Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: Heater on January 12, 2009, 03:51:49 AM
-
The questions are which way to go… as for price I am looking to spend around +/- $1000
So the question #1 CPU
Core 2 Duo E8500 or better
Or the i7 920
Question # 2
Graphics card...
Nvidia or ATI…
ATI 4870 or Nvidia GTX 260…
+ one other question....
XP Pro 32 bit or 64 Bit,
and the same for Vista 32 bit or 64 Bit (will dual boot the system)
-
The questions are which way to go… as for price I am looking to spend around +/- $1000
So the question #1 CPU
Core 2 Duo E8500 or better
Or the i7 920
Question # 2
Graphics card...
Nvidia or ATI…
ATI 4870 or Nvidia GTX 260…
The i7 is a performance king at the moment but the motherboards cost an arm and a leg still.
4870 vs 260, 4870 wins in price/performance. If you're not biased to Nvidia it's a good choice. However 260 will carry you a long way also, just make sure you get the new 216 core.
-
The questions are which way to go… as for price I am looking to spend around +/- $1000
So the question #1 CPU
Core 2 Duo E8500 or better
Or the i7 920
Question # 2
Graphics card...
Nvidia or ATI…
ATI 4870 or Nvidia GTX 260…
+ one other question....
XP Pro 32 bit or 64 Bit,
and the same for Vista 32 bit or 64 Bit (will dual boot the system)
Any old parts your planning on using?
Such as a Case,DVD, Soundcard, PSU, Hard Drive?
The more parts you can recycle the more your going to be able to get for around $1,000
With a quick glance f your planning on using the i7 the CPU and compatible motherboard is going to run around $600 plus tax.
Thats going to only leave you around $400 for everything else. and depending on what else you want to go into it. Those numbers can add up rather quickly to send you over budget.
-
The questions are which way to go… as for price I am looking to spend around +/- $1000
So the question #1 CPU
Core 2 Duo E8500 or better
Or the i7 920
Better bang for the buck on CPU and motherboard with the E8400 or E8500. The I7 is faster for most applications but actually slighlty (I mean very slightly) slower than the Wolfdales for gaming.
Question # 2
Graphics card...
Nvidia or ATI…
ATI 4870 or Nvidia GTX 260…
<--- Nvidia man. Actually, the 9800 GTX+ would do just fine.
+ one other question....
XP Pro 32 bit or 64 Bit,
and the same for Vista 32 bit or 64 Bit (will dual boot the system)
I'd be tempted to go 64 bit at this point as everything seems to be moving that way.
-
Just placed the order,
Intel Core™ i7 Quad Processor i7-920
Asus P6T WS PRO, X58, Socket-1366
Corsair TWIN3X 1800MHz DDR3, 6GB,
GeForce GTX 260 896MB PhysX CUDA
PCI-Express 2.0, Core 216, 55nm
Cost : € 1049.00
(overshot the budget a bit but oh well)
-
You did mention +/- $1,000. :P
-
Better bang for the buck on CPU and motherboard with the E8400 or E8500. The I7 is faster for most applications but actually slighlty (I mean very slightly) slower than the Wolfdales for gaming.
Are you talking factory clock speeds or performance?
I benched an E8400 and a i7 920 using FarCry2's benching utility.
The 920 is OCed to 3.8 with the memory running at 739 x 2 (QPI) DDR3 3gb Triple channel 1gb x 3
The E8400 is OCed to 3.6 with a 1840 FSB, DDR3 4gb Dual Channel DDR3 1600 native 2gb x 2
Both machines have a GTX 280 SSC
Results the i7 performed just under 4x's the scores of the E8400. For a $240.00 processor this thing screams. Yes the MB's are in the 225+ range for good boards and good memory (cant slouch here) is 150 plus.
