Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Mak333 on August 08, 2008, 04:40:37 PM
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I am knowledgeable in the generics of computers, mainly hardware. However, I know little about game engines and how they are integrated/work. Being a member for a lengthy amount of time, it seems that not much as changed since AH1 back in 2002. Slightly different physics and gun model? Newer textures, base layouts, and arenas. However, graphics and overall gameplay appears to be the same since 2002/2003, and most likely even since AH1 launched.
With new game engines arising and much more advanced games coming out that support new features, is Aces High due for a revamp? I mean, I can't compare it to games like Crysis, IL2, and other newer flight sims or first person shooters, but should we be seeing a new engine in the near future? I understand that massive multiplayer online games are much different than those that only allow 32 players, but coming up on a decade of the same engine and graphics.... well, that's a long time without much change.
Is today's technology able to handle a newer game engine while still allowing 750 per arena?
Is HiTech Creations in a position to rework the game?
Still haven't heard much about the new gametype that is based around missions only, but is that still in the works and what kind of outlook do we really have on it?
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Prepare for:
you cant update AHs graphics, all the people with pre 2000 PCs who play will suffer, you cant expact gamers to upgrade their equiptment to keep up with technology, thats crazy.
Your a lame player because you want eye candy, you suck because you should play for the tactics involved, not the graphics, go away quake boy.
lets see.. there are a few more that you will hear, cant think of them right now..
might wanna [asbestos]
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what other sim games do you know that you can use three monitors YAY cant wait
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Fully immersive virtual reality 3 D environment with an integrated user interface and two-way sensory feedback system. Think Lawnmower man...That's where everything is heading. It's already finished R&D it's just not refined enough yet for affordable retail distribution and applications. Give it another 5 to 8 years.
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As wingnutt mentioned, right now its because some players have older computers and are not interested in a massive upgrade simply to play this game. I also think a split game engine isn't feasible. For example, low-end users download and install the current version of AHII, high-end users download and install the new version of AHII using an advanced game-engine for better graphics, sound, etc... Yet both the low-end and high-end users play in the same arena.
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On this point Den, I would have to disagree. I bought my my mother an of the shelf Dell 6 months ago with no graphics card and nothing fancy for 750.00 and it runs AH well enought to be very competitive. I think the only people who are using old comps to play this game are the people that have been here for a few years. I know for a fact that Wonder, and others in our squad, had a POS system on dial-up for many years and some still are, and are able to do better than a lot of us with newer systems. It really comes down to skill as the game does not really require much.
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Prepare for:
you cant update AHs graphics, all the people with pre 2000 PCs who play will suffer, you cant expact gamers to upgrade their equiptment to keep up with technology, thats crazy.
Your a lame player because you want eye candy, you suck because you should play for the tactics involved, not the graphics, go away quake boy.
lets see.. there are a few more that you will hear, cant think of them right now..
might wanna [asbestos]
Most perople in this game run very good computers. I myself am running a 2gig AMD athlon , with a integrated video card. I dont have the best but i dont have the absolte worst. My frames run around 30s 40s and 20s in smokey areas. Compare that to most aces high computers that people use its a piece of garbage. most people have a 512 MB vid card , which is great , 2 gigs of memory which is all game recognizes , and finally most now adays run a dual cor. Thats the average joe. Now , the nerds. A nerd has about a 2k computer. Dual cor processor , 2 gig graphic card and 4 gigs of memory. That system would be able to handle anything really. And I even no some guys that have the best PC on the market. 1 quad cor , with 16 Gigs of ram and 2GB graphic card. His frames run about 120 steady , with Vsink on. If he turned it off itd be in the 400 to 500s. That kind of a comp could handle anything and still be way way way top of the line.
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Hopefully they will get rid of high ploss 56k users before anything else
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Most perople in this game run very good computers. I myself am running a 2gig AMD athlon , with a integrated video card. I dont have the best but i dont have the absolte worst. My frames run around 30s 40s and 20s in smokey areas. Compare that to most aces high computers that people use its a piece of garbage. most people have a 512 MB vid card , which is great , 2 gigs of memory which is all game recognizes , and finally most now adays run a dual cor. Thats the average joe. Now , the nerds. A nerd has about a 2k computer. Dual cor processor , 2 gig graphic card and 4 gigs of memory. That system would be able to handle anything really. And I even no some guys that have the best PC on the market. 1 quad cor , with 16 Gigs of ram and 2GB graphic card. His frames run about 120 steady , with Vsink on. If he turned it off itd be in the 400 to 500s. That kind of a comp could handle anything and still be way way way top of the line.
