Author Topic: What is more realistic?  (Read 557 times)

RearGunner

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What is more realistic?
« on: May 21, 2001, 09:54:00 AM »
I've been playing AH for a couple of days, but I have been playing CFS (Combat Flight Simulator from Microsoft) for a while now. Now, both these games claim to have "realistic flight modelling" but I find major differences in the way the planes handle. The biggest difference is in CFS the planes fly smooth. They turn smoothly and nose up/down smooth as well. AH I find has a lot of bobbing and the plane seems to fight you every turn and change of nose attitude. Now, which one is the more realistic, smooth or resist? I would prefer real pilots to answer, but even non pilots who are experts on WW2 planes, because I know quite a few of you are. Unbiased opinions also please as people like me will never get to fly planes and will always have this doubt in their mind.

Offline Krusher

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2001, 10:07:00 AM »
much of the nose bounce in AH can be adjust out through proper joystick settings. It took me 2 months of tweaking to lose the nose bounce.

Krush

Offline Yoj

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2001, 10:13:00 AM »
Heya Krusher - care to share the technique?  I've been tweaking mine too and it's better but still not good.

Offline DB603

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2001, 10:32:00 AM »
S!

 Could use some basic tips to setup the stick for example 109 and 190(main rides of mine).
 About realism.CFS2 and AH are quite different in FM.Some moves that are possible in CFS2 are not possible in AH and vice versa.Hammerhead is one.In AH it is hard to do it without strange twisting and stall.In CFS2 U can do it more easier and make the plane turn without flipflop.Landings are more hard to do OK in CFS2 than in AH,same applies to take-offs.But comparing these 2 is not fair since both have so different approach of modeling things...I like both in their own way.




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Offline Octavius

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2001, 10:48:00 AM »
My stick is constantly bouncing and whatnot.  It was worse before, I've tweaked it many times and its *somewhat* better.  But its not as smooth as I'd like it to be.  Krusher, if you could explain what you did to perfect your stick, I'd greatly appreciate it!  

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Offline Tuomio

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2001, 11:27:00 AM »
Its probably their energy modeling differences. The bouncing of nose happens, when direction of movement and the direction of nose has too much separation. Then ofcourse direction of the plane is bounced back to movement, becouse the airflow pushes the wings to their optimum position.

This will happen in all movements; bigger G:s you pull, the bigger is bounce . Thats BTW why rudder always kicks back when you release it.

I find CFS2 flight model very annoying, since im unable to feel the energy state of my plane (thats why i deleted it after 2 weeks). To me CFS2 feels too relaxed and easymode. The direction of movement and the direction of plane nose seems to be quite a same thing in CFS 2; not realistic.

[This message has been edited by Tuomio (edited 05-21-2001).]

Offline Maverick

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2001, 01:49:00 PM »
Just a note.

Planes in real life DO bounce around IF you handle them roughly. A smooth hand is always appreciated by the passengers no matter how large the plane. An game emulating flight that doesn't allow for a rough ham fisted pilot isn't modeled correctly. Making the plane go where you want smoothly is a process of learning that doesn't happen overnight. Thousands of CFI's who ride with neophyte pilots can attest to that fact!!! Hats off to those who sacrifice their equilibrium to train new fledgling airmen (or women)!!!

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RearGunner

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2001, 03:08:00 PM »
Thanks for all the responses. I'm still slightly confused though. Now I'm not sure if it's my joystick settings or the flight model was designed to act this way. I can understand when you say that real planes do bob around when ham fisted pilots use em, but in AH I seem to move about a lot just turning into a bank or changing nose attitude by a few degrees. I have been flying Spitfires (in AH) and this plane was based on the Supermarine race plane so I thought it was meant to be flown quite violently, also the shape of the wing was designed for better manoeuvaribilty during extreme circumstances. That's why I'm going with the tweaking of the joystick that isn't set right.

On a different note, I don't know why a lot of people talk down CFS. I think it is an excellent game/simulator. I may not be speaking from a pilots point of view, but I have been playing flight sims for a few years. In CFS, when you change from flying a Hurricane to a Spitfire, you instantly notice the difference with better handling on the Spity, even though engine performance doesn't change much due to the fact they both had the same engine (RR Merlin 3) fitted. That's another thing that baffled me. For example in AH ,why does the Spitfire MK1 (1030 hp) have the same performance as the MK5 (1440 hp) and the mk9 (1710 hp)? Maybe I'm just nit-picking, but I would expect there to be a big difference from the MK1 to the MK9. You would notice 700 hp surely? Oh well, I suppose all games have their strong and weak points. I like the cockpit views more in AH than CFS, also another thing I like more with AH is that you feel that height gives you a great advantage over low planes.

Offline Swoop

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2001, 03:15:00 PM »
????

AH doesnt have a Spit Mk1.  Only the Spit MkV, MkIX and Seafire.  

 

RearGunner

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2001, 03:47:00 PM »
Sorry, I meant the Searfire Mk2. Even though, this is basically a Spitfire Mk1. Same specs I believe and the same RR Merlin 3 engine. Someone correct me if I am wrong please.

Offline DocFalconer1

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2001, 04:31:00 PM »
First, im a private pilot. And yes, planes bob. Mav, only planes w/ hydraulic controls give a real *smooth* ride; all WWII planes had mechanical linkages, so you DID have to put effort into a turn-as well as planes w/ mechanical linkages to the control surfaces do today.

Offline streakeagle

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2001, 05:56:00 PM »
Seafire MkII = Spitfire MkV + some weight for carrier landings  

Spitfire MkIX was a Spitfire MkV cleaned up to take advantage of the newer, more powerful engine
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Offline steeely

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2001, 06:53:00 PM »
make sure combat trim is off too,i have noticed at a friend's house (who uses CT) there is much more bounce using CT,i assume because it is constantly trying to trim you correctly during manouvers and at the end of them  

RearGunner

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2001, 06:58:00 PM »
Thanks for the correction. I don't really know much about the Seafire and considering that it's a Seafire Mk2 in AH. But I don't understand what you mean by a Mk IX being just a Mk V smoothed over for a bigger engine. In that respect, a Mk IX is a Mk I with a bigger engine. The only difference between a Mk I and a Mk IX is 40 cm in length presumably all on the nose to accomadate the bigger engine. They are all just versions of each other. But I think you should feel the extra 300 hp somehow.

[This message has been edited by RearGunner (edited 05-21-2001).]

RearGunner

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What is more realistic?
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2001, 07:00:00 PM »
I've tried switching off combat trim. I only feel a slight difference though.