Author Topic: Thunderbolts: The Conquest of the Reich (Read 546 times)

SethK · « **on:** May 13, 2001, 01:18:00 AM »

Toward the end of World War II, General Hap Arnold authorized the making of a color film on the activities of his forward strike air crews as the Allies closed in on Berlin. Over the course of 60 days, film crews captured the activities of the 362 Fighter Group, which destroyed over 6,000 German targets but suffered a nearly 50 percent casualty rate as the camera rolled. Deemed too brutal to show to the public, the film was shelved-until now. With the help of four of the pilots who appeared in the unreleased 1945 production, The History Channel presents this never-before-seen film that captures the actions and emotions of P-47 Thunderbolt crews above Germany over 55 years ago.

•Airs Sunday, May 13 at 10pm ET/PT

tune in to the history channel should be a good one

MrSiD · « **Reply #1 on:** May 13, 2001, 04:44:00 AM »

Gosh, I wish I had that channel.. Sounds like lots of good stuff coming.

-ammo- · « **Reply #2 on:** May 13, 2001, 06:42:00 AM »

LOTS and LOTS of combat footage. Gonna be a goody.

Sancho · « **Reply #3 on:** May 13, 2001, 09:50:00 PM »

Never fear Mr. Sid. You can buy it online:

Thunderbolts: Conquest of the Reich $19.95

Hell hath no fury like 8 50 cals and 18 fire breathing cylinders.

rogwar · « **Reply #4 on:** May 13, 2001, 10:06:00 PM »

Just watched the program and it was really one of the best I have ever seen. The gun camera photage was awesome....great detail.

One thing interesting was they said they could kill Tiger tanks with a P47 by shooting their 50s just to the rear or very near and that the bullets would richochet from the ground and penetrate the armor underneath where it was very thin.

From there this might start a fire with the fuel, ammo, or damage other mechanisms. They actually had camera photage of them making runs on Tigers.

They also had a lot of detail regarding shooting soldiers and individual vehicles on the ground.

The P47 loses though were very high, nearly 50% as ground attack was a very dangerous business.

Next time I'm frustrated about getting shot down, before I replane, I'm going to pause to reflect a moment on those brave pilots who didn't make it back on all sides.

See you in the air!

Rogue out

CRASH · « **Reply #5 on:** May 13, 2001, 10:32:00 PM »

Cant believe the average life expectancy of the replacement pilots in march '44 was 2 missions....that's just incredible.

CRASH

Thunder · « **Reply #6 on:** May 13, 2001, 11:45:00 PM »

Just watched it.... Fantastic Domumentary on the P-47! Thanks to all for giving us a Headups on the airing! I never thought about horse drawn ammunition carts and Tigers pulling ammo behind them. Watching that gave me another perspective of that terrible War!

Salute

[This message has been edited by Thunder (edited 05-13-2001).]

llbm_MOL · « **Reply #7 on:** May 14, 2001, 12:18:00 AM »

Kool its coming on again at 1am. I get to see it

LLB OUT!!!!!!!!!!!

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #8 on:** May 14, 2001, 12:27:00 AM »

That Tiger strafing thing is a bit of a misconception. Apparently the pilots were uninformed that tanks had full armour underneath as well (that P47 pilot interviewed on the show said he thought tanks were unarmored under), so they thought this could work. In reality all German tanks had fully armored undersides.

For example the Tiger 1 had 26mm underside armor, while Panther had between 25-30mm underside armour depending on model.
This armor thickness is well beyond the penetration capability of WW2.50cals.
Plus the bullets would loose much energy striking the ground, and then after bouncing off would impact any horizontal tank understide armour plate an an extremly acute angle thus would often simply bounce off.
This didn't really work in RL.

The other thing they mentioned about strafing the small 2drum fuel carts that Panzers sometimes used is very interesting. As is the napalm idea.

SethK · « **Reply #9 on:** May 14, 2001, 01:37:00 AM »

grunherez were you there? did you fly a p47 in ww2?...i seriously dont that they are full if toejam...why would they waste ammo on a old wifes tale or misconception? obviously it worked or they wouldnt waste ammo.

Jekyll · « **Reply #10 on:** May 14, 2001, 02:41:00 AM »

SethK ... physics in 2001 is just the same as physics in 1944.

A .50cal round simply cannot, ever, ever, penetrate the armour thickness on a Panzer.

If it could, do you really think that both sides would have bothered developing 40mm and 37mm antitank cannon for their aircraft? Why not just outfit them with a brace of .50cal machine guns if that's all it took. Why bother building bazookas if a .50 cal round from a grunt's rifle can kill a Panzer?

If every pilot's claim of a kill in WW2 were correct, both sides would have run out of aircraft, tanks etc by mid 1941.

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #11 on:** May 14, 2001, 02:47:00 AM »

Sethk its very simple they didnt know it wasnt effective. Thats what im saying they were under the misconception that tank hull bottoms were unarmored so they thought it would work, while in reality it didnt.

One of the pliots on the show said that they shot at the tanks because the bottoms were not armored. But the bottoms are armored with between 25-30mm on Tigers and Panthers so it didnt work.

Fastbikkel · « **Reply #12 on:** May 14, 2001, 03:16:00 AM »

Damn, it is not for sale outside US and canada.
That realy sucks, i hate that!!!!!
I am a big fan of this stuff and can't even buy it!

Sorry to say this,

JG5FaBi.

Jigster · « **Reply #13 on:** May 14, 2001, 03:35:00 AM »

Aiming under the engine compartment did work occasionally, but not for the reason given. They were of course armored to protect from mines and infantry weapons.

But, German heavy tanks were pretty notorious for leaky fuel feed system, especially later on in the war when gasket and and other rubber components were of poor quality, so problems arose after overhauls.

Combine moderate fuel seepage with quantity of .50 cal API rounds a P-47 can expend, lighting off the under side of the tank and you can see it how this misconception got started

paintmaw · « **Reply #14 on:** May 14, 2001, 03:42:00 AM »

hehe that one guy said it was strange to see the horses they shot jump 20 ft in the air . what a mess

Author Topic: Thunderbolts: The Conquest of the Reich (Read 546 times)

SethK

MrSiD

SethK