You're far overestimating this. There are many people who play on ancient machines. I've got a guy in my squad that plays on dial up.
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There are many people who play on ancient machines. I've got a guy in my squad that plays on dial up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMLH_QyPTYM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMLH_QyPTYM
:rofl
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Prepare for:
you cant update AHs graphics, all the people with pre 2000 PCs who play will suffer, you cant expact gamers to upgrade their equiptment to keep up with technology, thats crazy.
Your a lame player because you want eye candy, you suck because you should play for the tactics involved, not the graphics, go away quake boy.
lets see.. there are a few more that you will hear, cant think of them right now..
might wanna [asbestos]
Doesn't cost much to enter the 21st century... These people don't have any problems shelling out 700 on ch products, for 700 u could build a pc which would blow AH out of the water.
Yeah, people stuck in 10 years ago land tend to suffer seeing as time and technology moves forward and not backwards.. thank fk for that though..
I'm glad they're finally adding proper 16:10 support. It's been killing me.
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Prepare for:
you cant update AHs graphics, all the people with pre 2000 PCs who play will suffer, you cant expact gamers to upgrade their equiptment to keep up with technology, thats crazy.
Your a lame player because you want eye candy, you suck because you should play for the tactics involved, not the graphics, go away quake boy.
lets see.. there are a few more that you will hear, cant think of them right now..
might wanna [asbestos]
Pre 2000 PCs? Are you kidding me? Professionals say that every family household should upgrade every 4-5 years. And now, it's becoming even sooner than that. That 4-5 year figure was years ago in the late 90s and early 2000s. I'm surprised people are still operating on 8+ year old machines with today's average file sizes and processor requirements. If they have 15 dollars a month to play an online video game, they should be able to upgrade their PC from 8+ years ago.... I'm not asking for just eye candy, I'm asking for an updated engine that somewhat competes with other games out there. Keeping in mind this is still a massive multiplayer game, it should be feasible. The Aces High community is not what it used to be even 3 years ago. I have seen more and more 2 weekers than ever before. What does this mean? People are using up the trial and abandoning the game. Why? I can't tell ya their specific reasons, but I will tell you that an updated engine would help the situation.
I can't even remember when Hitech Creations first said they were developing this new gametype with mission-based sorties. Was it more than 3 years ago? That's a long time to just be developing a new game type. I'm not saying that the company should have something in the works already, but it would be nice to know what the plans are for the next couple years. If they haven't even hit the planning stages, then it could be another 4-5 years before anything "new" comes out. And I'm not talking about updates.
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Lets see.. bring AH to the bleeding edge of PC tech in an already small market.
Or a more than expectable graphics with a top notch flight model that requires average pc power to run.
Yea I'm sure this is a hard decision for HT to make. :rolleyes:
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Yes, high speed internet is the bleeding edge of computing :rofl
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Yes, high speed internet is the bleeding edge of computing :rofl
A stable dial up connection is all that is needed to play this game, ask skuzzy. I'd rather have that than shady hispeed connection.
Packet loss is the problem not bandwidth. Or don't you get that an electrical signals travel at the same speed whether its carrying 56k or 3megs?
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yea, bandwidth has nothing to do with mmo games, your 56k modem from 1990 is fine, no worries sorry I was wrong
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yea, bandwidth has nothing to do with mmo games, your 56k modem from 1990 is fine, no worries sorry I was wrong
Are you thick I stated for this game. Thats the way HT designed it. I'm guessing it's not your mind that's
"nimble".
Ohh and I'll add.
Not much can be done about the lag Knfe. That is just the nature of this type of Internet service.
It would probably cause lost connections as well, due to the incredible latency.
These types of services are just not very good for any type of real-time service from the Internet.
Wish I had better news for you. You would be a lot better off with a dial-up connection for gameplay as speed is not as critical as latency is.
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what other sim games do you know that you can use three monitors YAY cant wait
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Just about any.
