Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: valdals on April 14, 2008, 09:03:52 AM
-
saturday i was flying a 262 at 12000 ft. i located a set of b24's at 5000 ft. i cut throttle rolled over and dove on the b24's. before i got within 2k my wing tips snapped off and i was not flying at too high rate of speed. i managed to kill one b24. i struggled to keep it flying. i had to use the rudder to turn right and left and my elerons to maintain level flight. the auto pilot helped alot. then some dweeb try to ho me in a 190 and i blew him apart. to end the story i managed to make it back to base.
i did not attempt to land. the 262 was in too bad a shape and i was about to lose a engine. i bailed. 2 kills to 1 loss of a 262. too big of a price to pay for only 2 kills. 124 perks lost. :(
-
You blew it! You rolled and dove 7000ft! Did you think your wing tips would stay on? I've made that same mistake in spitfires so don't feel to bad. Well other than the lost perks. :D
-
Yea, 7000ft is a rather serious dive. Even a P47 is gonna try to go supersonic in that one. One trick you might try is alternating application of full right then full left rudder as you dive. Kinda like an air brake. I fly 109's a lot. They suffer serious compression above 425 IAS. I use the rudder trick a lot to avoid augering.
-
Crying about 124 perks lost? Fly a 109E or P38G for a week....
-
A couple of thoughts:
- 124 perks is a discount price. It's almost as low as you can get, so no big loss.
- Me 262 isn't actually that fragile (apart from the engines). It's just very easy to push her over the limits. Seems you are learning the hard way that pointing nose down in this aerodynamically very clean aircraft let's you gain speed very quickly. You should have done a generous spiral descend with throttle full back and full rudder deflection. Watch your G-meter (no sudden control inputs!) and listen if you airframe starts to groan...
- Like with other planes, you will have to learn the limits. A smart way would be reckless practicing either offline or in TA. The less smart way is burning perks in MA ;)
- You should have attempted to land. If you bail, you plane is lost for sure. If you try to land, it's perhaps lost. You can land a 262 with no engine and no airlerons. It's not easy, but the only way to learn it is to do it.
-
I'd have to agree, the 262 is somewhat fragile, but I suspect it being such a radical plane for its time and its extreme performance, that some weakness is to be expected. As for bailing...... I would have tried to land it and maybe get lucky and actually land it or manage to ditch--which only causes you to lose half the perks.
-
You should have tried to land it. It can be done. I've put them in in deplorable condition. Why bail? Even if you crash and burn, youre gonna learn something about your ride. Landing the flame out Me262 with little flight control available is one of the funnest things to me. It's a major challange, and one, at least for me...luck still plays into the equation, but with practice, it gets easier and more fun, and you gain alot of knowledge about the characteristics of the a/c.
-
Agreed... The 262 was a generation ahead of anything else in WW2 (albeit in aircraft deployed in combat) the Luftwaffe suffered serious losses of both aircraft and pilots during TRAINING when transitioning "prop" pilots into a twin jet. I have read the stats but am at work now and don't have time to look them up and post them here.
In AH it is a good rule of thumb to keep an eye on the instruments... High speed, high wing loading and radical manuvers equal a quick trip to the tower when flying a 262... A 38L or 109 will quickly become a lawn dart under those same circumstances.
-
i have dove on guys that are mabe 1 or 2k off the ground from 15,000 before and have had no problem with my 262 comeing apart at 650mph, just don't yank on the stick real hard and yallul do just fine :)
-
Anyone who wants to fly the 262 in a radical manner should come to the Tuesday AHXARL race at 10EST this week.
262s at night thru a bomber hanger pulling 5-6gs 50 feet off the deck. :rock :rock
Best part.....there free!
Strip
-
262 is flyable and landable with both wing tips ripped off. In fact it doesnt even make a huge differance in how the fool thing flies. It does make it a bit harder to get slowed down to landing speed, but if I can do it......anyone can.
First Rule of Thumb...almost always chop throttle completely if you are planning a 7000' dive in anything. And see Carwash's post above.
Second Rule of Thumb...Always chop throttle in a 262 if the nose is pointed down, always. And even then watch the airspeed indicator, it doesnt give you any warning about compression. If the cockpit starts to shake its already too late unless you have a lot of air below you and your AoA is relatively gentle.
-
Crying about 124 perks lost? Fly a 109E or P38G for a week....
Another thing...I just lost 250 perks not too long ago to a spraying IL2 from 1K out...got a lucky hit w/his cannon and lit me on fire...I just lawn darted the field and killed the ord...I didn't cry about it...Just gives me a reason to fly 40ENY planes.
-
landing was impossible due to the fact that the 262 had no flaps and no turn capability other than use of rudder and ailerons for lift. even with the wings intact i cant land with one engine. tried it and rolled into the ground. if the 163 had range i would rather use it.
-
Landing with one engine is pretty easy, you just have to use some rudder or trim your rudder to compesate for the loss of thrust from one engine. Landind with wing tips gone can be tricky but the flaps are still there and you can actually stear the plane by adjusting the thrust from each engine seperately. Ever looked up how they landed the passenger liner in Souxe City, IA with all the controls gone?
-
even with the wings intact i cant land with one engine. tried it and rolled into the ground.
Most probably you gave some thurst with the remaining engine in the last moments. That's a thing you shouldn't do. Land it like a 163, without any thrust. Plan anhead and try to be under 200 mph at the beginning of the runway. I'll try to see if I can dig up some films doing this.
