Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Tango on February 14, 2010, 04:52:46 PM
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FLORENCE, Ariz. — The oldest death row inmate in the U.S. has died of natural causes at age 94.
An Arizona Department of Corrections spokesman says Viva Leroy Nash died late Friday at the state's prison complex in Florence.
Nash was still on death row, but spokesman Barrett Marson said Sunday he did not know if Nash died in his cell or in a medical facility at the prison.
Nash was born in 1915 and had a criminal record dating to the 1930s.
He spent 25 years in prison for shooting a Connecticut police officer in 1947, and was sentenced to life in prison for shooting a man to death in Salt Lake City in 1977. But he escaped from a prison work crew in October 1982 and fatally shot a Phoenix coin shop sales clerk a month later.
He was sentenced to death for that crime.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,585848,00.html?test=latestnews
Death penalty works ONLY when its carried out.
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Exactly. But hey, he's dead, we got what we wanted.
-Penguin
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However that clerk would have been able to live his life if they had put him to death for killing the guy in Salt Lake, 5 years before. Seems they are more worried about protecting the killer than the victims.
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Thats why im all for a better death penalty system.
If you are convicted of murder and are 100% guilty without any doubts of falsehood, you are taken out back and shot. Would save the taxpayers $$$$
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I agree
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The holdup was that he committed the last crime in wrong state. Had he done the crime in Texas. The express lane would've speeded up the process.
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Thats why im all for a better death penalty system.
If you are convicted of murder and are 100% guilty without any doubts of falsehood, you are taken out back and shot. Would save the taxpayers $$$$
That's the trouble with it all. You're never 100% sure if they did it. It's like trying to get to the speed of light.
-Penguin
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That's the trouble with it all. You're never 100% sure if they did it. It's like trying to get to the speed of light.
-Penguin
If the punk is caught red handed or confesses (without coercion)...that's 100%...but not according to the law and whether or not a deal can be made.
The system isn't perfect, as stories of wrongly convicted death row inmates surface...but for a person like Nash, it should have been the fast track instead of $500,000+ to the tax payers.
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See Rule #14
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Exactly. But hey, he's dead, we got what we wanted.
-Penguin
Im sure the coin clerk would agree with you if he weren't DEAD ALREADY.
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"What I always wondered was how they have the executions one at a time: why not just execute everyone was found guilty of a big enough crime at once? It would really free up some space!"
And the 'Hang-'Em-High' brigade would have a great day out too.
:cool:
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That's the trouble with it all. You're never 100% sure if they did it. It's like trying to get to the speed of light.
-Penguin
Wrong.
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However that clerk would have been able to live his life if they had put him to death for killing the guy in Salt Lake, 5 years before. Seems they are more worried about protecting the killer than the victims.
They do that because there is too much money involved keeping prisoners alive. Greed. :mad:
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Such typical mis information posted by the pro death'rs here.
Life in prison is cheaper than death, do a little research if you don't believe me. Every single scientific study on the matter agrees.
Too many innocent people have been sentenced to death. No, a confession doesn't mean they are 100% guilty every time, almost nothing can prove 100% guilt in the majority of these cases.
Life in prison is punishment enough. Many lifers have turned their lives around and have done productive things from inside prison. No reason to kill these people.
The death penalty is outdated and barbaric. I think over the next few decades it will be abolished in the USA.
:bolt:
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Such typical mis information posted by the pro death'rs here.
The death penalty is outdated and barbaric.
Some people deserve to be killed. Without doubt NEED to be killed. The shame is people like you make it so damned difficult.
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Life in prison is cheaper than death, do a little research if you don't believe me. Every single scientific study on the matter agrees.
It shouldn't be though, the bureaucracy and endless appeals and legal stuff is what causes that.
I'm not sure how I feel about it in general.
Some crimes are so heinous that it just seems there should be an ultimate punishment of death.
Certainly cases decided before advances in DNA testing and such were made, should be reviewed and possibly commuted to life.