Matrox Triple Head is just a step up from a normal dual splitter to triple and does a good job. So instead of using multiple video cards for the same result, you can take the cheap option and buy a little black box that does the same thing. Though like any cheap option it has a drawback, if you run something like FSX with Triple Head it puts a strain on a single GPU and hit on frame rates as your effectively running at a much bigger resolution. All that AH have done is release widescreen support so that the gauges no longer become egg shape, the triple head is nothing special.
<S>...-Gixer.
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A stable dial up connection is all that is needed to play this game, ask skuzzy. I'd rather have that than shady hispeed connection.
Packet loss is the problem not bandwidth.
You'd rather have dial-up then broadband... Your kidding right??? :rofl
<S>...-Gixer
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Are you thick I stated for this game. Thats the way HT designed it. I'm guessing it's not your mind that's
"nimble".
Yea, I was lost by your highly scientific reply about those crazy electrical signals, sorry
You'd rather have dial-up then broadband... Your kidding right??? :rofl
Well it doesn't matter because all connections are the same, the electrical signals all travel at the same speed so it doesn't matter whether you have cable or a 56k for online gaming.
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Bronk, I never said I expected a high-end game here. Although I do think Hitech Creations may be able to rework the engine from 10 years ago... We're talking a decade on basically the same game.
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You'd rather have dial-up then broadband... Your kidding right??? :rofl
<S>...-Gixer
I'd rather have a stable dial up than a flaky broadband for this game. As an extreme example play this game on satellite broadband and you'll complaints about warps from everyone.
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I'd rather have a stable dial up than a flaky broadband for this game. As an extreme example play this game on satellite broadband and you complaints about warps from everyone.
56k beats out all flaky broadband connections this is true, until someone picks up the phone. Man I hate it when people do that! And don't get me started on call waiting!
Bronk in his wisdom has totally changed my mind, and to prove it I give you Ted Stevenson on the subject. I didn't realize it was all just a series of tubes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f99PcP0aFNE&feature=related
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Yea, I was lost by your highly scientific reply about those crazy electrical signals, sorry
Well it doesn't matter because all connections are the same, the electrical signals all travel at the same speed so it doesn't matter whether you have cable or a 56k for online gaming.
Because your hard of reading try reading it slowly now.
Not much can be done about the lag Knfe. That is just the nature of this type of Internet service.
It would probably cause lost connections as well, due to the incredible latency.
These types of services are just not very good for any type of real-time service from the Internet.
Wish I had better news for you. You would be a lot better off with a dial-up connection for gameplay as speed is not as critical as latency is.
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Nimble,Violent By Design.... Ignorant by choice.
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Nimble,Violent By Design.... Ignorant by choice.
Yes, that quote from 2001 is still relative to the internets today, seriously it's true. Broadband absolutely has much higher latency than dialup. Now that I have tested it, I get like 1200ms on my broadband and like 68ms on the 56k I just invested in.
Oh wait
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I'd rather have a stable dial up than a flaky broadband for this game. As an extreme example play this game on satellite broadband and you'll complaints about warps from everyone.
Satellite broadband? Yes that is an extreme example. Download via dish and upload via telephone wire? Yes I'm sure a good rain storm would cause warps just like it does for my TV and from a work perspective our wireless networks, one good thunderstorm and we have timeouts and packet losses everywhere.
Stable dial-up yes I guess if your comparing it to no connection at all or a very bad one. But if you can get a stable dial up there is no reason in the world why you can't get a stable basic broadband connection to do the same. All you need is ISP support,switch at the local exchanage and thats it. Router/Modem wise same deal with any hardware. RTFM set it up once and thats it.
If I compare the issues I use to have back in the 90s with dialup compared to broadband it's chalk and cheese, router is rock solid and thats with ADSL 2 which is also being used for VOIP at same time.
<S>...-Gixer
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Yes, that quote from 2001 is still relative to the internets today, seriously it's true.
What they didn't have broadband in 01? Crap verizon has been billing me for dsl all this time.
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Satellite broadband? Yes that is an extreme example. Download via dish and upload via telephone wire? Yes I'm sure a good rain storm would cause warps just like it does for my TV and from a work perspective our wireless networks, one good thunderstorm and we have timeouts and packet losses everywhere.
Stable dial-up yes I guess if your comparing it to no connection at all or a very bad one. But if you can get a stable dial up there is no reason in the world why you can't get a stable basic broadband connection to do the same. All you need is ISP support,switch at the local exchanage and thats it. Router/Modem wise same deal with any hardware. RTFM set it up once and thats it.
