Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: USRanger on March 19, 2009, 11:02:17 PM
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Link:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=151191
These color photos of 40's Germany are a real treasure. No other WWII pics I have seen make me feel like I am "there" like these. The people in the pics just seem so more "real" than b&w pics or recolored TV footage.
Viewer Warning: There are no graphic pictures, but the swastika does appear in many photos. (Sorry it that is violating anything Skuzzy, but these are pictures worth sharing IMO.)
:salute
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I wanna be a nazi
(http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/7817/29kg2.jpg)
(http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/6480/43hg5.jpg)
(http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/7581/65no7.jpg)
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Wow. Excellent pics Ranger. Thx for posting :aok
ReDhAwK
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I wanna be a nazi
(http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/7817/29kg2.jpg)
(http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/6480/43hg5.jpg)
(http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/7581/65no7.jpg)
you get the one in the first pic above the L
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There are about 4 pix i seen before. But the rest i never seen. To bad they didn't get any color pix of 109, 190, 110 so on so on.
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If I'm not mistaken, that is Adolf Galland in the middle.
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c62/Masherbrum/Aces%20High/54xm8.jpg)
Regardless, Rangah, thanks for the post. :salute
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Scary.
Color gives much more life to the pictures instead of the "distant dream" effect of B&W. Keeps reminding you that this collective madness was real and not some old legend.
Except this picture below. All I could think of is:
"dam dam dam,
dam di dam,
dam di dam"
.. and wait for lord Vader to walk in...
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I cant help it, but somehow i feel that Hitler was abit of an ahole. Thank cod he doesnt play AH. Just imagine having that little general telling us what to do with a german accent. He would no doubt be the most annoying squeeker ever.
Excellent find Ranger :aok
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Nazi chicks are ugly :eek:
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Nazi chicks are ugly :eek:
Proof positive that attractive female Germans are a direct product of Allied occupation...
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Nazi chicks are ugly :eek:
+1
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Except this picture below.
?
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See Rule #6
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Skuzzy removed that pic, probably because of the swastika, so please don't post any pics showing it here. If peeps want to see the photos, they need to use the link.
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What USRanger said.
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Proof positive that attractive female Germans are a direct product of Allied occupation...
:lol
Somehow I have a difficult time believing that.
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(http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/1194/14ad2.jpg)
Did anyone else notice Colonel Hogan? :D
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I cant help it, but somehow i feel that Hitler was abit of an ahole.
One of the biggest understatements I've ever seen.
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If I'm not mistaken, that is Adolf Galland in the middle.
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c62/Masherbrum/Aces%20High/54xm8.jpg)
Regardless, Rangah, thanks for the post. :salute
That is THE MAN.
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Those are some priceless pictures. :aok
I do not approve of what the Nazis stood for or the ghastly acts some of them commited, but you have to admit that they were a very organized bunch. They could sure put on a military display as well. They also had the coolest uniforms of any army in history IMO.
They, just like Japan, bit off more than they could chew.
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Isn't the law that the swastika can be shown for documentary purposes? Or has it change since?
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That is THE MAN.
I want to say that is Moelders to his Right. The Spanish Civil War badge is present as well. I'm not sure though.
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Just imagine having that little general telling us what to do with a german accent. He would no doubt be the most annoying squeeker ever.
Shall I start to use my mic? :lol
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Very nice find,,,
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Nazi chicks are ugly :eek:
+2
But you have to think what cosmetic they had then compare to now, she anit that bad.
Those are some priceless pictures. :aok
I do not approve of what the Nazis stood for or the ghastly acts some of them commited, but you have to admit that they were a very organized bunch. They could sure put on a military display as well. They also had the coolest uniforms of any army in history IMO.
Have you ever think how well U.S. Government is with sercurity, backround checks so on so on. Where do you think they get that from?
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+2
But you have to think what cosmetic they had then compare to now, she anit that bad.
Have you ever think how well U.S. Government is with sercurity, backround checks so on so on. Where do you think they get that from?
