Author Topic: Brave or Stupid? (Read 1085 times)

Curval · « **on:** September 17, 2003, 12:08:44 PM »

Tough call

Tough call because it isn't an easy thing to evacuate one's home, particularly with only a Cat 2 hurricane.

BUT...they still have wooden homes.

THAT is where I consider them to be stupid.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #1 on:** September 17, 2003, 12:46:09 PM »

stupid.

brave is doing what needs to be done in spite of fear. not being afraid of a real threat or risking your life for no good reason is just stupid.

Quote

"A prayer for us all. It's God's will," said Lehman, 70

this quote reminds me of a story I told my kids (sorry for the slight hi-jack but it is on topic)

so this older woman is watching the TV one morning and there’s a storm warning. predictions of flooding, all residents from her area a requested to evacuate. she says a few prayers, decides God will protect her and stays home.

a while later her power goes out and it begins to rain hard. listening to her battery powered radio she hears that rains are expected to last several hours and flooding is immanent, and that shelters and evacuation points are being set up on higher ground, all residents are urged to leave immediately. again she has faith that God will answer her prayers and save her. she stays home.

around noon a neighbor shows up to urge her to leave. she refuses.

later that afternoon some volunteers show up in a truck knocking on doors trying to round up people who haven't heard of the danger or where unable to evacuate themselves. she tells them she's fully aware of the storm and the flooding but is confident that God will save her.

soon the waters are rising, her porch is under water and it's starting to leak under the front door. a boat with rescue workers in it pulls up to the house to save her. but again she turns them away.

now it's almost dark, the water is about 6' deep in her first floor, she's climbed out a second floor window and is sitting on the roof. a helicopter comes, dropping a line with a rescuer on it. she waves him off. again explaining about her faith and that she is confident God will save her.

shortly after another wall of water comes along and completely destroys the house. forcing her down in the ruble where she promptly drowns.

so as she makes it to heaven and and stands before God, she asks him. "I had complete unwavering faith in you, why didn't you save me?"

"Look I heard your prayers. first I contacted you by TV and radio, then I sent you a messenger, a truck, a boat, and a helicopter. exactly what do you want from me?"

Curval · « **Reply #2 on:** September 17, 2003, 12:58:18 PM »

lol...good story.

I don't know that I consider them to be stupid although I do not know what the risks are in the North Carolina area. Is it storm surge and flooding that is the real risks involved, or is it wind and collapsing houses?

I think the stupidity is in constantly rebuilding wooden houses in a potential hurricane area.

We have one of these "stilt" house in the Turks and Caicos Islands. When we were building it the contractors were doubling up on the hurricane ties holding the structure to the platform on which the house is built. They were a Canadian crew.

I asked the head guy what the point of the ties were. He said the house would withstand a hurricane of Category 4 or under. My father and I both laughed....and then bought lots of hurricane insurance on the place.

If you allow hurricane strength wind to get underneath a home...it is going to be gone. It is that simple.

Gadfly · « **Reply #3 on:** September 17, 2003, 01:11:07 PM »

I have spent quite a bit of time on the Outer Banks-they are stupid, trust me.

miko2d · « **Reply #4 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:09:03 PM »

Curval: I think the stupidity is in constantly rebuilding wooden houses in a potential hurricane area.

Only if it was done at their expence.

The real stupidity is taxpayers constantly footing the unconstitutional bills to rebuild the lives of people who voluntarily chose to live in dangerous areas.

miko

Fishu · « **Reply #5 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:29:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by miko2d
Curval: I think the stupidity is in constantly rebuilding wooden houses in a potential hurricane area.

Only if it was done at their expence.

The real stupidity is taxpayers constantly footing the unconstitutional bills to rebuild the lives of people who voluntarily chose to live in dangerous areas.

If they wouldn't be helped, the national economy would suffer.. I'm afraid.

Curval · « **Reply #6 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:37:34 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by miko2d
Curval: I think the stupidity is in constantly rebuilding wooden houses in a potential hurricane area.

Only if it was done at their expence.

The real stupidity is taxpayers constantly footing the unconstitutional bills to rebuild the lives of people who voluntarily chose to live in dangerous areas.

miko

Do you really consider the Carolinas to be a dangerous place to live? Why? Because a hurricane hits every 10 or twenty years?

Bermuda was hit badly a couple of weeks ago for the first time since 1987, before that was 1934, before that 1899, etc etc etc.

Is my home a dangerous place to live?