If I compare the issues I use to have back in the 90s with dialup compared to broadband it's chalk and cheese, router is rock solid and thats with ADSL 2 which is also being used for VOIP at same time.
<S>...-Gixer
Gixer.
I can remember fairly recent posts in the Tech support forum where people were having issues with a broadband provider. I think it was comcast but not sure. They all were experiencing warps associate with packet loss.
I'll agree I prefer my 3m dsl, very stable with good ping times to servers. It still doesn't change the fact a stable connection is better than a flaky one.
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I'd take gameplay over graphics any day. And Aces High's flight model is the reason I started playing this game.
With that said, this game's engine is showing it's age. I can definitely see how the look of this game would turn a lot of people away. I understand some people play only this game and don't want to upgrade just for it. But a gamer is a gamer. And gamers have to upgrade every couple years. That's just the way it is.
I love this game, but the graphics leave much to be desired. And it's just gonna get worse and worse the longer HTC waits.
Are you thick I stated for this game. Thats the way HT designed it. I'm guessing it's not your mind that's
"nimble".
Ohh and I'll add.
Not much can be done about the lag Knfe. That is just the nature of this type of Internet service.
It would probably cause lost connections as well, due to the incredible latency.
These types of services are just not very good for any type of real-time service from the Internet.
Wish I had better news for you. You would be a lot better off with a dial-up connection for gameplay as speed is not as critical as latency is.
Your quote is misleading. He was talking about satellite broadband which is terrible for gaming because of the latency. The signal has to travel to space and back (that's why with interviews on the news the answerer seems to wait a few seconds after the question is asked). Land-line broadband has a much lower latency than dial-up. You are correct in that a stable dial-up connection is all that's required for this game.
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I can't even remember when Hitech Creations first said they were developing this new gametype with mission-based sorties. Was it more than 3 years ago? That's a long time to just be developing a new game type. I'm not saying that the company should have something in the works already, but it would be nice to know what the plans are for the next couple years. If they haven't even hit the planning stages, then it could be another 4-5 years before anything "new" comes out. And I'm not talking about updates.
They stated it would be released in 3rd Quarter of 2003. So to answer your question it's been 5 years.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,77118.msg739187.html#msg739187 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,77118.msg739187.html#msg739187)
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I think it was comcast but not sure. They all were experiencing warps associate with packet loss.
One provider who is getting sued over shady practices proves his point.
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One provider who is getting sued over shady practices proves his point.
It's not dial up thats the problem you towering genius. It's packet loss. I don't care if its dial up, cable or dsl if packets get dropped you have problems. Not to mention the idiots that have every chat/file share/teamspeak program leaching off bandwidth.
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Yes, that quote from 2001 is still relative to the internets today, seriously it's true. Broadband absolutely has much higher latency than dialup. Now that I have tested it, I get like 1200ms on my broadband and like 68ms on the 56k I just invested in.
Oh wait
This more relative to today Numpty erm nimble?
The game has been designed to work over a 28.8K dialup connection. If the connection has little latency, and no packet loss, it will play the game fine.
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This more relative to today Numpty erm nimble?
Numpty is very witty, seriously. You must be proud.
Anyways, I am out of this thread, realizing all you have left in the tank is petty insults and very unfunny plays on names. You go ahead and try to get good ping(under 200ms, which is pushing it "in this day and age") farther than 3ft from HTCs front door on a dialup. I guess you missed the numbers I had in the post you are replying to, but when taking into consideration your mental midgetry that's no surprise. Demonstrated easily with:
The fact that I said(and where this began):
Hopefully they will get rid of high ploss 56k users before anything else
And you replied with(warming up to your emorage):
Packet loss is the problem not bandwidth.
Is a testament to your numptyness(see what I did there?). Thank you for a thread of laughs at your expense. :rofl :rofl
That and we found some other funny stuff to laugh at on somethingawful.
EDIT: full post was a bit too mean regardless of how true it was
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Maybe I'm just a unfrozen caveman but every game I have ever played included options for turning up or down graphics to suit ones needs. To advocate no advancement for cpu/video capacity is unbelievably selfish and downright stupid. I applaud HTC for supporting widescreens and multiple monitors. Its a good step in the right direction. Improving graphics improves immersion which improves gameplay. While you can argue its not essential, you can not argue it does not significantly benefit the overall experience.