:aok
Alot more than that came from them. Alot more.
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you get the one in the first pic above the L
I'd hit it :aok
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I want to say that is Moelders to his Right. The Spanish Civil War badge is present as well. I'm not sure though.
I was thinking the same thing.
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I don't understand how this is a risk. The pictures are documentary as allowed by that German law. I don't mean to stir up anything, just curious. If for no other reason so I don't break that law myself.
Lusche?
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I agree with Moot on this one, as long as the pictures or documentation is from record, you can exhibit (edit: display was a bad choice of wording) it in Germany today. To make a AH skin with the swastika or to make a painting based on a photograph is not allowed.
Either way, it is HTCs sandbox.
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Yep, now that I think about it IIRC there's a couple of people who just balk at the sight of it, no matter the context. So HTC prolly just doesn't want to deal with it.
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Those are the same 'couple of people' that claim the Finns are breaking the rules for having the swastika on their airplanes.
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some countries have internet filters
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I don't understand how this is a risk. The pictures are documentary as allowed by that German law.
Lusche?
§ 86 StGB Dissemination of Means of Propaganda of Unconstitutional Organizations
(1) Whoever domestically disseminates or produces, stocks, imports or exports or makes publicly accessible through data storage media for dissemination domestically or abroad, means of propaganda: 1. of a party which has been declared to be unconstitutional by the Federal Constitutional Court or a party or organization, as to which it has been determined, no longer subject to appeal, that it is a substitute organization of such a party; […] 4. means of propaganda, the contents of which are intended to further the aims of a former National Socialist organization, shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than three years or a fine. […] (3) Subsection (1) shall not be applicable if the means of propaganda or the act serves to further civil enlightenment, to avert unconstitutional aims, to promote art or science, research or teaching, reporting about current historical events or similar purpose (...)
Actually, things like swastikas are quite present in German media to this day, for there is still a lot of discussion, education, research going on.
The pictures that were deleted in this thread would not have been illegal if posted in a similar way in Germany.
However, I can understand HTC's firm stance on this matter - that way the rule is easy to follow without much discussion and arguing about any lines that have possibly been crossed. I probably would not had them edited out, but after all - it's their business, not mine ;)
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die Hakenkreuze ist verboten.
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Actually, things like swastikas are quite present in German media to this day, for there is still a lot of discussion, education, research going on.
I take it you still live in Germany? Mind if I ask you (or anyone else that live in Germany) a few questions?
Has the image of the Nazi party (in the eyes of the general populace) changed at all in the past 10-15 years? Have an increasing number of youth become attracted to the mystique, or is the news exaggerating the issue?
I have the sense that the average German citizen blames the Nazi hierarchy for the events that took place, are any of them blameless in the populaces eyes (ie Speer or Donitz)?
Are some individual military units (either German or some other nation) vilified by the populace in Germany?
I'm certain I have a lot more questions, it is a rare treat to get exposed to a culture without having to move the locale. Thanks! :)
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nice pictures great find, i want more, more dangit, more
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I take it you still live in Germany? Mind if I ask you (or anyone else that live in Germany) a few questions?
Has the image of the Nazi party (in the eyes of the general populace) changed at all in the past 10-15 years? Have an increasing number of youth become attracted to the mystique, or is the news exaggerating the issue?
I have the sense that the average German citizen blames the Nazi hierarchy for the events that took place, are any of them blameless in the populaces eyes (ie Speer or Donitz)?
Are some individual military units (either German or some other nation) vilified by the populace in Germany?
I'm certain I have a lot more questions, it is a rare treat to get exposed to a culture without having to move the locale. Thanks! :)
That are some tough questions, as there is no simple answer to each of them. Actually, unlike most stuff I write on this BBS I have to conceive my answer in German first and then try to translate it :lol
Also I think this could be considered as crossing the "no politics" line Skuzzy has set... maybe I better respond by PM? ;)
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I'd like to argue against you keeping that PM private if possible. I'd like to hear it myself and others probably do too, and it's probably going to be written at the opposite of why politics are banned in the OC. They're banned because people can't reasonably discuss them. Not only will your reply by reasonable but it'll be a pretty valuable exposure to a different insight. I think that if anything, it'll put a cold shower on a lot of uninformed and inflaming discussion on the subject. It will enrich OC discussion (even if just by one small argument).
