Author Topic: Analysis of Aircraft Guns (Read 4116 times)

JBA · « **Reply #30 on:** October 05, 2003, 12:33:31 AM »

Bigger guns! We need bigger guns!" - line in unknown movie

Godzilla, I think

Karnak · « **Reply #31 on:** October 05, 2003, 12:48:00 AM »

scJazz,

I was thinking about what you are doing and remembered that I had done a similar test two years ago. I did a search for the thread and found this one:
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26470

I have punted it for you.

scJazz · « **Reply #32 on:** October 06, 2003, 01:18:14 PM »

The following is the current results of the tests and is complete for Aircraft mounted weapons. Some ground vehicles still need testing namely; Ostwind, Panzer, Tiger, M8, and PT Boat.

Gun Type Mounted On Rounds Dam in #
.30 M2 GV LVT 1600 0.3125
.50 M2 GV LVT 400 1.25
.50 M2 AC A20-G 427 1.17
12.7mm Ho-103 KI-61 501 0.998
20mm Ho-5 KI-61 149 3.36
7.7mm Type 97 A6M2 1686 0.30
20mm Type 99 Mk 1 A6M2 146 3.42
20mm Type 99 Mk 2 N1K2-J 130 3.85
.303 Browning AC Spit V 1685 0.30
20mm M2 AC P-38L 124 4.03
12.7mm UBS Yak-9T 433 1.15
20mm ShVAK Yak-9U 144 3.47
37mm NS37 Yak-9T 30 16.67
20mm B-20 LA-7 144 3.47
7.7mm Breda - SAFAT C.202 1788 0.28
12.7mm Breda - SAFAT C.205 525 0.95
7mm MG 17 109E4 1687 0.30
20mm MG-FF 109E4 154 3.25
7.6mm ShKAS IL2 1685 0.30
23mm VYa IL2 89 5.62
40mm Vickers S Hurricane IID 36 13.89 *
20mm MG 151/20 109G10 141 3.55
30mm Mk 108 109G10 43 11.63

* The Vickers S is the only weapon I am not 100% certain
of the full series of tests had very inequal results. The
value shown is the maximum damage inflicted per round.

scJazz · « **Reply #33 on:** October 06, 2003, 01:19:47 PM »

No the quote isn't from Godzilla can't remember which movie it is though.

Thank you for the other information sources. I'm going to examine them now.

HFMudd · « **Reply #34 on:** October 06, 2003, 01:54:14 PM »

The line is from a horrid 1991 thriller called "Split Second."

Why I happen to remember this, I have not the foggiest. But I find it rather sad and frightening.

Shiva · « **Reply #35 on:** October 06, 2003, 03:03:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by HFMudd
The line is from a horrid 1991 thriller called "Split Second."

And actually, if I am remembering the line correctly, the quote is:

"We need bigger guns. BIG F**KING GUNS! We're gonna go get big guns, right? That's where we're going, to get big guns. Stone, we need some big big f**king guns!"

scJazz · « **Reply #36 on:** October 06, 2003, 10:28:05 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shiva
And actually, if I am remembering the line correctly, the quote is:

"We need bigger guns. BIG F**KING GUNS! We're gonna go get big guns, right? That's where we're going, to get big guns. Stone, we need some big big f**king guns!"

Alright you two are actually starting to scare me. I think that the two of you are right. What is the title of the movie? As I remember it the scene takes place in a subway tunnel. Can't remember the actors, plot, etc. My blood brother and I refer to this line idea often and have for the last decade. The name of the movie is???

Shiva · « **Reply #37 on:** October 07, 2003, 09:37:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by scJazz
Alright you two are actually starting to scare me. I think that the two of you are right. What is the title of the movie? As I remember it the scene takes place in a subway tunnel. Can't remember the actors, plot, etc. My blood brother and I refer to this line idea often and have for the last decade. The name of the movie is???

The movie is "Split Second", starring Rutger Hauer, Neil Duncan, and Kim Cattrall.

Plot synopsis: London of 2008 where the city has become partially submerged due to rising seawater levels. Burned-out police detective Harley Stone has premonitions of a series of killings in which the killer eats each victim’s heart and leaves astrological symbols at the scene of each crime. (The same killer also murdered Stone’s partner). Stone is paired with by-the-book Glaswegian detective Dick Durkin and the two realize that the killer they are tracking is not human, that it may even be Satan. Realizing it has a link with Stone (as a result of it slashing him during the murder of his partner), the creature begins taunting Stone and then abducts Stone’s partner’s wife (with whom Stone was having an affair) as its next intended victim.

scJazz · « **Reply #38 on:** October 10, 2003, 08:51:05 AM »

OK here it is in the final version. All Ground and Aircraft mounted guns have been tested. This post can be used as a reference for damage in Aces High version 1.11 patch 4. When AH II comes out we can see what changes were made if any.

I'll work out a nicer, prettier version of this information and post it to a website when I find the time and energy.