Graphics does not necessarily have much to do with game play which, as have been pointed out, has remained relatively unchanged since beta days. There have been many good threads on ways to make strategy and teamwork relevant. Both of these factors contribute to the immersion and game play tremendously. One good example is a useful perk system. Its currently a broken economy were perks have little to no value to the vast majority of players. A example of this would include using bomber perks to drop supplies and build up or repair bases. This is a common game play feature of dozens of games that encourage players to build and defend bases. There are many well thought out ideas in the wishlist area that would add immensely to the game and not require much if any updating to existing machines or bandwidth. The beginning and end of it is improvements bring in and retain customers.
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With new game engines arising and much more advanced games coming out that support new features, is Aces High due for a revamp? I mean, I can't compare it to games like Crysis, IL2, and other newer flight sims or first person shooters, but should we be seeing a new engine in the near future?
Your making a rather large leap on assuming what "engine" HT is using.
Could it be that he does have the "latest and greatest" with all the "bells and whistles" but chooses not to implement them so as not to eliminate a large part of the player base who could not handle the maximum capabilities of the "engine" ?
The crisper the "eye candy" the more polygons that have to be rendered ... thus the need for more graphics computing power. It's a fine balancing act that HTC has to perform to make it this game appealing and at the same time, available to many.
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Bronk, I never said I expected a high-end game here. Although I do think Hitech Creations may be able to rework the engine from 10 years ago... We're talking a decade on basically the same game.
Again you are assuming ... HT introduced a whole new "engine" with AH II ... so it is not 10 yrs old.
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Your making a rather large leap on assuming what "engine" HT is using.
Could it be that he does have the "latest and greatest" with all the "bells and whistles" but chooses not to implement them so as not to eliminate a large part of the player base who could not handle the maximum capabilities of the "engine" ?
The crisper the "eye candy" the more polygons that have to be rendered ... thus the need for more graphics computing power. It's a fine balancing act that HTC has to perform to make it this game appealing and at the same time, available to many.
Dude! What are you smoking? Ever hear of adjustable settings? Seriously, they are already there, just in a limited fashion. Whats wrong with your brain that makes it tough to grasp?
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I love these threads.
Guys with newer technology want bells and whistles.
Guys with lesser technology dont want any change.
Guys with newer technology ultimately threaten to stop playing if AH is not updated.
Guys with older technology ultimately threaten to stop playing if AH is updated.
Each cites reasons why the other is an idiot.
A HTC employee is eventually quoted.
The thread is soon, thereafter, locked, having solved zero.
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I love these threads.
Guys with newer technology want bells and whistles.
Guys with lesser technology dont want any change.
Guys with newer technology ultimately threaten to stop playing if AH is not updated.
Guys with older technology ultimately threaten to stop playing if AH is updated.
Each cites reasons why the other is an idiot.
A HTC employee is eventually quoted.
The thread is soon, thereafter, locked, having solved zero.
Yup, you pretty much got it. At least its a fun ride along the way :rock
In the end the guys rationalize not improving the product in irrational ways are inflicting pain. There is limited if not no downside to a better product and no one is saying the game should be limited to cutting edge graphics requirements. Its just an cop out.
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Pre 2000 PCs? Are you kidding me? Professionals say that every family household should upgrade every 4-5 years. And now, it's becoming even sooner than that. That 4-5 year figure was years ago in the late 90s and early 2000s. I'm surprised people are still operating on 8+ year old machines with today's average file sizes and processor requirements. If they have 15 dollars a month to play an online video game, they should be able to upgrade their PC from 8+ years ago.... I'm not asking for just eye candy, I'm asking for an updated engine that somewhat competes with other games out there. Keeping in mind this is still a massive multiplayer game, it should be feasible. The Aces High community is not what it used to be even 3 years ago. I have seen more and more 2 weekers than ever before. What does this mean? People are using up the trial and abandoning the game. Why? I can't tell ya their specific reasons, but I will tell you that an updated engine would help the situation.
I can't even remember when Hitech Creations first said they were developing this new gametype with mission-based sorties. Was it more than 3 years ago? That's a long time to just be developing a new game type. I'm not saying that the company should have something in the works already, but it would be nice to know what the plans are for the next couple years. If they haven't even hit the planning stages, then it could be another 4-5 years before anything "new" comes out. And I'm not talking about updates.
