Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: grizz441 on June 17, 2009, 02:26:02 PM
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I'm trying to understand the downside of putting an inactivity timer into the game to kick players who have been sitting in the tower for an hour or so. I did a search and checked out an older thread and was looking for reasons why it's a bad idea to kick players for inactivity.
Jarbo your asking HTC to tick off its own customers. You REALLY think they are going to want to do that?
So what I'm wondering is, who would be upset if they got kicked due to inactivity and for what reasons would it upset you as a customer?
Isn't it a little insecure of HTC to think that if they kick off players regardless of the reason, there's a chance they are going to cancel their subscriptions?
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In virtually all MMO's, if a player is inactive for a set period of time they are logged off automatically from the game.
ack-ack
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I'm trying to understand the downside of putting an inactivity timer into the game to kick players who have been sitting in the tower for an hour or so. I did a search and checked out an older thread and was looking for reasons why it's a bad idea to kick players for inactivity.
So what I'm wondering is, who would be upset if they got kicked due to inactivity and for what reasons would it upset you as a customer?
Isn't it a little insecure of HTC to think that if they kick off players regardless of the reason, there's a chance they are going to cancel their subscriptions?
I would actually like that. Sometimes I'll get side tracked and sit down to watch a little late night "Family Guy" only to wake up hours later to find the game still running. My computer would power down normally, but with AH running it just eats up energy. I know it's my fault I left it on, but if I got booted it wouldn't bother me at all. It really isn't too hard to just log back in.
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It would not tick me off per se, but it does sound like a bit of a pain. Having to relog, the potential that I may not make it back into the arena to take advantage of the small me time that I do get between family & work. It is not unusual to step away for a half an hour or so. Why? Try a four year old daughter on for size. :x
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People would then open up space in LWOrange where its often difficult to log on , seems like an idea to me . If you want back on just log in again and be happy about it .
Nutte
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Grizz it's funny you bring this up. I was just wondering the same thing yesterday. I am guilty of going afk for hours on end at times. I do regonize that fact that it isn't really fair for someone trying to log in and fly (and actually be active). I'd be all for it.
AKAK is right, many other games do the same thing.
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I go afk quite a bit and do stuff around the house, but the people that are advocating this change aren't interested in saving HTC money or bandwith. Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
Unless someone can put forward concrete numbers, I think it is safe to assume the 'afk crowd' is roughly consistent between countries and cancel each other out.
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Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
I am not sure what Grizz's motivation for the post is, but I must say that the Muppets are not known for their attraction to the higher populated country or their attraction to low ENY rides.
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It wouldn't bother me to get kicked for long periods of afk. Whenever I log on, I spend a tremendous amount of time afk... usually in very short spans though.
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Admittedly, I didn't read Grizz's post completely.
Except for this flights in the Ta152, I never see him in anything less than 20 eny. I'm not sure why he really cares one way or the other.
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I go afk quite a bit and do stuff around the house, but the people that are advocating this change aren't interested in saving HTC money or bandwith. Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
Unless someone can put forward concrete numbers, I think it is safe to assume the 'afk crowd' is roughly consistent between countries and cancel each other out.
I don't really care about the Eny stuff and I don't think that the afk crowd affects the way I play the game much. It's kind of like leaving a light on in the house when you aren't home. Is it going to cost you a lot of money in energy bill or light bulbs for all that wasted use? No, but you still turn the light off. Same thing, it would help keep the flow of players running slightly more efficiently, in particular through the primetime hours. As the game grows, imo an inactivity timer will have to be implemented eventually...
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I see no downside to a time limit either.. It wouldn't effect me, so im not overly concerned either way, that said if someone has sat inactive literally doing NOTHING for over an hour, I doubt they would care either, considering they probably forgot they were even logged in. I mean I leave the keyboard periodically, but usually im flying when I do so, (2 min to get a drink or something) I cant fathom staying logged in, minimizing the game, and not coming back to it for over an hour...
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I fly a 20 ENY plane so ENY doesn't usually effect me, but they could set it up to where when your AFK and after so many minutes it puts your name in the Red AFK state and once there your no longer affecting the ENY. And when you return to up a plane or GV you must uncheck the AFK box before your allowed to play again.
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In virtually all MMO's, if a player is inactive for a set period of time they are logged off automatically from the game.
ack-ack
And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
HiTech
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And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
HiTech
Not being combative, just curious, but it really bothered you that you got logged off from the server when you were gone for a long time? I suppose the most annoying part would be logging back in, but that's not that bad...
