Proof that Big Isles Needs to be Removed

[F1Bomber]

Big Isles
Bases Count = 254 Bases
Counted playable area = 400 squares
400 * 625 Miles( per Square ) = 250,000 Area in Miles
One field within 984 Miles

To Win A Side NEEDS to travers 1/3 of the land mass = 83,333 Area in Miles or 133 Squares
If Travering a square ( 25miles * 133 squares ) you have a distance to cover of 3,325 Miles Area

La7 Travels at 400Mph so to travel the full distance would take you 8 hrs JUST Flying



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Pizza Map
Bases Count = 210
Counted playable area = 210 Squares
210 * 625 Miles( per Square ) = 131,250 Area in Miles
One field within an area of ( 131,250 / 210 bases ) = 625 Miles

To Win A Side NEEDS to travers 1/3 of the land mass = 43,750 Area in Miles or 70 Squares
If Travering a square ( 25miles * 70 squares ) you have a distance to cover of 1,750 miles

La7 Travels at 400Mph so to travel the full distance would take you 4.3 hrs JUST Flying




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Trinity
Bases Count = 255 bases
Counted playable area = 255
255 * 625 Miles( per Square ) = 159,375 Area in Miles
One field within an area of ( 159,375 / 255) = 625 Miles

To Win A Side NEEDS to travers 1/3 of the land mass = 53,125 Area in Miles or 85 Squares
If Travering a square ( 25miles * 133 squares ) you have a distance to cover of 2,125 miles

La7 Travels at 400Mph so to travel the full distance would take you 5.3 hrs JUST Flying



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MinDanao
Base Count = 75 Bases
Counted Playable Area = 49 Squares
49 * 625 Miles( Per Square ) = 30,625 Area In Miles
One field within an area of ( 30,625 / 75) = 408 Miles

To Win A Side NEEDS to travers 1/3 of the land mass = 10,208 Area in Miles or 16 Squares
If Travering a square ( 25miles * 16 squares ) you have a distance to cover of 400 miles

La7 Travels at 400Mph so to travel the full distance would take you 1hrs JUST Flying

[F1Bomber]

This is not a whine but just some data to consider when building maps for aces high. Right now Big Isles field layout are taking up too much of the map, or they are too far apart from each other. For a team or squad to win this map it would take you more than 8hrs directly attemping to win this map. I vote that because of the design issues of this map, that it be removed from rotation and re-made with the following suggestion for the map.

Above you will notice that other maps still have the 20 * 20 Squar layout, but the major difference is that they have been placed into a much closer to each other. This promots gamplay and it makes it easyer to take a field, without flying most of the distance.

Also this is a perfect example of why small maps get rotated so fast. It would take an la7 1 or 2hrs to travel the full length of the map, instead of a full 8hrs like we have with  big  Isles. Some of the figures are off, but its only clearly to show that what the current problem of big Isles are.

( Time to wait for the heavy artilery to come along! )

[Kweassa]

Do we really have to win something?

[F1Bomber]

Not all players play the furball fight. Some squads play to win the map reset each week. The only problem with this map is the base layout and also field and spawn points for gv, do not make that possible. Unless you spend 12hrs to reset the map, then it is possible. But most people cannot stay on for 12hrs straight to win the map.

[moot]

take some patience and wait for TOD.
Big Isles is about as good as SFMA, mathematically or not.
Recent teamplay by the masses is nowhere near as good as it used to be, that's the real problem during large map rotations; that is, if you can't stand furballing.

[F1Bomber]

Big Isles is about as good as SFMA, mathematically or not.

it isnt mathematically, thats the reason why i put extra data on other large maps and how fast they can be reset. infact they can be reset in half the time of that of the Big isles map. If you want me to do the same test on the small SFMA map i can. But i think most of this  backup data i have given gives you a clear example of whats wrong with the big isle map.

[moot]

there's nothing so wrong with this map that it needs to be recalled by HTC (not likely to happen even were it twice as bad as Desert), except for the strat folks.

So it's a question of the map not suiting the gameplay type of a certain part of the crowd. But then there are always parts of the crowd that will be on the poles of one type of gameplay or another, so it's not possible to make a homogeneous map that makes everyone happy whatever the current map situation (strategically). It's pretty hard to make a map that would have all of its respective parts readily available to each respective part of the crowd, evenly scattered about geographically and independently of the map condition.
We'll see what happens with Fester's map.

back to the point, the strat problem would (most) easily be solved by better strat organisation from the player mass, but that's probably not going to happen so easily, what with entropy and laziness and furballing.

[F1Bomber]

Okay here we go.

there's nothing so wrong with this map that it needs to be recalled by HTC (not likely to happen even were it twice as bad as Desert), except for the strat folks.