HMMM.... mortgage this month? Or a new PC to play a flight sim? Lemme check with the missus.....
My year 2000 AMD, which I've tweaked and replaced both cards and memory, gets 40-60 FR consistent, except on really big maps or crowded fights where it stays at 30 or so. 60 FPS is the limit of the human eye. Anything more than 60 FPS, you can't even see. The only way you know you have it is that little number at the top of the screen.
This game appeals to a certain niche of gameplayer. This gameplayer isn't interested in eyecandy. If you have any experience, you'll realize this flight model is better than the others out there. If you want to continually bash at it, you might as well move along.
Any overhaul of the engine will limit the number of "QUALITY" players found on here... Those being the older, over 25 crowd that actually salute a good fight, and check your six. You think the squeaks are bad now......imagine if only top rigs could handle this game. Then, only the "My daddy bought me a computer" crowd would be on. You know...the Half-Life Deathmatch crowd. I loved the actual game Half-Life 2. I logged on one day to the new Team Fortress site.... I came back shaking my head.
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:rock SWEET!....I upgraded!.....Crap.....now I cant buy those fancy "pedals"! :furious
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I have a computer from 1999... now that is OLD. I'm no computer expert, but having viruses, spywares, and the downloading speed of a snail... Well, let's just say it takes me 2 hours to download AH. And I can't even imagine what it would take to download a high-end version of AH. And don't tell me to upgrade my computer, I have a super... cheap.. family... they will never.. buy another computer unless this one break into itty bitty pieces.
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I have a computer from 1999... now that is OLD. I'm no computer expert, but having viruses, spywares, and the downloading speed of a snail... Well, let's just say it takes me 2 hours to download AH. And I can't even imagine what it would take to download a high-end version of AH. And don't tell me to upgrade my computer, I have a super... cheap.. family... they will never.. buy another computer unless this one break into itty bitty pieces.
Performance of your computer has little if not nothing to do with your download speed. To the point you were trying to make.... You have a 9 year old computer. Seriously, why do you think everyone else should revolve around you? If I want to play the latest games I get what I need to play them or I don't play. If I have something marginal I put up with the performance gap or use the vaunted "preferences" to tune down graphics and other settings to make it tolerable with the full understanding that I'm not getting all of the features of the game and its my fault because I don't have the appropriate hardware. I don't tell the rest of the community they don't deserve what they are paying for because of my selfishness. To advocate not upgrading a product set because you don't want to adjust the preferences is just a cop out. Its a good core product that thankfully is seeing some upgrades that are welcome and should be.
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<<---Can give pretty much anyone a run for thier Money with his ancient Computer. :aok
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and yet we dont care...
I dont care if its just 16 colors as long as the sim is smooth and there is little or no warp.
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Think mine has some kind of "Mayan" date on it. Translated,I believe
it says,......."2012".
(http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:11QpW2CxN5UJ::cache.eb.com/eb/image%253Fid%253D7043%2526rendTypeId%253D4)
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I have a super... cheap.. family... they will never.. buy another computer unless this one break into itty bitty pieces.
Do you want to borrow a hammer? :D
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Dude!
Anyone who starts a retort with ... "Dude" ... sets the tone, at least for me, that the rest of the post will really have no intelligible "meat" in it, and you didn't disappoint.
What are you smoking?
Marlboro Ultra Lights.
Ever hear of adjustable settings?
Nope ... never heard of them in my whole life ... please explain O' Enlightened One ... :rolleyes:
Seriously, they are already there, just in a limited fashion.
:uhoh ... I guess you told me.
Whats wrong with your brain that makes it tough to grasp?
My brain is functioning just fine. I think it is you that was having trouble "grasping" the point that I was trying to make to Mak.
I know for a fact (HT and Pyro posted) that AH II did employ a new graphics engine and for some reason, Mak is under the impression that AH is using some archaic graphics engine that could not deliver better "eye candy", which he really doesn't know what the AH graphics engine is capable of.
With that, I went on to say that maybe HT hasn't even turned on all the bells and whistles that the engine provides and/or has made a conscious decision not to render "IL2 type" graphics for fear of losing a good part of his player base.
Bottom line ... no one knows, amongst us, exactly what is under the covers of Ace High so "assuming" is not a good idea.