Since the i7's have eliminated the FSB and is now done with the QPI good fast memory now bases your overclocking ability more so then the processor. Put some OCZ 2000 into an i7 rig and got the 920 to 4.6 on 1.4 volts on the processor and 1.65 on the memory. Only problem was the processor still BSOD because of heat. Gonna H2O one and make a final decision. If your going i7 there is no need to get more then the 920 with its OCing ability and being a little less then 25 percent of the 965. 3.8 is an easy overclock on air for the 920 and keep your temps in the high 30s to low 50s OCed (reasonably)
-
Are you talking factory clock speeds or performance?
I benched an E8400 and a i7 920 using FarCry2's benching utility.
The 920 is OCed to 3.8 with the memory running at 739 x 2 (QPI) DDR3 3gb Triple channel 1gb x 3
The E8400 is OCed to 3.6 with a 1840 FSB, DDR3 4gb Dual Channel DDR3 1600 native 2gb x 2
Both machines have a GTX 280 SSC
Results the i7 performed just under 4x's the scores of the E8400. For a $240.00 processor this thing screams. Yes the MB's are in the 225+ range for good boards and good memory (cant slouch here) is 150 plus.
Since the i7's have eliminated the FSB and is now done with the QPI good fast memory now bases your overclocking ability more so then the processor. Put some OCZ 2000 into an i7 rig and got the 920 to 4.6 on 1.4 volts on the processor and 1.65 on the memory. Only problem was the processor still BSOD because of heat. Gonna H2O one and make a final decision. If your going i7 there is no need to get more then the 920 with its OCing ability and being a little less then 25 percent of the 965. 3.8 is an easy overclock on air for the 920 and keep your temps in the high 30s to low 50s OCed (reasonably)
Factory clocks from a comparison review I read. The I7 was faster at everything but gaming but it wasn't very far behind there either.
-
Factory clocks from a comparison review I read. The I7 was faster at everything but gaming but it wasn't very far behind there either.
AH ok... well when you unleash them, nothing out there touching them
-
Just placed the order,
Intel Core™ i7 Quad Processor i7-920
Asus P6T WS PRO, X58, Socket-1366
Corsair TWIN3X 1800MHz DDR3, 6GB,
GeForce GTX 260 896MB PhysX CUDA
PCI-Express 2.0, Core 216, 55nm
Cost : € 1049.00
(overshot the budget a bit but oh well)
What about case, hard drive, and power supply?
-
I am building my first system using the following, total price $993.89
Take a look, wondering if I have any conflicts.
NZXT Tempest case, has 8 internal fans.
Western Digital Caviar 640 GB Hard Drive
OCZ Game XStream 700W power supply
ASUS P5Q3 LGA 775 Intel P45 mobo
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 3.0 GHz
Kingston Value RAM 4gb
MSI N9800 GT 512mb vid card
Samsung 22x DVD R DVD Burner
Koutech multi card reader
Vista home premium 64bit
Oh yea, $100 in mail in rebates from Newegg. Total cost $893.00
-
I think you could have done better on the PSU choice. Also is your HD choice a SATA or ATA drive?
-
I am building my first system using the following, total price $993.89
Take a look, wondering if I have any conflicts.
NZXT Tempest case, has 8 internal fans.
Western Digital Caviar 640 GB Hard Drive
OCZ Game XStream 700W power supply
ASUS P5Q3 LGA 775 Intel P45 mobo
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 3.0 GHz
Kingston Value RAM 4gb
MSI N9800 GT 512mb vid card
Samsung 22x DVD R DVD Burner
Koutech multi card reader
Vista home premium 64bit
Oh yea, $100 in mail in rebates from Newegg. Total cost $893.00
Get low latency Kingston HyperX RAM instead of the Kingston Value RAM. It will only be a few $ more and will run much faster.
-
Yep get rid of the value ram Raule, Also, I'm not sure the Vista 64 is worth it. You may want to go xp pro. OCZ PS stacked up fairly well in a comparison. PC Power and Cooling is one of the best though.
-
Yep get rid of the value ram Raule, Also, I'm not sure the Vista 64 is worth it. You may want to go xp pro. OCZ PS stacked up fairly well in a comparison. PC Power and Cooling is one of the best though.
