Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Yarbles on June 22, 2009, 08:00:11 AM
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The 5 Inchers are fun for sure but people seem to get way too many kills too easily in them for reality.
I wouldnt necessarily change anything mind but I also think they are unrealistically effective. Maybe the planes fly too close to the ships but how often can you kill a flight of 3 bombers easily or a fighter which is constantly changing height speed and direction?
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I agree that 5" guns are to accurate, however if you do keep changing altitude, speed and heading (as you said) they do not hit you.
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I agree that 5" guns are to accurate, however if you do keep changing altitude, speed and heading (as you said) they do not hit you.
I have to laugh at this.....
After taking multiple hits while engaged in a good (high speed) TnB I disagree completely.
Strip
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There is no accuracy needed when it comes to the 5 inchers ... the shells use proximity fuses ... THE SHELL DOES NOT HAVE TO DIRECTLY HIT THE TARGET ... the target just has to be within the range that triggers the fuse and the shrapnel will definitely ruin your day.
Manned twin 5 inch guns shooting at the firing rate that we have on the CV equals certain death for low level bombers or fighters.
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I have to laugh at this.....
After taking multiple hits while engaged in a good (high speed) TnB I disagree completely.
Strip
I was talking about making turns to avoid the AAA, I never said it would not hit you when your fighting someone.
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Umm....wouldnt turning in a fight be the same thing as a turn to avoid AAA?
Or is that not changing speed, altitude and direction?
:confused:
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Umm....wouldnt turning in a fight be the same thing as a turn to avoid AAA?
Or is that not changing speed, altitude and direction?
:confused:
when your turn-fighting your pretty much circling in one spot. Have you ever made a high speed dive on a zero that sow you and made a really tight turn, but you still kill him because that tight turn left him in the same spot. So the same thing if you just keep circling around AAA, it will hit you, but if you are flying "straight" and making zig-zags the auto AAA will not hit you.
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You obviously fail to get it....
Dodging AAA doesnt work...I take more its in fighter than I do in lumbering buffs.
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...but if you are flying "straight" and making zig-zags the auto AAA will not hit you.
Serpentine! Serpentine!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN1WxSITwWw
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You obviously fail to get it....
Dodging AAA doesnt work...I take more its in fighter than I do in lumbering buffs.
well at least it does not hit me :)
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If the 5in shells hve proximity fuses then there is nothing you can do about it if you fly too close to a ship packing one of those. Besides I doubt the gunners are personaly trying to hit YOU, they are probably just aiming at the first aircraft that catches their eye.
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Well we know its not personal.....although it sure feels like it at times. :D
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Don't it just? One time I swear this gunner was aiming at me and I was one of the 4 aircraft or so that COULD'T damage his ship. I swear to god, he was aiming at me, I could even see his gun turret traversing to follow me.
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Don't it just? One time I swear this gunner was aiming at me and I was one of the 4 aircraft or so that COULD'T damage his ship. I swear to god, he was aiming at me, I could even see his gun turret traversing to follow me.
you mean you were a P-40B and the other 3 were B-24s? :rofl
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Don't it just? One time I swear this gunner was aiming at me and I was one of the 4 aircraft or so that COULD'T damage his ship. I swear to god, he was aiming at me, I could even see his gun turret traversing to follow me.
Must have been Vilkas in the gun :noid
Vilkas pwns all in all guns :devil
If our Geschwader Opa is in a gun near you, you are pretty much screwed :D
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I never said I got hit or shot down. I said they were aiming at me. And nope, I was in an La7 and one was a P-51D, while the other two were suprisingly P-40B's :confused:. How did you guess that there were P-40B's?
Oh and we weren't dangerous to the ship because we weren't carrying bombs or couldn't. I forget which was which for each plane.
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... I said they were aiming at me. And nope, I was in an La7 and one was a P-51D, ...
That is very possible.
I always aim for LA-7s. Because I hate them. I hate them to their very last rivet. I will persecute them to no end. I show no quarter to LA-7s.
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I always aim for LA-7s. Because I hate them. I hate them to their very last rivet. I will persecute them to no end. I show no quarter to LA-7s.
Don't hold back APDrone! How do you really feel about LA-7's? :lol
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As a matter of interest, 5" proximity fuse were not entroduced until mid 42. so they should be disabled in EW as least.
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Next time you are near a carrier, just dogfight in a light bomber. Unmanned puffy can't hit ya... for some reason... :confused:
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For fun, I tell my wife its an 8inch gun
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Lol 5" are heat seaking, magnetic HE and AP darn rounds. Hate them, to acurate.
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Auto 5" ack seems to be 200 times more accurate when the CV is on the horizon from the target plane, but if you get very close to the CV then the ack just can't hit anything.