This map is the hardest map to reset, because it covers a much large distance then any of the other big maps currently in rotation. Like my data shows, it will take 8hrs for a La7 to traverse the 1/3 of the map. This is what is needed to reset the other side. The Ak Desert is a good example of good field placement. It also promots different gameplay within the map. You can reset that map by simply taking 2 pieces of pizza from the map and then start moving onto the last side. Normaly rooks are down to 2 bases and the map get reset. The main problem with this map is, that it take so long to to get onto the main island of the rook or knights, if your playing bishops, that most players log off.

So it's a question of the map not suiting the gameplay type of a certain part of the crowd. But then there are always parts of the crowd that will be on the poles of one type of gameplay or another, so it's not possible to make a homogeneous map that makes everyone happy whatever the current map situation (strategically). It's pretty hard to make a map that would have all of its respective parts readily available to each respective part of the crowd, evenly scattered about geographically and independently of the map condition.

I am not talking about the gamplay aspect, i make direct reference to the size of the map to the placement of the fields. In the examples i have given above you will seee large size maps other than big isles have the fields centered close together near the centre of the map. WIth this map, all fields are spread accross that 20X20 square area. Its such a Huge distance for any country to cover. The only time i have seen it done when both the West side gang up and hit bishops hard to the East of the map. Also I like to point out, that the east side of the map, currently that bishops are on. Covers a much smaller land mass than both North and South islands.

back to the point, the strat problem would (most) easily be solved by better strat organisation from the player mass, but that's probably not going to happen so easily, what with entropy and laziness and furballing.

Organisation yes can reset the map, but it would take a min of 8hrs to reset the map, were other maps take half that time to reset. Even included pizza map, it takes half the time for a dedicated team to reset that map, compaired to big iseles. It isnt the player base that the problem, its that this map was design with the land mass first, instead of field placement.

[moot]

This map is the hardest map to reset, because it covers a much large distance then any of the other big maps currently in rotation. Like my data shows, it will take 8hrs for a La7 to traverse the 1/3 of the map. This is what is needed to reset the other side. The Ak Desert is a good example of good field placement. It also promots different gameplay within the map. You can reset that map by simply taking 2 pieces of pizza from the map and then start moving onto the last side. Normaly rooks are down to 2 bases and the map get reset. The main problem with this map is, that it take so long to to get onto the main island of the rook or knights, if your playing bishops, that most players log off.

Ok. What i mean by gameplay types, is strategically, you'd have a mix of the following in any proportion at any time in the arena: furballing, attrition to a country's resources, pure and simple land grabbing, furballing, etc even less seen forms of play like just having fun, regardless of strategic form. I agree with what you said, but,

I am not talking about the gamplay aspect, i make direct reference to the size of the map to the placement of the fields. In the examples i have given above you will seee large size maps other than big isles have the fields centered close together near the centre of the map. WIth this map, all fields are spread accross that 20X20 square area. Its such a Huge distance for any country to cover. The only time i have seen it done when both the West side gang up and hit bishops hard to the East of the map.

...gameplay isn't forcedly land grabbing (previous examples), so you could have a map that would stand for a long time, still be quite fun and so not need to be reset to keep the players happy. But this isnt infinite either since any map gets stale.
The question i meant to highlight by differentiating gameplay from pure and simple map resetting is what flavor fun?

Also I like to point out, that the east side of the map, currently that bishops are on. Covers a much smaller land mass than both North and South islands.

ok.

 

Organisation yes can reset the map, but it would take a min of 8hrs to reset the map, were other maps take half that time to reset. Even included pizza map, it takes half the time for a dedicated team to reset that map, compaired to big iseles. It isnt the player base that the problem, its that this map was desined with the land mass first, instead of field placement.

I don't know how long you've seen the MA playing, but the organisation of strategic strike forces is getting worse. Maybe it's invariably corelated to player mass, maybe it's just a one-way trip down the accepted path of least resistance, maybe it's just the maps; it's a false note to accept only one reason as the only cause.
It's also biased to say a map is bad because one portion of the population that wants one portion of what the map has to offer is not present to sustain the conditions to sustain its want/need. Not saying they shouldn't have their fun ready for them anytime they log on either, that's biased too.  One part of the players shouldn't dictate what the rest can or can't have.

I do think that if, strategically, the player masses were better organized, you'd see both the furballers (epic furballs with a motive to win and survive rather than arcade goals and satisfaction) and the strategically inclined (real warfare where competitive strategic choices dictate the tide of success) would find their fun, and the momentum of land grabbing wouldn't disappear when the strat players left.

/side note- i always thought this last balance is what HTC is aware of and aiming for with the mission arena, synchronised mission events, training to better pilot efficiency within groups, etc

[F1Bomber]

I am not going to talk about GAMEPLAY, its not what i posted this topic for. its that this map was design with the land mass first, instead of field placement.

...gameplay isn't forcedly land grabbing (previous examples), so you could have a map that would stand for a long time, still be quite fun and so not need to be reset to keep the players happy. But this isnt infinite either since any map gets stale.