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And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
HiTech
Back to work, hitech.
You know you can't change minds with logic or business points of view, and we are eagerly awaiting the beta test. :D
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Not being combative, just curious, but it really bothered you that you got logged off from the server when you were gone for a long time? I suppose the most annoying part would be logging back in, but that's not that bad...
...unless you're cap'd out. :uhoh
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I go afk quite a bit and do stuff around the house, but the people that are advocating this change aren't interested in saving HTC money or bandwith. Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
Unless someone can put forward concrete numbers, I think it is safe to assume the 'afk crowd' is roughly consistent between countries and cancel each other out.
I can understand this, however ENY was put in to even things out. I go afk quite a bit, sometimes for hours, forgetting I was logged in. Do I feel that whatever country I'm on at that point in time should be penalized for my bad habits? No. Why not put the timer on there, to actually help the ENY issue, as well as help people who actually want to fly, get into that arena? How many threads in the passed 2 weeks have been started because of the limitations on the arenas?
There's more to this, than just the ENY. Even if there wasn't, the ENY should have been enough reason to do it.
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that would be easy to get around, you just up a gv and sit in a hanger some where while your AFK. :x
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And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
HiTech
But would it be possible to do that in AH if there was an auto-timer? Other MMO's let you circumvent it with the use of macros, something I don't think AH supports.
ack-ack
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Arena caps is what you'd think this wish was for..
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I can understand this, however ENY was put in to even things out. I go afk quite a bit, sometimes for hours, forgetting I was logged in. Do I feel that whatever country I'm on at that point in time should be penalized for my bad habits? No. Why not put the timer on there, to actually help the ENY issue, as well as help people who actually want to fly, get into that arena? How many threads in the passed 2 weeks have been started because of the limitations on the arenas?
There's more to this, than just the ENY. Even if there wasn't, the ENY should have been enough reason to do it.
:aok
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Could care less about the afk guys affecting #s. Just not really fair for someone to be on all day afk, and a guy getting on after work or something and not able to fly with squadies.
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Delirium
I go afk quite a bit and do stuff around the house, but the people that are advocating this change aren't interested in saving HTC money or bandwith. Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
I think your 90% wrong and 10% right. I would advocate the auto boot in the interest of fairness. You know some guys log in before they go to work, to ensure their spot in the busiest MA. That's around 9 to 10 hours. No big deal to me because I log in off peak but later on others can't get in. If I log out 5pm my time (GMT) I'll not be able to get in until nearer 7pm. So every evening I'm afk for dinner for 1 to 2 hour. Would it bother me if I was auto booted after an hour? Not in the least because I know I'm selfishly taking up a spot an active player could use.
Unless someone can put forward concrete numbers, I think it is safe to assume the 'afk crowd' is roughly consistent between countries and cancel each other out.
Cannot agree more except on the odd reset occasion when the plebs jump arenas for perkies.
hitech
And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
How long ago? How many arenas and were the arena player numbers like your game?
No biggy to me personally and I'm fully aware its your business but I think (no substantiated proof, figures blah blah) the vast majority of users are adult enough to accept being booted after an hour of inactivity (no joystick or keyboard commands). I'm just spouting off in the interest of fair play ol boy. :D
CHAPPY
that would be easy to get around, you just up a gv and sit in a hanger some where while your AFK.
As above base inactivity criteria on mouse, stick and keyboard commands. If none are moved for 1 maybe 2 hours....ping.... hello lobby :aok
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As above base inactivity criteria on mouse, stick and keyboard commands. If none are moved for 1 maybe 2 hours....ping.... hello lobby :aok
but then the 35K lank drivers will actually have to sit there and twitch the mouse now and then during their 5 hour climb out across the map.... HA!!! best idea.... EVAR!!!!
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You know some guys log in before they go to work, to ensure their spot in the busiest MA. That's around 9 to 10 hours. No big deal to me because I log in off peak but later on others can't get in.
That is such a selfish and rude mode of behavior that I would support the change just to punish it.
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That is such a selfish and rude mode of behavior that I would support the change just to punish it.
this.
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Back to work, hitech.
You know you can't change minds with logic or business points of view, and we are eagerly awaiting the beta test. :D
HiTech didn't provide any logic for why an inactivity timer would be bad for the customer or the business. Quit sucking up! :D Maybe there is a good explanation though? I don't want to be completely ignorant here with my head in the sand, I asked in my OP, for anyone to speak up who would have a problem with an inactivity timer and comment on why.