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Send em to Texas we will take care of it for them.
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Such typical mis information posted by the pro death'rs here.
Life in prison is cheaper than death, do a little research if you don't believe me. Every single scientific study on the matter agrees.
No it isn't and not a single study has shown the cost of housing repeat offenders...especially the violent ones..."humane" execution costs more than hanging or firing squad...and the majority of costs associated with executions is the legal work to stop it...the only thing you are correct about is the added cost of keeping an inmate on death row, it's more expensive, therefore expedient execution will keep the accumulated costs down.
There's a study you probably haven't read...percentage of repeat offenders before the "humane treatment" people stepped in shouting for prison reform...it was squashed at the federal level.
Too many innocent people have been sentenced to death. No, a confession doesn't mean they are 100% guilty every time, almost nothing can prove 100% guilt in the majority of these cases.
As long as you have law enforcement corruption, it's going to happen. Technology is beginning to lower the incidence of erroneous convictions, especially when the judges allow the evidence to be submitted without predjudice. And yes, a free will confession does mean 100% guilty by the letter of the law...especially when the scumbag admits to the deaths of victims the police weren't even aware of and he shows them the bodies.
Life in prison is punishment enough. Many lifers have turned their lives around and have done productive things from inside prison. No reason to kill these people.
Tell that to the people who have lost loved ones to the violent scumbags who are still alive in a prison...we already have a prison system that is over crowded, cannot be financially maintained and rife with corruption and prisoner violence...and the answers from prison reformists is what? Higher taxes? Release non-violent offenders early?
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See Rule #14
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Such typical mis information posted by the pro death'rs here.
Life in prison is cheaper than death, do a little research if you don't believe me. Every single scientific study on the matter agrees.
Too many innocent people have been sentenced to death. No, a confession doesn't mean they are 100% guilty every time, almost nothing can prove 100% guilt in the majority of these cases.
Life in prison is punishment enough. Many lifers have turned their lives around and have done productive things from inside prison. No reason to kill these people.
The death penalty is outdated and barbaric. I think over the next few decades it will be abolished in the USA.
:bolt:
I'll agree that there has been innocent people sent to death, but also what about the ones caught on camera and other means that without a doubt they are guilty of it without denial. I dont see how life in prison is cheaper then a 20 cent lead slug
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I'll agree that there has been innocent people sent to death, but also what about the ones caught on camera and other means that without a doubt they are guilty of it without denial. I dont see how life in prison is cheaper then a 20 cent lead slug
Then let those guys spend the rest of their lives locked up. Talk to some people who have spent time in federal prison, spending the rest of your life in there may be a worse punishment than death.
Life in prison is cheaper than putting someone to death. There is plenty of research already done on the matter, and it is not entirely for the reasons other posters have said. The research is out there for you if you are really interested in knowing the facts.
And true, it is still not cheaper than a '20 cent slug', but I'm sure glad our country does not have a justice system like that.
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I sure wish it did. It might give criminals second thoughts about doing whatever they please. Or change the laws that homeowners and property owners can rightfully defend their property and houses from criminals without fear of being sued by the scumbags
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Send em to Texas we will take care of it for them.
+1
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Send em to Texas we will take care of it for them.
doesnt texas has the most innocent people that were sentenced to death?
semp
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Here is the story behind one of Texas latest executions. There was no doubt about guilt and it still took 13 years for the process to be completed.
Kenneth Mosley, 51, was executed by lethal injection on 7 January 2010 in Huntsville, Texas for killing a police officer in a bank.
On 15 February 1997, Mosley, then 38, entered a bank in Garland. One of the tellers recognized him from a previous robbery at the bank. The teller informed her manager. After the manager saw Mosley, he also recognized him from tapes of the other robbery. The manager returned to her office, pushed the alarm button, and called bank security and 9-1-1.