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As I already stated, these questions are quite difficult to answer directly, as I'm more or less a plain citizen with just a better historical education than most Germans ;)
I have no studies or even just polls at hand so bear with me - it's just a personal view
For the average German, the 3rd Reich is incredibly far away. Yes, almost all of us had learned about it in school (though in varying quality), and as a German you are still very much exposed to a huge public remembrance culture - each anniversary like the Machtergreifung or the liberation of Auschwitz spawns a lot of public speeches, commemorative ceremonies especially on higher levels (like Bundestag), articles in newspapers and magazines and many features on television.
But I really doubt John Doe is really caring very much about it anymore and I don't think that had been much different 10-15 years ago. 20-30 years ago that could have been a different matter, but it's hard to tell for someone not being 40 yet ;)
It is however very present in all higher levels/circles, media, politics, humanities etc. It is very much influenzing modern politics and semantics. The things that have (or may have) changend in the modern perception of the 3rd Reich and nazism are somewhat limited to academic circles, high quality medias and people actually interested in that topic.
One of those things that have defenitely changed is the view on the Wehrmacht itself. 30 years ago there may have been a commomon consensus that the Wehrmacht had been (forgive me this simplification) "innocent" - more a victim of Hitler and his evil minions himself than a active player in expansion, extermination, war crimes. This has definitely changed, being replaced with a much more differentiated view.
But again, this is more an academic/media phenomenom. I'd say: For the average German, such things don't really play a role anymore.
And I doubt there is an increasing number of youth being attracted for the myth. Actually, over the years I have come to the conclusion that the myth is much more present in countries like the United States or Great Britain with a totally different culture and differrent (=much less) taboos (and laws!) on that matter.
"I have the sense that the average German citizen blames the Nazi hierarchy for the events that took place, are any of them blameless in the populaces eyes (ie Speer or Donitz)?"
I'd say most Germans would not be able to tell you who Dönitz was ;)
Despite the rememberance culture I mentioned, these are academic debates & topics these days.
"Are some individual military units (either German or some other nation) vilified by the populace in Germany?"
The general public view has changed on the Wehrmacht, but discussions about individual units are, again, pretty much academic ones
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The pictures of the infantrymen are what personally grabs me the most. I have hundred of pics of me & my boys doing the same things and they match so well it's creepy. Same faces, only the uniform is different. I'm a vet of 2 wars and some smaller conflicts I can't get into. Those fights were always against an enemy that looked totally different that us (skin tone, etc.) It's hard for me to imagine what it was like to fight and kill people that look just like you & I. Most people on these boards can try to understand that, but unless you've pulled the trigger, I don't know if you'll get what I mean. I'm having a hard time trying to choose the right words to explain. I just think it had to be harder to fight and kill people that looked the same as us, compared to some hajji with a bomb. I was born in the 70s. WWII was never quite "real" to me. Sure, I love to research it & stuff, but it still seems like another world. These pics remind me that it was this world, and not that long ago.
<S> to the people on all sides who fought in this great conflict. I could not imagine losing in a day or two as many people as we've lost in Iraq or A'stan total. The scale of the fighting is almost incomprehensible to me. What an awful thing to go through. I just couldn't imagine.
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For some reason, WWII era color photographs, at least for me, give more of a portal into that 'world' than grayscale or modern photographs do. I don't know why... but when I look at color photos from that era it almost instantly feels like I'm there... it takes some effort to feel the same with other pictures.
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And I doubt there is an increasing number of youth being attracted for the myth. Actually, over the years I have come to the conclusion that the myth is much more present in countries like the United States or Great Britain with a totally different culture and differrent (=much less) taboos (and laws!) on that matter.