Like Del said, most of these requests deal with a selfish motive regarding the request, but I honestly don't have one. I always hear people whining about the caps and I don't really ever have a problem getting into the arena of my choice and have never griped about the caps, only defended them. I do however, think this would help a little bit getting into the arena of your choice during primetime for those who have problems getting in.
And also Del, I understand that you are going to be jumping around doing random stuff around the house which is why I didn't throw out some unreasonable inactivity timer out there like 15 minutes or something. I think an hour is fair and anyone who doesn't think it would be should enlighten me.
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What reason is there to prefer filling your servers with paying customers that are idling, instead of paying customers that are playing? Isn't that like selling pastry with more rather than less air?
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It almost seems like HTC is walking on egg shells with customers with this particular issue. Perhaps they don't have enough faith in the average customer to understand the logic behind booting you if you have been afk for a while?
Can you imagine it? "What! I left this derned thing logged on 5 hours ago and it kicked me off, I'm cancelling my account!"
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I don't see the point of even approaching the issue, like I said, the numbers of afk flyers have to be fairly consistent among the 3 countries.
As Hitech said, it isn't hard to make a timed macro to type something now and again, or even to launch and then exit in a GV to stay active. I've done it in other games and it is simple to set up, I'd rather see HTC work on things that need fixing and not attempt to fix something that isn't broken.
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I don't see the point of even approaching the issue, like I said, the numbers of afk flyers have to be fairly consistent among the 3 countries.
This isn't an Eny issue, it's more of a way to alleviate pressure getting into a capped arena. More efficiency in the flow of players during primetime hours.
it isn't hard to make a timed macro to type something now and again, or even to launch and then exit in a GV to stay active. I've done it in other games and it is simple to set up
You really think that the majority of people who are AFK for hours on end are purposely AFK? Most people accidentally stay logged on and are inadvertently taking somebodies spot during primetime in their arena of choice. There probably aren't many players who purposely stay afk for an actual reason.
I'd rather see HTC work on things that need fixing and not attempt to fix something that isn't broken.
Well nothing is 'broken' in the game. Strawman. Everything can be improved. Not everyone is happy with the caps. How can you make getting into an arena easier? Boot people that probably don't even know they are logged on in the first place. As for coading time, it would be very simple to add.
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Hmm I don't have any problem getting in to any arena...... ever.
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Hmm I don't have any problem getting in to any arena...... ever.
Neither do I. Some people do apparently though, hence the hundreds of cap threads.
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People logging in just to hold a spot? I say no way.Boot em and let the people that are playing have the slot. If they get pissed so what. Ones like this skewer the numbers on low number arenas.
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I don't see the point of even approaching the issue, like I said, the numbers of afk flyers have to be fairly consistent among the 3 countries.
Like he says.
I'm betting it's really pretty much a non-issue. There are probably much fewer players afk for a long period of time than you think.
wrongway
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Like he says.
I'm betting it's really pretty much a non-issue. There are probably much fewer players afk for a long period of time than you think.
wrongway
can't fault the logic and it's prolly too trivial for HTC to bother with. However, I've been know to consume rather a lot of beverages and wake up at the PC :o
Perhaps an auto boot check box set for 2 hours in options/ preferences / flight........again though..... trivial.
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It would not tick me off per se, but it does sound like a bit of a pain. Having to relog, the potential that I may not make it back into the arena to take advantage of the small me time that I do get between family & work. It is not unusual to step away for a half an hour or so. Why? Try a four year old daughter on for size. :x
small time?
i think i have all of 3.5 hours so far this month....and it's 1/2 over........
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Like he says.
I'm betting it's really pretty much a non-issue. There are probably much fewer players afk for a long period of time than you think.
wrongway
There's no way to tell. If i had to guess I'd say there is constantly at least 10-20 AFKers > 1 hour though sitting in the tower. I've seen PK1 sit AFK for 3 days before. :lol
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And of the ones I played if I wished to stay in with out getting a time out I could.
HiTech
Back to work, hitech.
You know you can't change minds with logic or business points of view, and we are eagerly awaiting the beta test. :D
LOL! Indeed.
HiTech sounded like Yoda toward the end of his statement. :D
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what if you leave the game afk to download new skins?
what if its squad night and i have to go afk quickly for dinner only to come back and be locked out due to multi arena rubbish?
not that i play much lately but these are valid concerns for all ain't they?
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You go afk for dinner for 2.5 hours ? Why not just log off? Why does your afk time trump some other dweeb that'd actually be flying?