I don't disagree that the rebuilding should be borne by those states affected though, but I just don't see why the inhabitants keep building the wooden homes again and again.

An old expression reads, "Fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me."

Our houses are actualy built of materials that lessen the damage impact on the whole country. We learned...why can't these guys?

miko2d · « **Reply #7 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:49:05 PM »

Fishu: If they wouldn't be helped, the national economy would suffer.. I'm afraid.

Even if it were true in some partucilar case - when people are hit with an unexpected disaster, they should be helped. Preferably through methods not contrary to the Constitution. Helped to relocate and rebuild their lives elsewhere. If they decide to stay in the area where the danger is now known and expected - screw them. Let them buy private insurance.

Floridians knowingly decided to settle in hurricane-prone areas. Long-Islaneders in flood-prone one, mid-staters in tornado country, aspiring slaveowners in then-mexican Texas where their right to own slaves was not recognised., israeli settlers want to live in the West Bank, etc.
Every time US government has to step in and help people keep on living there rather then face responcibility for their choices at their own expence.

miko

Dune · « **Reply #8 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:53:04 PM »

When they force all the Californians to move, they can't stay in AZ. I want that settled right now.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #9 on:** September 17, 2003, 02:54:00 PM »

we have our own versions of morons here. we get these people who move up from california, they buy some property in the west hills, cut down the trees, and build a house.

first off, there's a reason why people built around and not on those areas for the last 150 years. second it rains a lot here and that tree you just cut down does 2 things, one the roots hold the dirt in place and second it drinks a lot of water.

so with the first really good strong rain, we get these mud surfers riding their new house to the bottom of the hill. another year goes by and some other fool comes up here, buys the property, and builds another.

if I could just figure out how to only sell the top 4 feet of soil it would be great. build a new house every 5 or six years, sell it, a few years go by and we get a new storm, start over.

miko2d · « **Reply #10 on:** September 17, 2003, 03:14:58 PM »

Curval: Do you really consider the Carolinas to be a dangerous place to live? Why? Because a hurricane hits every 10 or twenty years?

Bermuda was hit badly a couple of weeks ago for the first time since 1987, before that was 1934, before that 1899, etc etc etc.

Is my home a dangerous place to live?

I am a libertarian.
I do not care if people choose to live in dangerous places in flimsy dwellings, play dangerous sports or engage in unhealthy lifestyle choices.
As long as they or their private insurance pay for the consequences of their decisions, they have my blessing.

why the inhabitants keep building the wooden homes again and again.

Because doing so would be expensive and doing what they do there (like growing corn in tornado area) would suddenly be less profitable and not competitive.
Of course when the state provides huge rebuilding subcidies, the economic calculation changes.
Thos people are not stupid. They may not have money to build sturdier houses and they have no incentive to move while their posessions are "insured" by the taxpayer.

miko

Curval · « **Reply #11 on:** September 17, 2003, 03:19:15 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by miko2d
Thos people are not stupid. They may not have money to build sturdier houses and they have no incentive to move while their posessions are "insured" by the taxpayer.

miko

The incentive should be THE LAW.

You are simply not allowed to build a wooden home here..any house you build must be up to code and really be able to withstand a category 4 hurricane.

Yes it would be more expensive to build a home...tough.

Insurance rates would go down, as would all (or at least most of) the subsides you hate.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #12 on:** September 17, 2003, 03:19:51 PM »

who lives in a safe area? we have earthquakes here, some people have floods, tidal waves, hurricanes, muggers, deadly winters, tornadoes, heat waves that kill, whatever. every place has its risks.

pick your poison

Fishu · « **Reply #13 on:** September 17, 2003, 03:30:47 PM »

Miko,

I don't know much about bigger natural disasters, since Finland has quite a stable nature..

But I suppose the goverment doesn't just for free will support them, so must be something of more worth behind the reasons.
It could be interesting to take a look at the local economies and if these areas has some unique production etc.
Giving away the money to support people living there, isn't necessarily a wasted money, but could be something like an investment on a long run.

I don't know.. should take a look at the local economics.
Although I have no idea where from to look those... besides the flu bugging me at the moment.

Sikboy · « **Reply #14 on:** September 17, 2003, 03:33:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by capt. apathy

this quote reminds me of a story I told my kids

When I was at the Defense language Institute, one of my Russian teachers tried to tell us that joke during our first week of class. She tried to tell the joke in Russian Here I'm getting a grip on such phrases as "tam tank" and "Ya matros" and she's over here playing Conan O'Brian.

I still twitch whenever I see taht joke.

-Sik