The manager then went outside and met police officer David Moore, who responded to the emergency call, and described Mosley to him. Moore, who was in uniform, then went inside, approached Mosley, and asked to speak with him. Moore struggled with Mosley, who refused to keep his hands still. Mosley then pulled a 9 mm pistol from underneath his shirt. Several shots were fired. Officer Moore then shoved Mosley through a window. Both men fell to the ground into one of the drive-through lanes. Mosley then stood up and shot Moore while he was still on the ground.
As Mosley was walking away from the bank, a second officer spotted him and ordered him to drop his gun and get on the ground. When Mosley turned toward the officer, the officer shot him once in the wrist. Mosley dropped the gun, then complied with the officer's orders. When searching him, authorities found a holdup note.
Paramedics arrived at the scene within minutes, but Officer Moore was already dead. He had been shot four times. One bullet struck him over the top edge of his protective vest.
At Mosley's trial, a witnesses testified that after the two men fell through the window, he saw Mosley pause to look around, point the gun at Moore, and shoot him.
Mosley claimed that he walked into the bank unaware that he had a gun in his pocket. When Officer Moore asked him what was in his hand, Mosley remembered the gun and pulled it out only to "get rid of it". In the ensuing struggle, he shot the officer.
"I wasn't pulling it out thinking anything would happen," he said.
Mosley had no prior criminal convictions, but the state presented evidence of prior robberies and thefts he had committed, including the previous robbery of the same bank. At the time of the murder, he was wanted for robbing a fast-food restaurant in Mesquite five days earlier. The state also presented testimony that while in jail, Mosley once said, "it would make my day to kill another cop."
As the jury pronounced the death sentence, Mosley exploded into an obscenity-laced tirade and was forcefully removed from the courtroom.
A jury convicted Mosley of capital murder in October 1997 and sentenced him to death. The Texas Court of Criminal Appeals affirmed the conviction and sentence in May 2000. Mosley filed a motion for a rehearing, which was granted. The Court of Criminal Appeals then reaffirmed the conviction and sentence in June 2003. All of his subsequent appeals in state and federal court were denied.
Mosley's execution was attended by Sheila Moore - his victim's widow - and by Garland police captain Bill Cortez. Mosley did not look at the witnesses during his execution. He declined to make a last statement. He was pronounced dead at 6:16 p.m.
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See Rule #14
LMAO now THATS funny.
It was intended more as a figure of speech then to spark debate. But ok.
Sorry bout that cheif
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doesnt texas has the most innocent people that were sentenced to death?
semp
did you read that on the back of a box of captain crunch cereal? Link one source, any single source, that definitively PROVES that any single innocent person has been executed in the 20th or 21st century in the United States, or Texas.
Some people say that it is better for a man guilty of murder to be set free rather than to have an innocent man suffer in his place. I disagree in this respect: No man guilty of murder should ever be set free. There exist in this world evil human beings that must be killed to defend the larger value of life.
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While I have no problem with capital punishment.
Executing him sooner wouldn't have saved any lives in this case, as he wasn't sentenced to death till after his second and last murder.
What I'm wondering is if it was smart to have a convicted murderer out on a work crew, where he could escape.
Seems smart to only allowed non-violent offenders on work crews.
I worked with an inmate crew once, while building a new horse arena for the county. The deputy in charge of them told us not to worry because they were all "non-violent offenders". They didn't really even guard them that closely, and we had no trouble working with them for a week.
I just seems a bit odd, that they would release a convicted murderer for a work crew, with weak enough security that he could escape.
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did you read that on the back of a box of captain crunch cereal? Link one source, any single source, that definitively PROVES that any single innocent person has been executed in the 20th or 21st century in the United States, or Texas.
Some people say that it is better for a man guilty of murder to be set free rather than to have an innocent man suffer in his place. I disagree in this respect: No man guilty of murder should ever be set free. There exist in this world evil human beings that must be killed to defend the larger value of life.
Yeah, one problem with that...