I agree with you on that, I recently had a patient that was incredibly nasty to anyone but myself. I couldn't understand it, my bedsnide (bedside) manner isn't the best sometimes and most feel less threatened by a woman.
One day, the reasoning became very apparent. The patients son came in in a SS uniform, complete with the death's head insignia and the son was nice enough to leave a framed photo on the bed side table of him in the uniform. Fortunately, I believe there was about 100 IQ points divided between the father and son, but I guess having a lack of intelligence is just what the 'recruiting office' was looking for.
I have another question for you;
I asked you before if anyone was made a villian by the people of Germany of today, do you have anyone the population looks upon as a hero?
edit: Thank you very much for answering the questions, I'm sure it is very difficult for you, but I appreciate it!
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With the understanding WW2 history has been my hobby for over 40 years, those photos are still frightening.
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As I already stated, these questions are quite difficult to answer directly, as I'm more or less a plain citizen with just a better historical education than most Germans ;)
I have no studies or even just polls at hand so bear with me - it's just a personal view
For the average German, the 3rd Reich is incredibly far away. Yes, almost all of us had learned about it in school (though in varying quality), and as a German you are still very much exposed to a huge public remembrance culture - each anniversary like the Machtergreifung or the liberation of Auschwitz spawns a lot of public speeches, commemorative ceremonies especially on higher levels (like Bundestag), articles in newspapers and magazines and many features on television.
But I really doubt John Doe is really caring very much about it anymore and I don't think that had been much different 10-15 years ago. 20-30 years ago that could have been a different matter, but it's hard to tell for someone not being 40 yet ;)
It is however very present in all higher levels/circles, media, politics, humanities etc. It is very much influenzing modern politics and semantics. The things that have (or may have) changend in the modern perception of the 3rd Reich and nazism are somewhat limited to academic circles, high quality medias and people actually interested in that topic.
One of those things that have defenitely changed is the view on the Wehrmacht itself. 30 years ago there may have been a commomon consensus that the Wehrmacht had been (forgive me this simplification) "innocent" - more a victim of Hitler and his evil minions himself than a active player in expansion, extermination, war crimes. This has definitely changed, being replaced with a much more differentiated view.
But again, this is more an academic/media phenomenom. I'd say: For the average German, such things don't really play a role anymore.
And I doubt there is an increasing number of youth being attracted for the myth. Actually, over the years I have come to the conclusion that the myth is much more present in countries like the United States or Great Britain with a totally different culture and differrent (=much less) taboos (and laws!) on that matter.
"I have the sense that the average German citizen blames the Nazi hierarchy for the events that took place, are any of them blameless in the populaces eyes (ie Speer or Donitz)?"
I'd say most Germans would not be able to tell you who Dönitz was ;)
Despite the rememberance culture I mentioned, these are academic debates & topics these days.
"Are some individual military units (either German or some other nation) vilified by the populace in Germany?"
The general public view has changed on the Wehrmacht, but discussions about individual units are, again, pretty much academic ones
Thanks for not taking this Private. As moot said, it is a VERY interesting insight into another culture! Thank you for sharing this with us!
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(http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/1194/14ad2.jpg)
Did anyone else notice Colonel Hogan? :D
Thats not Col Hogan.
But I do know the character your referring to in the show.
And damn you, its making me crazy cause I cant think of the characters name!
Funny, As great as a show as it was. If it were never before seen. It would never see public airwaves in todays politically correct world.
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Lusche, that was an excellent post.
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I asked you before if anyone was made a villian by the people of Germany of today, do you have anyone the population looks upon as a hero?
The only ones still publicly regarded as heroes today are members of the resistance, people that stood up against Hitler and his barbarous regime in any way, be it soldiers, priests or plain housewives. Sure, there are still some WW2 "fans", collectors out there or even right wing groups that still see some soldiers like Rommel or Galland as heroes, but that's a minority largely unnoticed by the public. There are no TV shows about the "great aces of the war" (there are basically no German shows like "Dogfights"), no articles in the major magazines recalling the great deeds of Wittman or Prien. There are TV documentaries about people like Dönitz or Rommel, but there focus is very different from American films I have seen: Military matters don't matter that much or better: They are the backdrop. It's other questions that are dealt with: What was his motivation? What was his real attitude towards national socialism? Was he involved in crimes? Why? How far? What did he know & support? Did he act against Hitler in any way?