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I'm trying to understand the downside of putting an inactivity timer into the game to kick players who have been sitting in the tower for an hour or so. I did a search and checked out an older thread and was looking for reasons why it's a bad idea to kick players for inactivity.
So what I'm wondering is, who would be upset if they got kicked due to inactivity and for what reasons would it upset you as a customer?
Isn't it a little insecure of HTC to think that if they kick off players regardless of the reason, there's a chance they are going to cancel their subscriptions?
Then you would have a bunch of ppl on the runway or rearm pad afk or the could be sitting in gvs at a non active spawn AFK so they wouldnt get kicked
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Besides, why kick them? Are the arenas that capped everyday?
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Then you would have a bunch of ppl on the runway or rearm pad afk or the could be sitting in gvs at a non active spawn AFK so they wouldnt get kicked
So true,players will always find a way to "screw the system" regardless of how it affects others game play. :salute
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Hmm I don't have any problem getting in to any arena...... ever.
There have been instances, using bish as an example, where we had so many logged in but you can easily look at the map and notice that bish had nowhere near the amount of dar as there should be with those numbers, were they in GV's on the ground? Not all, as you select there names and "goto" you can find them in towers nowhere near a fight and not responding or flying for hours, there have been several instances of people AFK with cv's for hours at a time and if you dont have a score to take control of it, its a loss to everyone that could have used it.
You will usually see alot of this just before a reset on any side, people switch over and AFK for the perks, or even worse log in AFK overnight just to maintain ENY on a side. Seen it all, A timer would resolve all that easily.
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This sounds like my Wishlist post
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This sounds like my Wishlist post
Not the endless list of some common sense stuff that gets lost in the BBS forever and ever........ :devil
What drama would we have if we move it....
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As a matter of fact I posted my thread on 6/16, this one was posted on 6/17 :uhoh
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There's no way to tell. If i had to guess I'd say there is constantly at least 10-20 AFKers > 1 hour though sitting in the tower. I've seen PK1 sit AFK for 3 days before. :lol
Total or per side? Either way, 300-400 in an arena and 3-10 per side AFK? Really going to make that much of a difference? Even if they are booted to "make room" in the arena vis a vi the cap, wouldn't the cap change correspondingly and not make a difference either?
There have been instances, using bish as an example, where we had so many logged in but you can easily look at the map and notice that bish had nowhere near the amount of dar as there should be with those numbers, were they in GV's on the ground? Not all, as you select there names and "goto" you can find them in towers nowhere near a fight and not responding or flying for hours, there have been several instances of people AFK with cv's for hours at a time and if you dont have a score to take control of it, its a loss to everyone that could have used it.
You will usually see alot of this just before a reset on any side, people switch over and AFK for the perks, or even worse log in AFK overnight just to maintain ENY on a side. Seen it all, A timer would resolve all that easily.
The CV thing. Bug? There was a CV the other night that no one could take control of. But hey, maybe it's SPIEZ!1!!.
AFK for perks? I guess they don't know that this doesn't work? Isn't it 24 hours on a side minimum to get "win teh war" perks? Couldn't you get as many, if not more perks flying an hour for the low number side? Couldn't you make as many or more perks by switching to the "losing" side? Educate the masses.
AFK to maintain ENY? Really? More than one, no more than five people, per side, will actually plan to maintain ENY by going AFK for an extended amount of time? You really believe this? I would have to :salute their dedication and foresight as silly as it seems.
wrongway
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Why not only count those airborne?
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Why not only count those airborne?
How will that work if the arena has a cap on the amount of players allowed in?
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Delirium
I think your 90% wrong and 10% right. I would advocate the auto boot in the interest of fairness. You know some guys log in before they go to work, to ensure their spot in the busiest MA. That's around 9 to 10 hours. No big deal to me because I log in off peak but later on others can't get in. If I log out 5pm my time (GMT) I'll not be able to get in until nearer 7pm. So every evening I'm afk for dinner for 1 to 2 hour. Would it bother me if I was auto booted after an hour? Not in the least because I know I'm selfishly taking up a spot an active player could use.
Cannot agree more except on the odd reset occasion when the plebs jump arenas for perkies.
hitech
How long ago? How many arenas and were the arena player numbers like your game?