If the innocent man suffers in his place, then isn't the murderer free by default? See, with the first option, you aren't entailing that any innocents are harmed.
Let me make it really simple so that you can pick apart if need be:
Option One
Murderer is set free
Chance of killing
Option Two
Innocent man suffers in murderer's place
Murderer therefore must have been set free, as he is not suffering (assumed to be jail time)
See, option one is better than option two.
-Penguin
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Tax payers money working at best.
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Yeah, one problem with that...
If the innocent man suffers in his place, then isn't the murderer free by default? See, with the first option, you aren't entailing that any innocents are harmed.
Let me make it really simple so that you can pick apart if need be:
Option One
Murderer is set free
Chance of killing
Option Two
Innocent man suffers in murderer's place
Murderer therefore must have been set free, as he is not suffering (assumed to be jail time)
See, option one is better than option two.
-Penguin
I do not consider a "innocent man suffering in a guilty mans place" an option because it is NOT AN OPTION.
As long as any justice system places punishment on an innocent individual then that justice system is unacceptably flawed and needs to be repaired. No inncocent person should ever be condemned to a day, a week or life in prison, or death. To say that it happens and is a valid reason not to execute is a chickencrap method to try and undermine the states right to act in the defense of its citizens. Some human beings are just too damned dangerous to keep alive.
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Such typical mis information posted by the pro death'rs here.
Life in prison is punishment enough. Many lifers have turned their lives around and have done productive things from inside prison. No reason to kill these people.
:bolt:
i normally don't disagree with you.....but that is just crazy talk there.
free food for life. free clothes(although not much choice) for life. free medical for life. free gym for life. free cable for life. free library for life.
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No it isn't and not a single study has shown the cost of housing repeat offenders...especially the violent ones..."humane" execution costs more than hanging or firing squad...and the majority of costs associated with executions is the legal work to stop it...the only thing you are correct about is the added cost of keeping an inmate on death row, it's more expensive, therefore expedient execution will keep the accumulated costs down.
There's a study you probably haven't read...percentage of repeat offenders before the "humane treatment" people stepped in shouting for prison reform...it was squashed at the federal level.
As long as you have law enforcement corruption, it's going to happen. Technology is beginning to lower the incidence of erroneous convictions, especially when the judges allow the evidence to be submitted without predjudice. And yes, a free will confession does mean 100% guilty by the letter of the law...especially when the scumbag admits to the deaths of victims the police weren't even aware of and he shows them the bodies.
Tell that to the people who have lost loved ones to the violent scumbags who are still alive in a prison...we already have a prison system that is over crowded, cannot be financially maintained and rife with corruption and prisoner violence...and the answers from prison reformists is what? Higher taxes? Release non-violent offenders early?
define humane execution
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Link one source, any single source, that definitively PROVES that any single innocent person has been executed in the 20th or 21st century in the United States, or Texas.
Definite or Reasonable Doubt? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barry-scheck/innocent-but-executed_b_272327.html)
More? (http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/executed-possibly-innocent)
Once you're executed, possibly innocent or not, does anyone care anyway?
wrongway
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define humane execution
last K-9 I had put down by my vet was done in a pretty damned humane way by any standards. Out like a light and peacefully into the long good night with a simple injection. We ought to be able to put vicious human dogs down just as humanely.
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Yeah, one problem with that...
If the innocent man suffers in his place, then isn't the murderer free by default? See, with the first option, you aren't entailing that any innocents are harmed.
Let me make it really simple so that you can pick apart if need be:
Option One
Murderer is set free
Chance of killing
Option Two
Innocent man suffers in murderer's place
Murderer therefore must have been set free, as he is not suffering (assumed to be jail time)
See, option one is better than option two.
-Penguin
You're right, set the murderers free. They can stay at your place.