It's the try to understand how society worked back then, and why a whole people went a way that is largely non-understandable to to Germans today
(That being said, I may also point out that the actual quality of those shows is not always exactly better than their American counterparts. It's still TV, it's still painting their picture with a very broad brush, and all those staggering simplifications and factual errors often makes watching them a pain in the butt for me ;))
This is a change in public awareness that resulted out of 60 years of very public discussion about that topic, research, education etc. In the 1950's for example, still a huge percentage of Germans regarded Stauffenberg and other solders that finally turned against Hitler as just being traitors. This is definitely no longer the case. This is a huge change in culture that mainly happened during the 70's and 80's.
edit: Thank you very much for answering the questions, I'm sure it is very difficult for you, but I appreciate it!
Au contraire: I have to thank you for your questions. Nice change of pace for this BBS, were thinking isn't always a requirement ;)
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As a person who just reads the bbs and doesn't put my name in lights. I want to say this was 1 of the the best posts i've read. Thanks for sharing
v1st
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Another question;
Is there still a sense of animosity towards the the US/GB for the bombing offense, or any other actions during the war? Even now I read they find UXBs all over Germany...
Is there any animosity towards the Soviets for their behavior during the war? (this one may be an easy question, but I'm curious what in particular would be mentioned)
Once again, thanks for your time Lusche. :)
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The pictures of the infantrymen are what personally grabs me the most... Same faces, only the uniform is different. I'm a vet of 2 wars and some smaller conflicts I can't get into. Those fights were always against an enemy that looked totally different that us (skin tone, etc.) It's hard for me to imagine what it was like to fight and kill people that look just like you & I.
+1
It's even more than the appearance. I lived there for a good number of years. Once I was able to move past the language barrier & build friendships with my neighbors I didn't think they were any different than us at all.
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+1
It's even more than the appearance. I lived there for a good number of years. Once I was able to move past the language barrier & build friendships with my neighbors I didn't think they were any different than us at all.
Well.... the food and beer is much better, but I know what you mean.
I have been to Germany several times, as I have relatives that live there, in Gräfelfing which is about 1k west of München.
Some are my age (30ish), some are of the generation before (my parents age), and some of the war age.
On my first visit, as a shameless teen who just had finished a whole unit in school about the Holocaust, I had been asking questions about the Nazi party, Hitler, the aircraft, and the war, in general.
They sent me on a trip with Tante Anne who was 75 or so (basically in her 20's at the time of the war) We spent the whole day touring Munich and the surrounding areas while I got a firsthand account of what it was like being a citizen of Germany during that time. She took me from place to place and described events to me just like they happened. "I was here working when I first heard we were going to war,I stood here when I saw Hitler's first speech", etc. She spoke all day with, what appeared to me, to be a mixed sense of pride (in the accomplishments of the German people), fear (remembering what it was like) and embarrassment (for the awful things that happened). What I got out of it was that most folks at the time really didn't care for Hitler, but is was certainly not an opinion one shared with anyone (unless you wanted a visit from the Gestapo) She also said that most Germans fought because there was only one other alternative.....
At 14 years old, it was a pretty deep and emotional day. I guess it was an example of being careful what you ask for.
Also, thank you, Lusche :salute
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Is there still a sense of animosity towards the the US/GB for the bombing offense, or any other actions during the war? Even now I read they find UXBs all over Germany...
That's another good question. When I visited Germany, the width of the streets compared to other European nations made a big impression on me.
Fwiw, it's pretty easy for a historian to demonstrate that a majority of the bombing from March-May '45 was totally unnecessary. The Allies bombed medium-sized cities full of refugees, small towns with less than 20,000 inhabitants; with no more military targets left to destroy, they just continued to bomb because they could.