Gun Type Mounted On Rounds Dam in #
.30 M2 GV LVT 1600 0.3125
.50 M2 GV LVT 400 1.25
.50 M2 AC A20-G 427 1.17
12.7mm Ho-103 KI-61 501 0.998
20mm Ho-5 KI-61 149 3.36
7.7mm Type 97 A6M2 1686 0.30
20mm Type 99 Mk 1 A6M2 146 3.42
20mm Type 99 Mk 2 N1K2-J 130 3.85
.303 Browning AC Spit V 1685 0.30
20mm M2 AC P-38L 124 4.03
12.7mm UBS Yak-9T 433 1.15
20mm ShVAK Yak-9U 144 3.47
37mm NS37 Yak-9T 30 16.67
20mm B-20 LA-7 144 3.47
7.7mm Breda - SAFAT C.202 1788 0.28
12.7mm Breda - SAFAT C.205 525 0.95
7mm MG 17 109E4 1687 0.30
20mm MG-FF 109E4 154 3.25
7.6mm ShKAS IL2 1685 0.30
23mm VYa IL2 89 5.62
40mm Vickers S Hurricane IID 36 13.89 *
20mm MG 151/20 109G10 141 3.55
30mm Mk 108 109G10 43 11.63
37mm HE Ostwind 33 15.15 *
7.9mm MG 34 Ostwind 1600 0.3125
37mm HE M8 31.2 #1
37mm AP M8 15.6 #1
75mm HE Panzer 156.2 #1
75mm AP Panzer 78.1 #1
88mm HE Tiger 234.3 #1
88mm AP Tiger 117.1 #1

* The Vickers S and 37mm HE Ostwind are the only weapons I
am not 100% certain of the full series of tests had very
inequal results. The value shown is the maximum damage
inflicted per round. I suspect that the variance is caused
by a bug in the burst dispersion code.
#1 Testing for the GV main guns was different. I fired 1
round into a hanger and constantly tweaked the hanger's
damage resistence until I found the maximum single round
damage.

TimRas · « **Reply #39 on:** October 26, 2003, 04:21:05 AM »

With the data above and knowing the strength of rockets the total ordnance capacity (in lbs) of the best fighter/attack -planes are as follows:

Bf110G-2....8628
P-47D-30....8038
P-47D-25....7036
P-38L.......6505
A-20G.......6457
F4U-1C......6348
F4U-1D......6056
MOSQUITO....5757
F6F-5.......5744
Fw190A-8....5666
P-51D.......5136
N1K2-J......4565
Fw190F-8....4427
Typhoon.....4257
IL-2........3956

scJazz · « **Reply #40 on:** October 27, 2003, 06:14:56 PM »

Thank you Tim... I had been meaning to post what is essentially the same list with 1 small change. As Soda pointed out the dropping of bombs is the most important aspect of the attack plane. Therefore I decided to create a formula that would reflect this...

Deadliness = Droppable Ordanance + (1/2 Gun Damage)

Using this formula the Top 20 list is...
P-47-D30
bf 110G2
A-20G
P-47-D25
P-38L
P-51D
F4U-1D
F4U-4
F4U-1C
F6F-5
Mosquito
190A8
Tempest
Typhoon
P-47-D11
bf 110C-4b
190F8
190A5
N1K2-J
190D9

Note the F4u-4 and 1D are tied.

Just looked at this list closely and realized the P51D is listed way to high... should be under the F6F-5. My bad!

Soda · « **Reply #41 on:** November 07, 2003, 05:03:11 PM »

ScJazz,
Did you ever test the 13mm MG 131 cowls on the LW models? I don't see them in your list.

-Soda

scJazz · « **Reply #42 on:** November 07, 2003, 08:06:01 PM »

Yes I did test them and yes they are missing... dunno why just are...

I'm not home right now. I'll look it up when I get back. The damage was just under 1.0 lbs per round from memory.

scJazz · « **Reply #43 on:** November 08, 2003, 12:20:23 PM »

OK after Soda pointed out the missing 13mm MG131 I went back over the list and found a few missing items. Note the Hispano MK IIs and Vs. I retested those today just because it was strange but the results are correct. I've also sorted the list by weapon caliber. Added to this list are the rocket damages as well.

All tested in AH 1.11 patch 4

Gun Type Dam in #
.303 Browning AC 0.296
.303 Browning GV 0.3125
7.6mm ShKAS 0.296
7.7mm Breda - SAFAT 0.28
7.7mm Type 97 0.296
7mm MG 17 0.3
.50 M2 AC 1.17
.50 M2 GV 1.25
12.7mm Breda - SAFAT 0.95
12.7mm Ho-103 0.998
12.7mm UBS 1.15
13mm MG 131 0.92
20mm B-20 3.47
20mm Hispano Mk II 4.03
20mm Hispano Mk V 3.94
20mm Ho-5 3.36
20mm M2 AC 4.03
20mm MG 151/20 3.55
20mm MG-FF 3.25
20mm ShVAK 3.47
20mm Type 99 Mk 1 3.42
20mm Type 99 Mk 2 3.85
23mm VYa 5.62
30mm Mk 108 11.63
37mm NS37 16.67
40mm Vickers S 13.89 *
37mm HE Ostwind 15.15 *
37mm AP 15.6 #1
37mm HE 31.2 #1
75mm AP 78.1 #1
75mm HE 156.2 #1
88mm AP 117.1 #1
88mm HE 234.3 #1
3.5" Rocket 140.0 #1
4.5" Rocket 93.0 #1
5" Rocket 156.0 #1
RS132 125.0 #1
RS82 93.0 #1
WGr21 200.0 #1

* The Vickers S and 37mm HE Ostwind are the only weapons I
am not 100% certain of the full series of tests had very
inequal results. The value shown is the maximum damage
inflicted per round. I suspect that the variance is caused
by a bug in the burst dispersion code.
#1 Testing for the GV main guns and rockets was different. I

fired 1 round into a hanger and constantly tweaked the hanger's
damage resistence until I found the maximum single round damage.

Karnak · « **Reply #44 on:** November 09, 2003, 12:13:40 AM »

scJazz,

You reallize that the Hispano Mk II and M2 20mm are the same exact gun, right? Testing both is simply duplicating your efforts.