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last K-9 I had put down by my vet was done in a pretty damned humane way by any standards. Out like a light and peacefully into the long good night with a simple injection. We ought to be able to put vicious human dogs down just as humanely.
that was why i asked........the lethal injections we use on people are no where near as humane as some would have us believe.....unless i'm mis-informed.
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Why does capital punishment need to be "humane"? Who determines what is considered "humane" anyway? As the legal system has found that the crime was deserved of a death penalty, how "humanely" were the victims treated by the poor, poor murderer? A firing squad is quick, efficient and likely a much better death than his victims experienced. Give the convicted two years to appeal, then sayonara.
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Definite or Reasonable Doubt? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barry-scheck/innocent-but-executed_b_272327.html)
More? (http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/executed-possibly-innocent)
Once you're executed, possibly innocent or not, does anyone care anyway?
wrongway
Really?
Link 1, and I quote: "There is no way to tell how many of the over 1,000 people executed since 1976 may also have been innocent."
Link 2: The New Yorker comes along and tells us someone name Cameron Todd Willingham was wrongly executed. Ok.....so says the New Yorker. Im a man of Justice and if a Jury of his peers found him guilty then they had better be damned sure about it. No doubts. Thats all I can say. If a man is wrongly executed then it is imperative that the entire system of justice be strengthened, not weakened. No innoccent man should be allowed to be found guilty. That is the goal. Not removing the States Right to act in defense of its citizens.
If the justice system executed an innocent man, then fix that system. Those people within that justice system need to be held accountable for it.
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Then let those guys spend the rest of their lives locked up. Talk to some people who have spent time in federal prison, spending the rest of your life in there may be a worse punishment than death.
Life in prison is cheaper than putting someone to death. There is plenty of research already done on the matter, and it is not entirely for the reasons other posters have said. The research is out there for you if you are really interested in knowing the facts.
And true, it is still not cheaper than a '20 cent slug', but I'm sure glad our country does not have a justice system like that.
The original post shows that keeping them alive only puts more innocent people at risk if/when they escape.
As for executions costing more than keeping them alive, the French had it right in the late 1700's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guillotine
I KNOW that is far cheaper than kepping them alive and is quick andpainless.
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It's ironic that I'm reading "The Innocent Man" by John Grisham right now...the story is enough to make you angry the whole time. Of course this is the exception, but it outlines clearly why knee-jerk capital punishment is a disservice to justice.
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I do not consider a "innocent man suffering in a guilty mans place" an option because it is NOT AN OPTION.
As long as any justice system places punishment on an innocent individual then that justice system is unacceptably flawed and needs to be repaired. No inncocent person should ever be condemned to a day, a week or life in prison, or death. To say that it happens and is a valid reason not to execute is a chickencrap method to try and undermine the states right to act in the defense of its citizens. Some human beings are just too damned dangerous to keep alive.
Wait, the post that I responded to was using those two as options. I outlined what the problem was, and outlined how Option 1 is better. Re-read the post, I think that you made an honest mistake in looking at the two numbers. Nothing wrong, just want to make it clear as to what you are saying.
-Penguin
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Wait, the post that I responded to was using those two as options. I outlined what the problem was, and outlined how Option 1 is better. Re-read the post, I think that you made an honest mistake in looking at the two numbers. Nothing wrong, just want to make it clear as to what you are saying.
-Penguin
ok. the clerk at the corner store just got murdered. someone saw your dad come out of that store only an hour beforehand. he gets arrested, and convicted. now he's on deathrow, appealing. all the while, the murderer is out running around.
how is that better?
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Are you being thick on purpose? Geez man...
Situation One
Innocent walks, murderer walks
Situation Two
Innocent suffers, murderer walks
In either case, the murder walks free as a bird, so you want to make the innocent man safe.
Ok, well then you want situation one to happen, the murderer runs but my dad is also free. It seems like you just aren't getting it at all. I want Option One to happen. Also, the choice is a double bind, either option is bad, and one must choose the lesser evil.
-Penguin
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Are you being thick on purpose? Geez man...