OCZ is PC Power and Cooling and PC Power and Cooling is OCZ... same company just different brand names
-
Just placed the order,
Intel Core™ i7 Quad Processor i7-920
Asus P6T WS PRO, X58, Socket-1366
Corsair TWIN3X 1800MHz DDR3, 6GB,
GeForce GTX 260 896MB PhysX CUDA
PCI-Express 2.0, Core 216, 55nm
Cost : € 1049.00
(overshot the budget a bit but oh well)
YOu going to have trouble with this memory running at anything other the stock settings on both the Processor and Memory. Once you increase the QPI (overclocking an i7) the Corsair memory goes in the crapper
-
OCZ is PC Power and Cooling and PC Power and Cooling is OCZ... same company just different brand names
Not quite TilDeath.
OCZ has thier own design of power supply and had it before the acquisition of PC Power and Cooling.
At the moment, the only change OCZ has made is to label some supplies, of thier own design, with the PC Power and Cooling label. However, OCZ has not taken any PC Power and Cooling designs and put thier name on it.
All the PC Power and Cooling supplies, from 700W and up, are all PC Power and Cooling built and designed. They are very different from the OCZ line.
How long that will last remains to be seen. It appears OCZ is waiting to see which is the more popular and most profitable.
-
NZXT Tempest case, has 8 internal fans.
Kingston Value RAM 4gb
The Tempest comes with only 6 fans 2 Front intake, 2 rear, 1 Top and 1 side. You got a great processor why hold it down with the Value Ram, Mushkin or OCZ are my favorites. Find the fastest DDR3 you can afford since thats the specs on your MB.
-
Not quite TilDeath.
OCZ has thier own design of power supply and had it before the acquisition of PC Power and Cooling.
At the moment, the only change OCZ has made is to label some supplies, of thier own design, with the PC Power and Cooling label. However, OCZ has not taken any PC Power and Cooling designs and put thier name on it.
All the PC Power and Cooling supplies, from 700W and up, are all PC Power and Cooling built and designed. They are very different from the OCZ line.
How long that will last remains to be seen. It appears OCZ is waiting to see which is the more popular and most profitable.
Interesting Roy, Joel Burzenski (OCZ (408) 733-8400 Ext. 467) my sales rep at OCZ (whom I buy my OCZ and PC Pc supplys) from tells me different. Maybe some of the internals are different, but the same facility making them, same company selling the items, meaning what I said OCZ is PCPc and PCPc is OCZ.
-
They could very well be made in the same factory.
However, you only need to plop them down, side-by-side and a it is easy to spot many differences. All the PC Power and Cooling supplies are larger than the OCZ offerings. They also use a single exhaust fan design, where the OCZ designed supplies use a 120mm pusher fan design. The OCZ supplies typically run at around 78% to 80% efficiency, where the PC Power and Cooling supplies run 82% to 83% efficiency. The heat sinks are larger in the PC P&C supplies, and so on.
They are different designs.
The way you worded that before made it sound like they are the same supplies with different names on them. Just wanted to clear that up.
-
They could very well be made in the same factory.
However, you only need to plop them down, side-by-side and a it is easy to spot many differences. All the PC Power and Cooling supplies are larger than the OCZ offerings. They also use a single exhaust fan design, where the OCZ designed supplies use a 120mm pusher fan design. The OCZ supplies typically run at around 78% to 80% efficiency, where the PC Power and Cooling supplies run 82% to 83% efficiency. The heat sinks are larger in the PC P&C supplies, and so on.
They are different designs.
The way you worded that before made it sound like they are the same supplies with different names on them. Just wanted to clear that up.
No problem, JB states that they are the same other then a few cosmetic differences (coming from a sales rep). Never cracked either open to actually look and see.
-
I am keeping my fingers crossed that OCZ adopts the PC P&C design as they really nailed it well. It will be a sad day if they kill it in favor of their own design, which is strikingly similar to several other companies power supplies.
