Author Topic: IL2 FM vs. AH FM?  (Read 695 times)

Offline Rutilant

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« on: September 08, 2003, 08:21:15 PM »
It seems to me, that for some reason IL2 (Sturmovik, not sure of FB) has a much higher quality FM than AH? It seems much more realistic.. possibly from how it takes away from the  "flying-by-rail" feel AH seems to achieve. Mostly for me, it just feels more real, planes don't turn around in a quarter of a second like some do in AH (IL2 in AH takes about half a second.)

I dunno, really. I'de just like to hear some opinions, reasons why it feels so much better.

:confused:

Offline Shane

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Re: IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2003, 08:36:51 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Rutilant
It seems much more realistic.. possibly from how it takes away from the  "flying-by-rail" feel AH seems to achieve.


according to those in the "know" - people who have actually flown warbirds, "riding on rails" is the exact feeling.  these aren't your typical light general aviation planes where a fart will make it wobble.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2003, 10:27:49 AM by Shane »
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Offline MANDOBLE

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2003, 08:37:19 PM »
At least what is clear is that both sims feel very very different in every aspect.

Offline Shane

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2003, 08:47:01 PM »
has olaf, oleg or whatever the hell his name is, ever flown (piloted) a real warbird?
Surrounded by suck and underwhelmed with mediocrity.
I'm always right, it just takes some poepl longer to come to that realization than others.
I'm not perfect, but I am closer to it than you are.
"...vox populi, vox dei..."  ~Alcuin ca. 798
Truth doesn't need exaggeration.

Offline dracon

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2003, 09:27:44 PM »
Hmm......

Well I have both SIMMs.  Ground handling is very different.  FB is very sensitive almost spooky!  In the air I don't notice all that much difference.  Truth be known, the Graphics in FB are sooo good that I don't even need the combat to enjoy the flying.  Very immersive.

I would offer this:  We can't sit in either SIMMs planes, only at our desks.  Our sticks can be setup in both SIMMs to respond more to OUR expectations.  You may try re-configuring either or both stick settings.  Do you fly with "Stall Limiter" and "Combat Trim" in AH?  IN IL2/FB you must trim the plane manually.  This is difficult for me, I am only a Virtual Pilot.  An out-of-trim plane can be an ugly thing to control.

I doubt any of the game makers have flown more than 1 or 2 WWII planes if that.


Offline Rutilant

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2003, 09:35:26 PM »
Well, one thing for certain..

Takeoffs and landings are a hell of a lot more exciting in IL2! Wheeeee!

Offline Urchin

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2003, 09:41:33 PM »
Personally.... I don't notice much of a difference at all between IL-2 and AH.  I don't even notice a difference in the shooting... I can land a snapshot at 350 yards in IL-2 just like I can in AH.  Maybe people have their joysticks set up differently in the two games?

Offline Batz

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2003, 10:07:59 PM »
the fms are real similiar imo as well.  I cant hit the shots urchin can but even gunnery isnt that diffferent. You do find less spray and pray and d600+ kills but other then that they are similiar.

Offline Dead Man Flying

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2003, 10:23:01 PM »
The flight models feel the same to me as well.  I find that the restrictive view system takes getting used to, but actually flying the plane in IL-2 comes naturally after flying AH.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Tarmac

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2003, 10:29:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Batz
the fms are real similiar imo as well.  I cant hit the shots urchin can but even gunnery isnt that diffferent. You do find less spray and pray and d600+ kills but other then that they are similiar.


If gunnery isn't that different, why less spray and pray?  Something to do with the super-obvious AH hit sprites, maybe?

Offline Rutilant

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2003, 10:49:41 PM »
Well, there's an obvious difference in the stalls. in AH if you yank the stick, you'll snaproll usually. Depending on the plane, of course. Yank the stick in anything except the IL2 in Sturmovik, and the tail of your plane 'slides' under you and you begin to tumble to the ground in a stall.

I'm not sure which one is more realistic, but AH seems to have a very pronounced 'limit' of how far you can pitch instantly..

Anyone still following? I hardly am. :confused:

Offline Rutilant

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2003, 10:55:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tarmac
If gunnery isn't that different, why less spray and pray?  Something to do with the super-obvious AH hit sprites, maybe?


Lethality seems higher to me in Sturmovik.. The tailgun in the IL2 will quite often explode the offending plane outright.

Also, in realistic gunnery (i can only hope everyone plays on this setting ;)) the bullet spray looks more spread out to me than in AH.. at least compared to lasers and hizookas

Offline Kweassa

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2003, 02:21:57 AM »
The general feel of flight, I agree that it is pretty simular to AH. It's just the teensey bits of subtle differences that are just a bit more detailed than AH, that people come to enjoy when flying in FB. I dunno how exactly to describe it with words.... the feeling of 'momentum'... how the pilot's body and head moves with differing G loads... the slight buffeting in hard maneuvers.. the small contrails at the wingtips during hard maneuvers.. the slightly harder process dealing minor inputs etc etc..

 The difficulties in landings and takeoffs, however, are a bit more pronounced, and it gives the pilot a good immersive feeling. Landing the twitchy Bf109s really take more concentration, while planes with wide landing gears like the P-47 or the Fw190, feel really different. The characteristic differences of planes, are better portrayed, and it is an enjoyable experience to feel each planes are different from other - whereas landing and takeoffs in AH feels really generic, with the possible exception of the F4Us in AH.

 In gunnery, landing hits at distances between 350~500 are also possible, but the frequency is a lot lower than in AH, up to the point of not being practicll at all ... It is unlikely you will deal fatal damage with the 'long shots'(whereas the 'long' in AH, is defined further out, 600~800yards).

 In AH, if you are caught by something like  Hurri2C behind you at 350yards, you are practically dead, because that's the 'normal firing range' where you can expect to down planes. In FB, 350 yards is pretty much the limit you can expect to kill something.

 The differences in flying also have a lot to do with the views - it is like said, a bit too restrictive. But having no direct 6 views, and being forced to check left side and right side individually is a nice touch, and it really brings out some interesting situations.

 I don't think the two games are wildly different. But the subtleness of depicting the 'small stuff', generally ignored for gameplay purposes in AH, is in FB really immersive and impressive.. and the eye candy factor adds more convincing. Last time I was hit and got a fuel leak, I was forced to an emergency landing. As I landed and checked my plane, I saw the long white streak of fuel fade away, and the fuel gushed out from the side of my fuselage where it was hit... wow!

Offline MANDOBLE

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IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2003, 04:49:44 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kweassa
The general feel of flight, I agree that it is pretty simular to AH.


For me they are similar as far as both simulate planes, instead one planes and the other submarines.

Offline TimRas

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Re: Re: IL2 FM vs. AH FM?
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2003, 06:56:47 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Shane
according to those in the "know" - people who have actually flown warbirds, "riding on rails" is the exact feeling.  these are you're typical light general aviation planes where a fart will make it wobble.


That is right, here is a story of a Mustang flight:
http://www.wannafly.com/crazy_horse/ride.htm
The writer actually uses terms like "rock solid" and "tracks in the sky".