Situation One
Innocent walks, murderer walks
Situation Two
Innocent suffers, murderer walks
In either case, the murder walks free as a bird, so you want to make the innocent man safe.
Ok, well then you want situation one to happen, the murderer runs but my dad is also free. It seems like you just aren't getting it at all. I want Option One to happen. Also, the choice is a double bind, either option is bad, and one must choose the lesser evil.
-Penguin
View Profile Personal Message (Online)
Re: Oldest Death Row Inmate
« Reply #28 on: Today at 11:41:10 AM »
Reply with quoteQuote
Quote from: Yeager on Today at 10:38:45 AM
did you read that on the back of a box of captain crunch cereal? Link one source, any single source, that definitively PROVES that any single innocent person has been executed in the 20th or 21st century in the United States, or Texas.
Some people say that it is better for a man guilty of murder to be set free rather than to have an innocent man suffer in his place. I disagree in this respect: No man guilty of murder should ever be set free. There exist in this world evil human beings that must be killed to defend the larger value of life.
Yeah, one problem with that...
If the innocent man suffers in his place, then isn't the murderer free by default? See, with the first option, you aren't entailing that any innocents are harmed.
Let me make it really simple so that you can pick apart if need be:
Option One
Murderer is set free
Chance of killing
Option Two
Innocent man suffers in murderer's place
Murderer therefore must have been set free, as he is not suffering (assumed to be jail time)
See, option one is better than option two.
-Penguin
there is your exact post.
and there is no reason for sa murder to be set free.
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It's ironic that I'm reading "The Innocent Man" by John Grisham right now...the story is enough to make you angry the whole time. Of course this is the exception, but it outlines clearly why knee-jerk capital punishment is a disservice to justice.
Its not a disservice if there is evidence AND witnesses that convict him of the murder.
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yeager I never said texas had executed an innocent man. but they have lots of people that were sentenced to death that had their convictions overturned because they were innocent. which makes you think what if, just one of those guys that got executed was actually innocent. as for the guilty ones, let them burn.
semp
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Rereading the original post, it seems the thread has really gone off topic. This is a very rare instance where a death row inmaye actually never saw the execution date by expiring of natural old age complications. The result is a man had died and whether he was guilty or innocent only the deceased knows for sure and the rest of us has to accept the findings of the court.
I'm personally glad that we live in a country where the laws stipulate a person is innocent until proven guilty. Most likely the man was found guilty from some videotape of the last criminal offense with the death of the clerk. This is purely a guess since I've no knowledge of the court proceedings.
Simply, he beat the system.
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yeager I never said Texas had executed an innocent man. but they have lots of people that were sentenced to death that had their convictions overturned because they were innocent. which makes you think what if, just one of those guys that got executed was actually innocent. as for the guilty ones, let them burn.
semp
Rgr that. I cant stand the idea of any innocent person being convicted and sentenced for doing NOTHING illegal. But, just because it might happen does not mean we should abandon law. Continue to enforce, continue to have trials and when appropriate convict and sentence people...but most importantly, FIX anything in this justice system that allows for wrongful convictions......
Violent murderous child killers, killer rapists and other such abhorrent deviant human beings....... accuse them, put them on trial, and when found guilty beyond any reasonable doubt (and mercy is NOT appropriate), euthanize them in a manner that is not cruel or unusual. Just get rid of them and do it quickly.
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There have been several executions of people that proved innocent later in the USA.
BTW, why is it so expensive keeping them locked in? Couldn't they work for their food??? :devil
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Couple of things to consider.
First, it's not so much the cost of warehousing an inmate. It's the cost of trying the suspect.
Second, I'm pretty sure no state allows for official review of a post execution conviction.
There's some pretty good data out there that suggests as many as 70% of all criminal convictions nationwide are flawed. Most are simply matters of procedure but just about all are about money. That's why many like DuPont or Simpson may be found guilty but never see a needle.