In the mean time, I bought a few extra PC P&C supplies, just in case. :)
-
Everyone is probably right about the ram so I'm changing that to 6mg of a different brand, and whoever said 6 fans is correct also, didn't have the stats in front of me at the time, but I remembered it was quite a few.
Also, the HD is a SATA drive.
As for the XP pro vs. 64bit vista, I'm going to stick with the vista. Most of the reviews I've seen lately blame most of the vista problems on trying to run that OS on a cheap system. This one isn't top of the line, but it ain't bare bones either.
I'm trying to get the most I can for the money. If I was willing to spend another $300 to $400 I would go with an ASUS P6T deluxe mobo and i7 processor.
Also, from some of the aritcles I read when I decided to build my own, most people undervalue the importance of a good power supply. This all started when I wanted to upgrade the vid card on my Dell dimension 9100 and figured out the crappy 375w power supply wouldn't run anything that was worth buying. Further research lead me to first to the conclusion that updating stock off the shelf systems is a waste of time as is buying another upgraded such system. Which brings me to where I'm at now, building my own.
-
What about case, hard drive, and power supply?
Just upgrading the old system...
Antec Nine Hundred black miditower,
Corsair Powersupply 1000W Black
Drives 2 SATA II 500 GB for the OS (raid 1) 2 STAT II 1TB drives for data
For the CPU cooler : http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=productview&products_id=24&lng=en
-
OCZ is PC Power and Cooling and PC Power and Cooling is OCZ... same company just different brand names
Yep, but they compared them as if they were different. So are they both made at the same location?
-
Just placed the order,
Intel Core™ i7 Quad Processor i7-920
Asus P6T WS PRO, X58, Socket-1366
Corsair TWIN3X 1800MHz DDR3, 6GB,
GeForce GTX 260 896MB PhysX CUDA
PCI-Express 2.0, Core 216, 55nm
Cost : € 1049.00
(overshot the budget a bit but oh well)
Operating system? If your using XP which makes 6G ram too much. XP(32 bit) will only utilize about 3G so if you go XP see if you can delete 2G from the order. The Antec 900 will be a bit "snug" with the card.
-
Hahahahaha! i7 :aok
-
Heater are you adding a RAID controller card? Motherboard controllers stink worse then ... (thinking three day old catfish guts) and wont deliver full speed. Why RAID1? Of course if its for AHII you dont need so much speed but I have other programs that can use more speed and I found RAID0 to be best especially with velociraptors.
-
Heater are you adding a RAID controller card? Motherboard controllers stink worse then ... (thinking three day old catfish guts) and wont deliver full speed. Why RAID1? Of course if its for AHII you dont need so much speed but I have other programs that can use more speed and I found RAID0 to be best especially with velociraptors.
Was thinking about that (raid Controller).... I may even just skip it all together as I am planning on setting this up using a bootmanager as I will be setting up 4 diffrent OS's on this thing... and I normally end up reinstalling once or twice every few months anyway...
-
Yep, but they compared them as if they were different. So are they both made at the same location?
They could be made in the same factory, but they are different designs. Just like Ford builds a Taurus and Mustang in the same factory.
I cannot confirm nor deny the manufacturing location for either OCZ or PC P&C supplies.
-
Yep, but they compared them as if they were different. So are they both made at the same location?
Yes
-
Yep, but they compared them as if they were different. So are they both made at the same location?
I read an article that covered this. Both brands, and the companies (before they merged) have multiple product lines. These products are made using different designs, possibly in different factories. After the companies merged, it is reasonable to expect that the product lines will also merge. However, you can still expect that their high end and low end models will remain completely different designs, and may be made in different factories.
For example, HardOCP dissected a couple of OCZ power supplies during reviews and found that one was a very high quality design that they had not seen before, and another one was simply a generic design outsourced from a company that makes power supplies for a whole bunch of companies including OEM customers.
