Author Topic: HE-111 Crash  (Read 864 times)

Offline Dnil

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HE-111 Crash
« on: July 11, 2003, 12:34:25 AM »
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Central/07/10/bomber.crash.ap/


Don't know if its been posted yet here or not.  Sad.

Offline Modas

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2003, 12:36:56 AM »
Wow, that sux.  Is the AZ wing the same wing that flies Sentimental Journey?

Offline Karnak

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2003, 12:46:51 AM »
Damn.  That sucks. :(

Condolences to their families.
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Offline Fishu

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2003, 01:12:08 AM »
Yet another unrecoverable piece of the history lost, along with two lifes :(

Offline beet1e

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2003, 03:48:12 AM »
The AZ wing? Would that be connected with the place at Falcon Field,AZ?  I was there in 1998, and took this pic inside a H-111 cockpit - could it have been the same one?


Offline Duedel

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2003, 04:06:36 AM »
Very sad. My grandfather was pilot of a He111.

Offline CyranoAH

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2003, 04:15:48 AM »
While it's great to keep this old machines flying, I am growing more and more concerned about the safety of these airplanes, with little to no official replacement parts, and a condition that goes a long long way from "mint".

I was offered the possibility to learn to fly a Bücker-Jungmann but I have heard so many bad things about their condition that I may very well just say no. I'd love to, but when you talk to so many good pilots who say they don't trust the plane... makes you think.

Daniel

Offline Bodhi

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2003, 07:29:19 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by CyranoAH
While it's great to keep this old machines flying, I am growing more and more concerned about the safety of these airplanes, with little to no official replacement parts, and a condition that goes a long long way from "mint".


If you are in insinuating that because these vintage machines are rare, that they should be grounded, I suggest you educate your self as to why these aircraft are still able to fly.  THat is plain and simple, because private individuals (as well as some organisations) spend millions of their money to restore and maintain theses aircraft.  Therefore, it is THEIR choice as to whether these aircraft should fly or not.  Don't forget, had it not been for these enthusiasts, the only place you would see any of these aircraft would be in the Smithsonian or Dayton, as static displays, mostly long gone and scrapped.  

As for there being no "official replacement parts" that is far from the case.  Most operators of warbirds have a supply of replacements or, they seek out a certified DDR Engineer and come up with alternatives.  Last effort is to fabricate replacements.  WHich is being done more and more.  

We work long and hard to keep these aircraft flying, and are always striving for safety.  Unfortunately there are some who just do enough to get by.... if you want a better solution, support the FAA's "total compliance" program, it is there to force all owners to ensure these aircraft comply with all known literature and publications regarding the type.  It is a more expensive, but better idea, and will further ensure these aircraft are properly restored and maintained.  Unfortunately, there will never be a way to completely rule out incidents.  But this program is a step in the right direction, not a step in the opposite by forcing the aircraft to be grounded.

My condolences are with the families of the He111 pilot and his passengers, godspeed to them both.
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Offline Toad

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2003, 07:47:14 AM »
Bodhi, it's a well known fact that brand new, low time, medium time and high time engines never ever failed in flight during the war.

It's just since the war that engines have failed in flight.

So we must stop flying all warbirds.
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Offline straffo

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2003, 07:55:51 AM »
//I'm quite lazy to day  :)
Original french version :
Quote
Pour recentrer le débat ils serait peut être bon de regarder le nombre d'avions existant dans un type.  A savoir qu'il est plus ennuyeux de détruire un avion unique qu'un avion dont plusieurs exemplaire sont encore en état de vol


googleized version
Quote
To centre the debate they would be can be good to look at the number of planes existing in a type.  Namely that it is more tedious to destroy a single plane than a plane whose several specimen are still in in-flight status


(even tired I won't have wrote that :p)

Offline Krusher

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2003, 08:56:27 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by CyranoAH
While it's great to keep this old machines flying, I am growing more and more concerned about the safety of these airplanes, with little to no official replacement parts, and a condition that goes a long long way from "mint".

I was offered the possibility to learn to fly a Bücker-Jungmann but I have heard so many bad things about their condition that I may very well just say no. I'd love to, but when you talk to so many good pilots who say they don't trust the plane... makes you think.

Daniel


They have a He111 at Cavanaugh Flight in Addison. It is going to be fully restored to working condition and NEVER flown.

Offline Dnil

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2003, 09:55:25 AM »
yea same one beetle.  I had been around it to, many times.  I was at the airshow where the last A-20 crashed and when the P-82 cracked up on landing.  This planes are much more interesting in the air then in a hangar.

Offline Stringer

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2003, 10:06:37 AM »
Dnil must not be allowed to attend anymore warbird flyovers......see the pattern :eek:

Offline CyranoAH

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2003, 01:42:55 PM »
Bodhi, I'm well aware of the situation of these warbirds. The Bücker I mentioned belongs to the PAC (Aeronautical Fleet of Catalonia) whose only goal is to restore old and rare airplanes.

Having said so, it's very difficult to be absolutely sure that the restored airframe of such an old airplane is going to hold together in flight just fine unless you take it apart bolt by bolt, which is not the case in many, many airplanes.

I respect the work and will of those who spend their time and money on these warbirds. I was only stating the fact that I've grown concerned about the safety of the operation of these planes, that's all.

Daniel

Offline Bodhi

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HE-111 Crash
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2003, 07:53:05 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by CyranoAH
...Having said so, it's very difficult to be absolutely sure that the restored airframe of such an old airplane is going to hold together in flight just fine unless you take it apart bolt by bolt, which is not the case in many, many airplanes....


Daniel, that is plain and simply a crock of sh*t.  It is not imperative to take everypiece of an aircraft apart.  If the structure is properly inspected and X-rayed and / or Dye penetrant, or Electrically resistance checked, it is just as good.  We routinely leave structures together that do not have fasteners that are required to be removed to be inspected.  Bolts as a whole are removed and if specialty, checked then treated and placed back in the airframe.  

Do not babble out a blanket safety statement regarding an entire industry unless you are better educated on what makes it safe.  Cripes, seems to me all you non-mechanically incline pilots should be forced to get an a/p so you won't "know-it-all"  :rolleyes:
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