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There have been several executions of people that proved innocent later in the USA.
BTW, why is it so expensive keeping them locked in? Couldn't they work for their food??? :devil
thanks to lawyers, no, they often don't have to.
personally, i think that they should be out doing the jobs that supposedly no one wants to do.
some of the "non-violent" prisoners here in new jersey often get sent out on road crews to pick up trash along the highways.......but they don't get sent out when it's too hot or too clod.......
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I'm still persuaded by Bentham that for a punishment to be just, it must remissible.
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Well, our justice system isnt perfect by any stretch. But, as far as the death sentence goes.. Thats a pretty big conviction. They had better be damned sure, without any doubt that he/she is guilty.
Correct me if im wrong here, but from what ive read lethal injection is pretty humane. Especially compared to some violent murder or rape. Isnt lethal injection carried out with a cocktail of three or four different drugs?
Something like the first being some sort of "pain" relief drug, so on and whatnot. With the last being the drug that actually stops the heart? I could be totally wrong here, I havent read anything about this in awhile.
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There have been several executions of people that proved innocent later in the USA.
who are these several people? Give names? dates of death? places of death?
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Procedure in U.S. executions
This section needs additional citations for verification.
Please help improve this article by adding reliable references. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (September 2007)
Executions by the federal government are carried out at the Terre Haute Federal Correctional Complex. The picture is of a gurney on which prisoners rest during an execution by lethal injection.The condemned criminal offender is strapped onto a gurney; two intravenous cannulae ("IVs") are inserted, one in each arm. Only one is necessary to carry out the execution; the other is reserved as a backup in the event the primary line fails. A line leading from the IV Line in an adjacent room is attached and secured to the prisoner's IV, and secured so the line does not snap during the injections.
The arm of the offender is swabbed with alcohol before the cannula is inserted.[9] The needles and equipment used are also sterilized. There have been questions about why these precautions against infection are performed despite the purpose of the injection being death. There are several explanations: cannulae are sterilized during manufacture, so using sterile ones is routine medical procedure. Secondly, there is a chance that the prisoner could receive a stay of execution after the cannulae have been inserted, as happened in the case of James Autry in October 1983 (he was eventually executed on March 14, 1984). Finally, it would be a hazard to prison personnel to use unsterilized equipment.
Following connection of the lines, saline drips are started in both arms. This too is standard medical procedure: it must be ascertained that the connections are clear, ensuring that the chemicals do not mix in the IV lines and occlude the needle, preventing the drugs from reaching the inmate. A heart monitor is attached so that prison officials can monitor when death has occurred.
The intravenous injection is usually a sequence of drugs given in a set sequence, designed to first induce unconsciousness followed by death through paralysis of respiratory muscles and/or by cardiac arrest through depolarization of cardiac muscle cells. The execution of the condemned in most states involves three separate injections (in sequential order):
Sodium thiopental: ultra-short action barbiturate, an anaesthetic agent capable of rendering the prisoner unconscious in a few seconds.
Pancuronium: non-depolarizing muscle relaxant, causes complete, fast and sustained paralysis of the skeletal striated muscles, including the diaphragm and the rest of the respiratory muscles; this would eventually cause death by asphyxiation.
Potassium chloride: stops the heart, and thus causes death by cardiac arrest.
The drugs are not mixed externally as that can cause them to precipitate. Also, a sequential injection is key to achieve the desired effects in the appropriate order: administration of the barbiturate is essential to minimize physical distress during the process; the infusion of the muscle relaxant induces complete paralysis but not unconsciousness, and the injection of a highly-concentrated solution of potassium chloride can cause severe pain in the site of the IV line as well as along the punctured arm.
Courtesy of Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lethal_injection
-Penguin
P.S. Click the link to find out more!
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Wrong.
Actually, that statement you disagreed with has been the only piece of legitimate wisdom yet offered within this thread. 100% certainties simply do not exist, ever, in any situation.
