking about, and very little UK food involves that process.

Dowding, in my opinion (always humble, apparently

), the problem is not in the technology used (breeding or direct manipulation), but in the use, or better in the reasons behind the use of such technology.

Profit... mmm... =danger.

Martlet · « **Reply #38 on:** July 03, 2003, 01:09:17 PM »

Dang, until Dowding and Ra butted in, you had a great filibuster going.

AKS\/\/ulfe · « **Reply #39 on:** July 03, 2003, 01:34:03 PM »

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Originally posted by ra
America just wants Palestinian oil.

You sir, are wrong!

America just wants vegetable oil.

No blood for vegetables!
-SW

Vulcan · « **Reply #40 on:** July 03, 2003, 05:36:57 PM »

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Originally posted by Naso
Mav, strictly speaking, all the food his genetically modified, using an "artificially accelered natural selection" (nice definition! ).

In the actual research and GMs there are two big differences:

first: the patent, in the hand of the single subject.

second: the fact that (purposely or not) theese GM organisms are in maximum part sterile.

a powerfull weapon in the hand of subjects that notoriously have no interests of people's good, but only in money.

I must confess, this worryes me.

Quite incorrect Naso. More 'tradationally' modified foods also have patents. For example, I know the NZ Apple Board owns the patent on the Pacific Rose apple. I know they have enforced this patent as well (I think growers in Chile tried to grow the apples).

Naso · « **Reply #41 on:** July 04, 2003, 03:21:34 AM »

Vulcan, I dont know what is the NZ apple board, but I imagine is an association of all the apple producers in NZ.

Maybe I explained mysalf bad (as usual), but there's a big difference for me between a local or national organization (like the ones we have about ("the real napolitan pizza", or "the real mozzarella di bufala"), and a single corporation that sell you a seed with specific charateristics, sterile, and capable to deny, in various manners the use of your crop for other things.

It's like grasping you for the balls.

Modifying nature it's a dangerous playground, in both ways, and in this case I trust more the traditional way than the profit oriented new way.

Vulcan · « **Reply #42 on:** July 04, 2003, 06:01:03 AM »

I don't disagree, read further up on why I think the European GM bans are good.

I'm just pointing out it doesn't have to be 'modern GM'd to be patented.

threedays · « **Reply #43 on:** July 04, 2003, 06:44:59 PM »

well i realy dont know what are you celebrating here...

Afghanistan is in total chaos, only 1 safe city is Kabul

Iraq is in total chaos, more and more Us soldiers die every day
(today has been 18 of them injured)

Sadam is somewhere in the middle of nowhere
Osama is having dring somewhere in south america

anyway did anyone hear that cool story about annimal farm & CIA on BBS ?

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #44 on:** July 05, 2003, 04:32:43 PM »

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Originally posted by threedays
well i realy dont know what are you celebrating here...

Afghanistan is in total chaos, only 1 safe city is Kabul

They still killin' people in the football (soccer) stadium?

no.... this equals progress.

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Iraq is in total chaos, more and more US soldiers die every day
(today has been 18 of them injured)

Sadam is somewhere in the middle of nowhere

Chaos in Liberia, Mindinao, Kosovo, Columbia, Peru,...... Iraq does not seem to be an isolated case. And the middle of nowhere is a good place for SH.

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Osama is having dring somewhere in south america

Osama's in rio? really? and getting hammered?