Manned ack depends on the player. I, for one, can hit most planes within icon range, and a few lucky kills outside icon range :D .
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For fun, I tell my wife its an 8inch gun
:rofl That comment should be nominated for the satirical garden shed award 2009 :lol :rofl
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simple, you dont want to die to manned 5", stay out of Icon range. Any plane in icon range is considered a danger to CV
to me :) and ill fire on it.
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I don't know if the 5 inch is to accurate or not. We could ask the Japanese it seemed to work pretty well on them.
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I've made kills out of icon range on several occasions.
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There is no accuracy needed when it comes to the 5 inchers ... the shells use proximity fuses ... THE SHELL DOES NOT HAVE TO DIRECTLY HIT THE TARGET ... the target just has to be within the range that triggers the fuse and the shrapnel will definitely ruin your day.
Manned twin 5 inch guns shooting at the firing rate that we have on the CV equals certain death for low level bombers or fighters.
Are you... you mean to tell me the 5 inchers in this game are modeled with radar proximity fuses? I.E, the weapons that completely changed the nature of ship-based AAA, multiplying it's lethality twentyfold?
Well, that explains a lot.
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Best reference online I've found about the proximity fuse is here:
http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq96-1.htm#anchor1191195
Looks like it was deployed to the US fleet in May, 1944.
Also, here is how the 5" was aimed and operated.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/12981080/1943-US-Navy-WWII-5-Inch-Gun-Operations-Manual-102p
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Manned puffy is fairly annoying, although not nearly so annoying as auto puffy. Between 5 inch gunmen killing planes on the runway and hangars ending up shelled down, it is no wonder people drop the CVs as quickly as possible nowadays rather than using them using them for hours of furballing.
I had a novel idea awhile back. The we could approximate fused shells, using the throttle axis to set the explosive range. But of course the question is, do we want to simulate fused or proximity shells off our carrier? My answer: Yes. ;) It would be a nifty compromise IMO if the shells could be made to function as fused when thrown at a clean aircraft but would function as a proxi shell if they came close to an aircraft bearing ord. This would put the puffy more in line with a use that promotes rather than hinders fun gameplay, namely protecting the CVs from deadly assaults while more or less leaving fighters to work it out themselves most of the time.
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That is very possible.
I always aim for LA-7s. Because I hate them. I hate them to their very last rivet. I will persecute them to no end. I show no quarter to LA-7s.
Bring it on AP, BRING...IT...ON!!!
Lets see if you can shoot me down in a wirble, or if my cannons will kill you first. :D
Just kidding.................or am I?
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LOL... I'll still aim at you.. but, with a wirby, I probably won't hit you.
I don't think I could hit a Shark with freakin' Laser beam with a barn door skin with that beast.
Paints pretty pictures in the sky with my tracers, tho...
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I spent four years working on and in 5 inch 38 caliber gun mounts for the US Navy. The biggest difference I see is not the accuracy of the guns but rather the firing rate.
If a gun crew were to fire as many shells as can be done in AH, that crew would receive a burial at sea shortly after the completion of the firing.
A single mount 5 inch normally has a crew of 8 within the mount itself. There were 10 in the upper handling room and a minimum of 3 in the magazine. Thats 21 personnel necessary for a gun shoot. That is not counting the fire control folks in gun plot and the gun director.
The firing rate of the twin 5 inch mounts would be faster, but with the same consequences. Men can only work so fast and those mounts are hot, noisy and cramped.
A single 5 inch 38 mount crew could put out a max of MAYBE 8 rounds per minute.
The projectile for a 5 inch 38 caliber mount wieghed in at 55lbs. The powder canister weighed 35lbs.
Even a man in optimum physical condition would give out quickly having to manually load those shells for an extended period(3-5 minutes).
One of the biggest issues we had with those guns was the shock waves generated by firing. The projectile hoist from the upper handling room to the mount was activated by a series of cams within the hoist. When the gun fired these cams would be knocked out of their mounts causing the hoist to repeatedly cycle. This was a dangerous situation at best as this most often happened when a projectile was ready to be lifted to the mount.
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interesting post above :aok
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Yes -- thank you for that information, SIM.
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We used to run a firing equation called "Quickdraw".
When operating as part of a squadron or TG, we would receive orders from the flagship to fire 5 rounds on a specific bearing in less than one minute. Normally we would have the rounds stowed in the mount itself for this exercise. The gun crew for this exercise was made up entirely of the Gunners from Fox Div. All 5 of us would run to the mount, light off the equipment, train out on bearing, elevate and fire the rounds. Was kinda neat seeing the Chief huff and puff his way thru the passageways to get to the mount.
Those mounts could and often were fired with less than a full complement of crew. But the gunners paid the price over the next couple of days.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proximity_fuze