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Very nice pictures!
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Another question;
Is there still a sense of animosity towards the the US/GB for the bombing offense, or any other actions during the war? Even now I read they find UXBs all over Germany...
Is there any animosity towards the Soviets for their behavior during the war? (this one may be an easy question, but I'm curious what in particular would be mentioned)
Once again, thanks for your time Lusche. :)
Lusche?
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What I find interesting is that Aces is trying to promote a certain environment in keeping the swastika out of this forum.But, respectfully these are historic photos of NAZI Germany and I think the swastika was used back then.I would rather see a constitutionally acceptable Aces High bulletin board than a politically correct sanitized board any day :)Oh, was my statement politically correct?I'm sorry let's let the Aces High staff screen it for their approval :lol
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I hate to see it stifled as well. I do not personally believe that folks posted photos of the era in which we fly our planes in-game to hurt anyone's feelings or intentionally offend anyone. Discussing past history is just that, in and of itself, and is most decidedly not political. Some symbols cannot be avoided, but if they are in a context of learning something, then it's not intended to offend. These things all tend to work themselves out over time anyway.
Learning history is one of THE most stuck-in-the-corner school subjects in American schools that we have, and that's very sad. Many of the younger folks have absolutely ZERO teaching of WWI, WWII, Korea, The Cold War, Vietnam, or even the First Gulf War. The school that my daughters graduated from--history class left off at Teddy Roosevelt's presidency. Not one single item of recent history was taught.
I, like vonmessa, I have been to Germany and enjoyed every second of it. It was sad to see that the vast majority of an entire male generation was gone. It was awesome to see so many friendly and outgoing folks wanting to try out their English--no matter how limited, and how well they forgave my poor German :aok I have no family or ancestors from there, I just wanted to go (and not put 3 years of high school German to waste) so I sold my motorcycle and booked a round trip for three weeks. The folks there were awesome :aok
Sadly, many of the younger members of our board may only get some issues of life back then by what they read here--so we need to be truthful as well as hyper-accurate. Even Wiki has some innacuracies.
One GREAT book is "Hitler's Wartime Picture Magazine: Signal" S. L. Mayer (Prentice-Hall). It is chocked full of excellent photos and shows life on the front as well as life on the home front (ration cards, entertainment, and actual adverts from back then). The articles and photos were edited by Goerbles and his personal staff--so take them as they are keeping that in mind.
Also, there is no better researched book available on the Invasion of the Soviet Union than Paul Carell's "Unternehmen Barbarossa im Bild" (Undertaking Barbarossa in Pictures) Verlag Ullstein, 1967. It's in German, but even someone with a good grasp of military vocabulary and a couple of years of German can easily follow along. I payed 25 marks for my hard cover edition back in 1979, but may be gotten on ebay for less. It has many before then ever published photos that came straight from the family collections of veterans who were there.
I hope that especially the younger folks will take advantage of their free local libraries and spend some time in the history section. They'd be surprised all that they have missed at school.
ROX
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What I find interesting is that Aces is trying to promote a certain environment in keeping the swastika out of this forum.But, respectfully these are historic photos of NAZI Germany and I think the swastika was used back then.I would rather see a constitutionally acceptable Aces High bulletin board than a politically correct sanitized board any day :)Oh, was my statement politically correct?I'm sorry let's let the Aces High staff screen it for their approval :lol
someone got in trouble for posting one of the pictures with a swastika in it?
there are swastikas in the game... on every single german plane... that doesn't make much sense to me, like you said, it's history, it's not like anyone is posting them with a politcal agenda, but merely for a historical insight.
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someone got in trouble for posting one of the pictures with a swastika in it?
there are swastikas in the game... on every single german plane... that doesn't make much sense to me, like you said, it's history, it's not like anyone is posting them with a politcal agenda, but merely for a historical insight.
The only swastikas in the game are on Finnish aircraft, and there it has an entirely different meaning.