-
The way I like to use the 262, and it seems to work alot, is take off in a prop plane and check out the fight. If the enemy is all low then I'll take a 262 in low and fast. If they are high then I'll take it in high. I try to avoid diving with the 262 if I'm already at 400 mph because of the risk of snapping the wings off. I did land 2 262's with no wingtips before, but it's a real pain in the arse!
-
http://www.youtube.com/user/shaunyman
love the first part with the wing tips gone. <S> shauny!
-
Landing with one engine is pretty easy, ...
Ever looked up how they landed the passenger liner in Souxe City, IA with all the controls gone?
Landed???!!???
I recall that DC10 cartwheeling across the airport in FLAMES with half the PAX dying! The miracle was that ANYBODY survived! It was a great example of pilotage to get that aircraft into a position to "land"!
BTW it was Souix City, IA
-
i guess thats better then me killing it in my pony or my Dora :D
-
well,
using it in thr right way
http://www.loose-deuce.net/pics/Parrots262_2.wmv
remember, only luftwaffe experts were allowed to fly it, those are all got more than 60 kills
-
saturday i was flying a 262 at 12000 ft. i located a set of b24's at 5000 ft. i cut throttle rolled over and dove on the b24's. before i got within 2k my wing tips snapped off and i was not flying at too high rate of speed. i managed to kill one b24. i struggled to keep it flying. i had to use the rudder to turn right and left and my elerons to maintain level flight. the auto pilot helped alot. then some dweeb try to ho me in a 190 and i blew him apart. to end the story i managed to make it back to base.
i did not attempt to land. the 262 was in too bad a shape and i was about to lose a engine. i bailed. 2 kills to 1 loss of a 262. too big of a price to pay for only 2 kills. 124 perks lost. :(
Hahahahahahahahahaha!
-
I tried fling a p38 the other day.....dove dove shake dove shake some more ..can't pull out! scream!!!!!!!!!1 THUMP!!!
999 last seen walking back to the bomber hanger!
<S>999000
-
ive done something i dont think anyone in the game has done :D
i popped the wings on a 190A8...haha :furious :furious :furious
but i was blitzed real bad
-
One trick you might try is alternating application of full right then full left rudder as you dive. Kinda like an air brake. I fly 109's a lot. They suffer serious compression above 425 IAS. I use the rudder trick a lot to avoid augering.
It's more effective to apply full rudder to one side with opposite aileron. That forces the side of the fuselage into the airstream which is what actually acts as a brake. Alternating rudder will leave you in a normal (non-slip) aspect every time you cross center with the rudder causing momentary acceleration. In fact, the only time you will have full slip-braking is at the far end of the rudder.
-
ive done something i dont think anyone in the game has done :D
i popped the wings on a 190A8...haha :furious :furious :furious
but i was blitzed real bad
dude.. last night I was climbing up next to a set of B24's in a A8. I went afk for a min to grab a drink, and I came back to find out I was co alt and 600ft to the side of them. I tried to roll out but was too late and I got blasted to hell.
It killed my engine and knocked off both wing tips. I glided that plane all the way back to the base from 15k, only to clip the hill just before the runway. The plane was getting to slow and started dropping too fast. As much as I've flown A8's it's the first time I ever knocked both wing tips off..
(http://www.wargamerx.com/temp/clip-wing-190.jpg)
-
lol, wow, go to the training arena, by the time u went down 7,000ft u prolly b going over 800 mph, and then u try and pull up bam wings gone
-BigBOBCH
-
Crying about 124 perks lost? Fly a 109E or P38G for a week....
A week, maybe a day or two. They are great perk builders.
:aok
-
landing was impossible due to the fact that the 262 had no flaps and no turn capability other than use of rudder and ailerons for lift. even with the wings intact i cant land with one engine. tried it and rolled into the ground. if the 163 had range i would rather use it.
Just to clarify here...if you're missing your wingtips you're missing your ailerons which are attached to the wing tips. You're limited to rudder and elevators. Landing can be done with no wingtips and only one engine but you have to set up for a long straight in, avoid turns into the dead engine and stay about 150mph until you can cut the remaining engine and glide it in.
As far as fragility is concerned, it's not. Take the plane out in off-line and dive it. You'll see it'll accelerate faster than any other plane in the AH inventory except perhaps the 163 and all airplanes have a red-line airspeed. It'll go much faster than any other airplane without shedding parts so in many ways it's much stronger. However, available G is directly related to speed and at the speeds the 262 can achieve even a small pitch input can cause the g-meter to spike well above 6g's...that's what's taking the wingtips off. It's not that the airplane is fragile, it's that it can get pretty damn fast compared to what you're used to.
-
Landing with one engine is pretty easy, you just have to use some rudder or trim your rudder to compesate for the loss of thrust from one engine. Landind with wing tips gone can be tricky but the flaps are still there and you can actually stear the plane by adjusting the thrust from each engine seperately. Ever looked up how they landed the passenger liner in Souxe City, IA with all the controls gone?
The other option for landing with one engine is simply to shut the other one down on approach and just glide her in
-
The other option for landing with one engine is simply to shut the other one down on approach and just glide her in
I find that the best way to land even with both engines operational. You just can't slow down even with them idling.
-
I would have tried to land it and maybe get lucky and actually land it or manage to ditch--which only causes you to lose half the perks.
I don't think this has ever been true. It's all or nothing.
-
The other option for landing with one engine is simply to shut the other one down on approach and just glide her in
I always kill the engines on a 262 b4 landing anyway. Hell I landed a clipped with 262 tonight.
-
I don't think this has ever been true. It's all or nothing.
It is true. Ditch= half perks lost.