No biggy to me personally and I'm fully aware its your business but I think (no substantiated proof, figures blah blah) the vast majority of users are adult enough to accept being booted after an hour of inactivity (no joystick or keyboard commands). I'm just spouting off in the interest of fair play ol boy. :D
CHAPPY
As above base inactivity criteria on mouse, stick and keyboard commands. If none are moved for 1 maybe 2 hours....ping.... hello lobby :aok
Plus 1 :aok
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Plus 1 :aok
:aok with the exception of reducing that time to 30 min, no activity in 30 min and you get DAS BOOT!
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often times, i'll go fix myself something to eat, and just sit in the tower......but i don't see a problem with logging people for sitting there idle too long.
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Then you would have a bunch of ppl on the runway or rearm pad afk or the could be sitting in gvs at a non active spawn AFK so they wouldnt get kicked
You really think most people that are AFK are doing so intentionally and would go out of their way to stay logged on? :huh
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You really think most people that are AFK are doing so intentionally and would go out of their way to stay logged on? :huh
IMO, Yes. Reasons may vary, most probably are harmless reasons. But it still detracts from players that try to log in and play that cant get into the arena due to caps.
If you have, say 5 people per side in an arena afk for more than 30 mins, thats 15 other people that could have been playing.
Even worse is you have 15 afk on one side, now those 15 afk guys that are sitting on the runway or at a spawn in a GV are affecting the eny of that side.
If they are sitting in the tower they are affecting people trying to get in to the arena.
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Total or per side? Either way, 300-400 in an arena and 3-10 per side AFK? Really going to make that much of a difference? Even if they are booted to "make room" in the arena vis a vi the cap, wouldn't the cap change correspondingly and not make a difference either?
Idk how much of a difference it would make. When you leave the house, why not leave a couple lights on and the faucet trickling in the kitchen? Is it really going to make that much of a difference?
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IMO, Yes. Reasons may vary, most probably are harmless reasons. But it still detracts from players that try to log in and play that cant get into the arena due to caps.
If you have, say 5 people per side in an arena afk for more than 30 mins, thats 15 other people that could have been playing.
Even worse is you have 15 afk on one side, now those 15 afk guys that are sitting on the runway or at a spawn in a GV are affecting the eny of that side.
If they are sitting in the tower they are affecting people trying to get in to the arena.
I'm sure that it wouldn't be hard to boot somebody for inactivity either who is just sitting on the runway for an hour doing nothing...
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I'm sure that it wouldn't be hard to boot somebody for inactivity either who is just sitting on the runway for an hour doing nothing...
Check this post out
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,266831.0.html
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You really think most people that are AFK are doing so intentionally and would go out of their way to stay logged on? :huh
I remember in 2007 sometime, there was this problem that came up where players would switch countries before they logged to increase the enemies eny and stay AFK all night long to help protect their country while they slept. Once the arena falls near 100 it's very common to see eny rise quickly for someone. 10 -15 people sitting in tower doing nothing makes a big difference then.
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I remember in 2007 sometime, there was this problem that came up where players would switch countries before they logged to increase the enemies eny and stay AFK all night long to help protect their country while they slept. Once the arena falls near 100 it's very common to see eny rise quickly for someone. 10 -15 people sitting in tower doing nothing makes a big difference then.
2008, 2009, and its still a problem.......
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I remember in 2007 sometime, there was this problem that came up where players would switch countries before they logged to increase the enemies eny and stay AFK all night long to help protect their country while they slept. Once the arena falls near 100 it's very common to see eny rise quickly for someone. 10 -15 people sitting in tower doing nothing makes a big difference then.
Lol, that's as lame as spying.
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Took this today. 123 in arena ..... 73 in flight. It could just be that 50 people are just about to up though. :rolleyes:
(http://i411.photobucket.com/albums/pp193/dmbear/ahss26.jpg)
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You go afk for dinner for 2.5 hours ? Why not just log off? Why does your afk time trump some other dweeb that'd actually be flying?
where did i say 2.5hours?
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That's what I'm saying. Find the value that's sure to only get the disposable idlers.
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I go afk quite a bit and do stuff around the house, but the people that are advocating this change aren't interested in saving HTC money or bandwidth. Those individuals are only asking for this change because it affects the way they want to play AH and they don't want to fly a plane with lower ENY or switch countries.
Unless someone can put forward concrete numbers, I think it is safe to assume the 'afk crowd' is roughly consistent between countries and cancel each other out.
BINGO!
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Tower sitting is a great way to let the kids know that the computer is bagged and I will be using it again very soon, dont even ask.
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I like the idea because i've known people to go afk in the tower and not return for a day or more. I wouldn't mind a kickout time of something in the neighborhood of 6 hours. This should give ample time for people to do whatever and return to the game.