There's a theoretical probability that your molecules will all line up perfectly, allowing you to walk through a brick wall...
Or, if you want really far-fetched, there's a cosmic chance, however microscopic, that one day, the neurons in your brain will actually produce a coherent, well-constructed argument.
Anything is possible.
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who are these several people? Give names? dates of death? places of death?
According to the innocence project 17 people who have been executed in the United States have had their convictions overturned by DNA evidence.
http://innocenceproject.org/
I imagine if you wanted to find the individual cases you could google it.
The idea that you can routinely convict people with enough certainty to end their lives is kind of disturbing to me... however I'm not against capital punishment, I certainly think it should be used in extreme cases of mass murder rape etc....
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According to the innocence project 17 people who have been executed in the United States have had their convictions overturned by DNA evidence.
I certainly think it should be used in extreme cases of mass murder rape etc....
Where are the 17 families suing those states for wrongful death?
Murder is extreme. The punishment must fit the crime.
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Procedure in U.S. executions
This section needs additional citations for verification.
Please help improve this article by adding reliable references. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (September 2007)
Penguin the heading on that wikipedia page is more or less telling you that the information shouldn't be quoted. Is there only one citation for that whole passage?
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who are these several people? Give names? dates of death? places of death?
Here is one that is suspicious:
http://www.law.northwestern.edu/wrongfulconvictions/exonerations/flJacobsSummary.html (http://www.law.northwestern.edu/wrongfulconvictions/exonerations/flJacobsSummary.html)
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Its not a disservice if there is evidence AND witnesses that convict him of the murder.
There was bogus evidence and coerced witnesses in this book as well...the main character was eventually cleared by DNA evidence that was conveniently ignored during the first trial. This is obviously the exception, but you get my point.
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There was bogus evidence and coerced witnesses in this book as well...the main character was eventually cleared by DNA evidence that was conveniently ignored during the first trial. This is obviously the exception, but you get my point.
Well hell....no one will EVAR Get a fair trial so lets just do away with the whole damned concept of justice. Fend fer yerselves heathens!!!
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That's the trouble with it all. You're never 100% sure if they did it. It's like trying to get to the speed of light.
-Penguin
While in some cases it may be true but in others, 100% certainty has been proven without a doubt. Ted Bundy and Timothy McVeigh are just some examples were it has been shown without a shadow of a doubt they were 100% guilty of the crimes they were executed for.
ack-ack
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Penguin the heading on that wikipedia page is more or less telling you that the information shouldn't be quoted. Is there only one citation for that whole passage?
here's one from kalifornia
http://www.cdcr.ca.gov/reports_research/Lethal_Injection.html
more
http://www.scienceline.org/2007/11/12/ask-sergo-deathpenalty/
http://people.howstuffworks.com/lethal-injection6.htm
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Well hell....no one will EVAR Get a fair trial so lets just do away with the whole damned concept of justice. Fend fer yerselves heathens!!!
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_mJmwQtPmusk/SfYZ1cjoTRI/AAAAAAAADwI/MRWQ9zahPKY/s400/strawman2.jpg)
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Penguin the heading on that wikipedia page is more or less telling you that the information shouldn't be quoted. Is there only one citation for that whole passage?
Oy, anax, you really love to make us work. I'll get you your nice hot steamy bowl of cited passages. ;)
This is what happens: http://people.howstuffworks.com/lethal-injection2.htm
And as for what leaves them dead:
The Process
•The prisoner is bound to a gurney; two needles are inserted into the prisoner's veins and a saline solution is injected.
•Sodium thiopental, an anesthetic, is injected to put the prisoner to sleep.
•Pavulon, or pancuronium bromide, is released, inducing paralysis and stopping breathing.
•Finally, the flow of potassium chloride stops the heart. This chemical can cause excruciating pain if the prisoner is still conscious.
Courtesy of: http://www.amnestyusa.org/death-penalty/lethal-injection/page.do?id=1101012