So it depends on what model you get... Some are going to be generic PSUs with OCZ or PCP&C labels, some will be more custom high end designs. In both cases, it is unlikely that a factory staffed with OCZ or PCP&C employees actually manufacturered them since they order their PSUs from third party manufacturers. It doesn't necessarily mean they're cheap or crappy, it just means that you might buy 5 PSUs with 5 different brand names, and then if you open them up you might find that they're nearly identical inside.
That's why if you are really serious about picking your computer parts, you need to read PSU reviews that take them apart and look at internal build quality. Whether or not you like hardOCP's testing methodology, they disassemble every PSU and comment on build quality including identifying the actual PSU manufacturer and comparing the actual design to other PSU brands that use the same design. You'd be suprised at what they find... They have taken apart 800 and 1000w PSUs and found them to be absolutely identical, down to the heatsinks and capacitors. The brand name company can special order these generic designs with custom wiring or better components, but there are actually only a handful of manufacturers and designs so it's possible to narrow down which brand is selling the "good" ones at a lower price if you do a lot of research.
-
After some comments here, I decided to change a few things for my build. Initially, I just wanted to get some better ram than the 4gb of Kingston Value I had originally selected. Once I began shopping for better ram, I kept coming across customer reviews tanking my choice of Asus P5Q3 mobo as being very touchy about the type of ram you could use. So I went back and started over on selecting the motherboard. I still wasn't willing to up my price and go for an i7 board, it seems like almost everyone sporting DDR3 ram has an evga X58 i7 mobo, so I went with the GIGABYTE GA-EP45T mobo. It's got 2 PCI X16 slots and plenty of USB ports, plus, no negative reviews. Being a first time builder, I want to avoid as much potential for headaches as possible. From there I decided to splurge a bit on a Corasair Dominator 6GB ram kit. 33 reviews at Newegg, all at 5. Only con, price at $229.00.
-
The only advice:
Strap down the RAM tight.... :cool:
-
After some comments here, I decided to change a few things for my build. Initially, I just wanted to get some better ram than the 4gb of Kingston Value I had originally selected. Once I began shopping for better ram, I kept coming across customer reviews tanking my choice of Asus P5Q3 mobo as being very touchy about the type of ram you could use. So I went back and started over on selecting the motherboard. I still wasn't willing to up my price and go for an i7 board, it seems like almost everyone sporting DDR3 ram has an evga X58 i7 mobo, so I went with the GIGABYTE GA-EP45T mobo. It's got 2 PCI X16 slots and plenty of USB ports, plus, no negative reviews. Being a first time builder, I want to avoid as much potential for headaches as possible. From there I decided to splurge a bit on a Corasair Dominator 6GB ram kit. 33 reviews at Newegg, all at 5. Only con, price at $229.00.
The Gigabyte board should be good but I've heard they are also sensative to RAM. Go to the Gigabyte site and click on the memory support list for that motherboard to be sure what your getting is compatible. You also might want to look at the eVGA 750 series with 2x16 PCIe slots and 1066 DDR3 support. the Nvidia boards are RAM agnostic. Not sure how these stack up against each other price wise.
As to RAM just get something with low latencies (4-4-4-12 or 5-5-5-15 or something in that area). The lower the better.
-
I find the reviews at Newegg to be mostly fluff. If you read between the lines you usually find there are other issues with most. Like, "I bought this DDR2-800 and it will not overclock to DDR2-2000 speeds, must be the motherboard! I'll never buy another one of those again!".
There are some real nutjob review comments over there.
I have installed 5 or 6 P5Q motherboards, using GSkill, OCZ, and Crucial. Never had a problem with any of it. Just FYI. Of course, it is always possible to get something bad at any given moment, regardless of who makes it.
For instance, the only motherboard I have had fail, after installation, is a Gigabyte motherboard. Does not make them a bad brand. They have a good line and it is a good company.
I have also had one P5Q that was DOA. No biggie. If I stopped buying product from every company I have had a failure with, I could not buy anything.
I never write reviews at Newegg.