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What I find interesting is that Aces is trying to promote a certain environment in keeping the swastika out of this forum.But, respectfully these are historic photos of NAZI Germany and I think the swastika was used back then.I would rather see a constitutionally acceptable Aces High bulletin board than a politically correct sanitized board any day :)Oh, was my statement politically correct?I'm sorry let's let the Aces High staff screen it for their approval :lol
You're going to get it locked before Lusche can answer Del's question.
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What I find interesting is that Aces is trying to promote a certain environment in keeping the swastika out of this forum.But, respectfully these are historic photos of NAZI Germany and I think the swastika was used back then.I would rather see a constitutionally acceptable Aces High bulletin board than a politically correct sanitized board any day :)Oh, was my statement politically correct?I'm sorry let's let the Aces High staff screen it for their approval :lol
The Government of the United States is not telling HTC what they can or cannot post on 'their message board. That makes it Constitutionally acceptable. Like someone said here somewhere else, it's HTC's sandbox. Don't like it? Go play somewhere else.
:)
wrongway
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there are swastikas in the game... on every single german plane... that doesn't make much sense to me, like you said, it's history, it's not like anyone is posting them with a politcal agenda, but merely for a historical insight.
Those are the same 'couple of people' that claim the Finns are breaking the rules for having the swastika on their airplanes.
I hate it when I'm right, according to my wife it happens so seldom as well. :devil
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Another question;
Is there still a sense of animosity towards the the US/GB for the bombing offense, or any other actions during the war? Even now I read they find UXBs all over Germany...
Is there any animosity towards the Soviets for their behavior during the war? (this one may be an easy question, but I'm curious what in particular would be mentioned)
Once again, thanks for your time Lusche. :)
Lusche?
You're going to get it locked before Lusche can answer Del's question.
I'm very sorry, but I felt it necessary to ponder a bit over this question. ;)
At one point I even started a much longer reply describing the three different periods of German "Vergangenheitsbewältigung" -ways to cope with the 3rd Reich - before coming to the conclusion that this would just had been some very boring stuff
So in short -
Animosity is the wrong word I think. WWII is just too far away for most of us now. Even the generation that witnessed it as children are getting old quickly now. For sure, the animosity/hostility was far greater during the 50-60's, when most ironically there was rarely much talked about it at all.
But what indeed has changed in the the last 10-15 years was the public discourse. When you, as a German, did question the Allied bombing campaign, publicly pondered about Allied war crimes (true or or just perceived ones), or talked too much about German victims of the war, you easily got under suspicion of having revisionist or even neo-nazi beliefs. Not without good reasons, but as you can imagine this lead often to not very objective views/discussions and such.
Now, cold war being a matter of the past, most participants of the war being gone, and even immediate postwar leaders being long dead, things have changed. My generation is pretty much removed from this events, the taboos are getting less. So we can nowadays see much more reports, discussions, documentaries and features about Germans being victims of the war. A TV movie like "Dresden" that aired last year under much public attention would have simply been impossible that way during the 70's-early 90's. Though that still is nowhere near the 50's kind of "we were all victims, we didn't know nothing, we just followed orders, it's all Hitler's fault" kind of stuff you could find in the cinemas and bookshelves ;)
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The only swastikas in the game are on Finnish aircraft, and there it has an entirely different meaning.
d'oh! i see that now, I just always assumed they were on all the german planes on the tail section just like in real life, oh well, a minor detail. Either way they're in the game!
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d'oh! i see that now, I just always assumed they were on all the german planes on the tail section just like in real life, oh well, a minor detail. Either way they're in the game!
They are not. The Finnish "swastika" is a completely different thing, with completely different meaning. And still in use today.
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They are not. The Finnish "swastika" is a completely different thing, with completely different meaning. And still in use today.
It's a mirror image of the National Socialist one, with the "broken" parts pointed the opposite direction...right?
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It's a mirror image of the National Socialist one, with the "broken" parts pointed the opposite direction...right?
It's the same image, it is not reversed. The differences are that the Finnish swastika is not tilted 45 degrees, and it is blue, not black.