I am trying very hard to stay away from the gameplay aspect of this topic, because you seem very intrested in draging me down to that area. Its about the map, the placement of fileds relative to the distances apart. The huge amout of land to cover, and in a reality time line. We both login, and only can spend very limited time online because of our real life. Having a map stay in rotation, that neither goes anywere, or gets reset makes aces high stall out and flop to the ground faster than a jug without wings.

I'm Asking for the map be removed from rotation, remade 1/3 the size or replacing and making better spawn points.

Gameplay is a subset of the map. Fix the map gameplay will follow.

[moot]

gameplay because it is what everyone is looking for, by their taste of fun.
Reset's final victory for one, furball for another, milking and scoring for another, kill streaks for another, vulching for another, just flying for another, dueling for another, can't please every one of those definitions of gameplay at once without a specialised solution.

if everyone loves the map, unlike the rest of those on rotation, the longer it stays (unless one's purpose is to reset), within the go-stale delay, the better.

the maps have been getting bigger so they wouldnt feel so cramped since the player volume multiplied; unless teams are unequal, if it takes a while to capture a field for one team because of one factor of map design or another, it's also true for the other to get it back.

Unless the maps go back to that cramped size, the only solution to pleasing everyone while still allowing for timely resets is to get rid of the inefficiency of players as strategic pieces.
Even the best designed and smallest map could be kept on with the proper amount of strategically improductive action.

Better designed strategic motions, without making it so anal and boring that everyone not passioned by this logs off, more impressive furballs without too much time wasted on strategically useless action to keep the "war" moving.

two birds one stone.

[F1Bomber]

OKay dont say i didnt warn you.

gameplay because it is what everyone is looking for, by their taste of fun.

Yes that is correct, but the current map doesnt support either gameplay as i will soon describe each point that i have allready layout out before.

Furballers
They love close fields, less time for taking off and also hunting down the target. I understand why people play this side of the game, its very fun. But only problem with this map, i have allready pointed out that the average field distance from each other are greator than 1 square.

Strat Players.
Strat players cannot achieve alot because most of the best targets are about 2hrs fly time to the main mainland of the rooks or knights homeland. The strat players can go and hit bases, but there is no re-ward system. Because strat players are there to win the reset not to play the furballer side of things. Strat players actualy make it better for furballers. Because when strat players are not around furballers dont get as many kills as when strat players are online. how? you ask take this typical example.

Strat player decided to reset the map, they get missions together they contact other squads for help for taking fields. Furballers follow these kinds of events because the high kill to death ratio. After some time, they finaly reset the map. The Furballers are happy and so are the strat players too.

the maps have been getting bigger so they wouldnt feel so cramped since the player volume multiplied; unless teams are unequal, if it takes a while to capture a field for one team because of one factor of map design or another, it's also true for the other to get it back.

I have only commented about single map, not all of them. Yes they have been made bigger to deal with the increase of customers that hitech creations have online each day. But I am saying that that big isles is a problem, because of feild layout and also distances from each other.

In effect by making some of the map bigger, without correct understanding of how aces high game play works. It has actualy had the re-verse effect , for example during peak time, there are battles to be found, but offpeak times its like feeling your tottaly alone. This has had a major effect on players for aces high. Some of the best sticks have left because of this direct result. And mainly Big Isels is one of the major reasons.

Unless the maps go back to that cramped size, the only solution to pleasing everyone while still allowing for timely resets is to get rid of the inefficiency of players as strategic pieces.

Yet again, i said Big ISels not all the maps! I havent recommend that the map be tottaly resize or all the maps removed from rotation. I have stated that Big Isels should, be removed from rotation because of poor design by the map maker.  If it was removed and then re-edited to enable fields to be closer, and better spawning locations, with additional re-think to the gv spawn points, and also land mass i would be happy to accept it. But right now this map cannot be reset without more than 8hrs constant work by a country. Just look at the data i have posted, have you looked at it? it would take a la7 just to fly 1/3 of the map to achieve a reset 8hrs! All the other big maps take 1/2 that time around about 4hrs.

By not allowing a reset, and increasing field distances and also land mass, your actualy having an re-verse effect on gameplay, that you seem so happy to get into a discussion about.

[Rutilant]

I'm a strat/furballer and all, but.. i refuse to be associated with this guy..

[Rutilant]

Oh, and.. Do you fly from one end of the map to the other, continuously, to reset a map? No, you don't.. You start, around halfway across.. Should a war be won In an hour, you think?

Honestly i think you call yourself a strat player, but really just want reset perks.. Because a strat player enjoys the process, bombing, divebombing, the works, you know? But you just want it all over with quicker..

[Kweassa]

Furballer? Me?

 ROFL

 Come to the Rooks sometime.

 I'll show you my Napolean Hat.