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The one major issue people seem to not see is more eye candy also requires larger size of initial download. When we released AH II we went to far to the eye candy side. Many people could not play with the latest developments. And HTC suffered because of it.
IL2 leans to a different market then we do. How well does IL2 look from a tank?
When I rewrote the Graphics Engine for AH2, it was written to include all the latest pixel shader tech. The engine can expand fairly easily. But that expansion does not include to volume of work just to upgrade the Artwork.
As always we must ride an edge of what is best, it is easy to say just give us adjustments, that adjustment only helps with speed, but does nothing to address the download size.
HiTech
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The one major issue people seem to not see is more eye candy also requires larger size of initial download. When we released AH II we went to far to the eye candy side. Many people could not play with the latest developments. And HTC suffered because of it.
IL2 leans to a different market then we do. How well does IL2 look from a tank?
When I rewrote the Graphics Engine for AH2, it was written to include all the latest pixel shader tech. The engine can expand fairly easily. But that expansion does not include to volume of work just to upgrade the Artwork.
As always we must ride an edge of what is best, it is easy to say just give us adjustments, that adjustment only helps with speed, but does nothing to address the download size.
HiTech
You guys are doing just fine Dale. :salute
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Do you want to borrow a hammer? :D
Careful... Careful... Careful....OUCH!@
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As always we must ride an edge of what is best, it is easy to say just give us adjustments, that adjustment only helps with speed, but does nothing to address the download size.
HiTech
OK,
For the record, If I did not think you had a superior product I would not be supporting you with my subscription for the past 7 years. That being said I don't understand your almost religious desire to limit your product. The two most common complaints are the graphics as well as limited gameplay. The gameplay issue has little to do with download size or graphics. Would you not agree that greater use of strategy and teamwork improves the core product? Even though my system is a mid grade, 4 year computer, it has everything maxed out and could handle more. Even maxed out your product hardly pushes the edge. Just about every other developer I have seen has aimed for the edge while allowing folks to detune down to the 4-6 year old system instead of alienating market share. A couple questions? What percentage of your base is still on dial up? Is it still more than 15%? Would they mind having a separate download like the 1024 pack now? Would it really hurt to add advanced shading and other upgrades and simply letting people turn things back down if needed? Its already there, just don't turn it up to the new levels. Even when I had a 28.8 connection I could still just let it crank overnight or pick up the cd like you offer. I'm sure limiting the size of downloads helps 2 weekers intake but better graphics and gameplay sure helps retention. The more limited things are the faster they become stale. Keeping existing customers is cheaper than acquiring new ones.
Again, I think you have the best product out there which is why I pay you. I respect that you participate in the community as well. I want you to continue to grow and capture market which is why I spent my time on this thread. I think you are incorrect in assuming improvements are not very popular as the response to such threads is overwhelmingly positive. To that end I'll bet you the vast majority favor my position. How about tossing up a few polls to find out?
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<<---Can give pretty much anyone a run for thier Money with his ancient Computer. :aok
Mine is 10 years old :(
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I kill lotsa folks on a 10 yr old machine, on dial up. np. :rock
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Rabbidrabbit: Your assumption are incorrect, I do not need polls to prove how the market works. I have pushed to far in the past and your belief that cutting edge graphics drives all markets is incorrect. Let say even 10% of people are only on dial up. I would still need the ability for them to play. Because dropping 10% of your players drastically impacts the bottom line.
You like to make conjecture about better graphics (then you throw in an idea about team game play which is a completely different topic and almost had me not respond at all any more because you are not thinking but rather throwing darts) improving the life time of a customer. There are no facts at all you base this on.
We always try to improve our looks, and did so with a revamp of the terrain system again about 1 year ago. I also But your statements are made in a vacuum. You have no idea the cost of producing the things you ask for, and hence your trying to say we would be better off by doing so has no real insight in your argument.
You are free to ask for better looking stuff, but you do not have to live with the choices of those discussions.
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Hitech, thank you for your response regarding the original topic. As others would say, I am still a member (off and on), because of the Aces High community and gameplay, not because of the eye candy. My original post was somewhat taken as blunt stab towards the game and community; that conception is false. My purpose was to get some idea of what the future holds for Aces High the game, and the community. Unfortunately from my personal perspective, the originality and respectfulness in the community has declined. Many factors have contributed to this and the blame is not to be placed on any particular group/individual, in my opinion. Thank you for the last 5+ years of gaming, and more to come. You're company is doing well, and I understand to an extent, the limits that the company has.
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I am perfectly fine with the graphics as they are. If you ever get a look at this game on a larger monitor, they are pretty sharp as is :aok
The only thing I would like would be a community-produced option like Scenario Aircraft Converter of old for the terrains. It would be nice to mix it up and fly over snow or desert once in awhile.
I realize that Air Warrior had this (an easily customizable graphics system), but I also realize Air Warrior had some major problems because of it (Like using the P-51 cockpit for all aircraft). I wonder if these problems, or something simliar, are the reason we haven't seen something like SAC in Aces High?
If it were possible to only allow the individual to change terrain colors, essentially (greens to whites for snow, but if there so happens to be a palm tree there, tough luck), with no other tampering, would this be something HTC might consider later on?
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I read some just ASSume everyone can buy a new PC every 3 years or so...
Sorry, but some of us have lives and don't make expendable money like you obviously do.
I play AH on an Athlon xp 1800 (1.5 ghz) 768MB pc133 memory, and a 64mb video card, and 17" CRT monitor.
To upgrade to a new PC that is capable of what I would like will cost well over $1000 building it myself. more if I buy a new monitor.
ADD to that these new "engines" you speak of are developed for games that have nothing to do with MMORPG flight sims. these engines are about human movement, and human detailed expressions. Billions of dollars are spent developing them, and have been for over a decade, building over and over on engines before.
Do you really think a 7 person company like HTC can keep up with, or afford to buy licenses to engines like this? do you really think a life-like eyebrow movement in a game could possibly benefit Aces High? Can any game out there render hundreds of the same quality for every player at the speeds and complexity of a furball in AH?
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**** Approaches podium and climbs up on soapbox ****
Normally, this is not the type of thread to which I would respond; however, in light of some of the things said, I cannot help but speak up.
First... Thank you HTC for the great game which we all (or most of us) enjoy. No, it is not on the level of Blu-ray disc PS-3squared to the 10th power. But many of us are content with a modest escape from reality for just an hour or two a day (maybe even a few hours a week). Therefore, we (or I) don't get overly worked up because I can't see when my pilot is picking his nose and farting in the cockpit. I am perfectly content to fly my cartoon plane and fight other cartoon planes. It would not make fiscal sense for me to go out and upgrade to a high end computer simply to play a game for a mere few hours per week. My computer needs to handle the tasks for which I use it most. Anything after that is wasteful spending. HTC recognizes that and chooses to provide a game that my 'reasonable' system can handle and permits me the much needed escape I enjoy.
Second.... to the person(s) who seem to think that HTC can upgrade and it is up to the rest of us to go out and SPEND SPEND SPEND... maybe you should graduate High School and get into the real world before you so liberally assume that earning money is as easy as asking Daddy for more. To equate that anyone with $15/month in disposible income must also have cash to pony up for a new computer is about the dumbest, most ridiculous statement I have ever read in any publication or online. That statement alone indicates you are either wealthy beyond imagination to the point that you fail to comprehend the value of money; or, you are so far out of touch with reality that you must be a child. Please let me enlighten you with a simple statement $15/month is significantly less than $700-$1000 (just for the bare minimum for the "new standard" for which you are asking). Then even after buying this new system, you must still pay the $15/month to continue to play. Those of us in the real world, cannot justify that sort of expenditure just for the 'experience' of AcesHigh.
Third..... Thank you Skuzzy for responding to the posts of this thread. To explain your business model even as much as you did is going beyond the call of duty. I (as well as many others, I am certain) appreciate what you do and the lengths you have gone to to ensure that we can remain in the game. While, I realize it is in your best interests - financially speaking, to do so, I still appreciate it just the same.
Finally.... to those people who conisder playing AHII their full time job and spend 75 hours a week in here.... I am sorry that there are more of us lowly common folk than there are of you. As long as 'us little' people are the majority of the business, the game will likely remain available to us. That means you will have to get your mega-graphics playing W.O.W. or whatever else trips your trigger. But as an afterthought, you might consider getting your eye-candy in the real world. Maybe you should turn off you computer once in a while and GO OUTSIDE. After all, there are no graphics or colors as vivid as that which God provides if you would only go out and see them.
**** Climbs down from soapbox ****
My apologies, and thank you.