Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Sakoo on June 30, 2010, 12:04:23 PM
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Watching a WWII doc the other day and they showed an F4u taking off a carrier with jet pods (what did they call them?) underneath the fuselage just
aft of the wing root.
Was this actually done in WWII or was this more likely and early Korean War adaptation?
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RATO units?
But that is rocket, not jet.. :headscratch:
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Experiments were performed in 1944 with an old F4U-1 with "jet assisted take-off (JATO)" gear, featuring a small solid-fuel rocket attached on the fuselage just behind each wingroot, to allow the Corsair to get off the ground more easily with heavy loads, but it appears that JATO was rarely, if ever, used in service with the Corsair.
http://www.vectorsite.net/avf4u.html (http://www.vectorsite.net/avf4u.html)
So it was WWII, but just a test.
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yes the f4u was able to carry rocket thrusters to shorten carrier take-off. They were accually developed by the british before the war as a booster for medium bomber's as we where looking in-to flyin Blenhim's off of carrier's and over the burmese jungle to save on man power and time building big enougth air fields in the jungle. :) We also eventually used them on Lancaster's like 617 Sdrn to take off with a new experemental bomb that was over the normal Bomb weight for take-off. But the U.S Navy saw the potenial of these rocket pods for 2 reasons on carrier borne fighter's and they where to lift of with more heavier loads like external fuel with bombs and rockets at a much safer speed. And to allow pilot's on landing if they where waved off they could wave off at the last second and still be able to climb ( a bigger and more powerful w.e.p ). Problem is tho on U.S carrier's they suffered from smouldering timber's as your carrier decks where constructed of wooden planks. Compared to the Royal Navy Steel Decks. Thus in the game we would all probaly land up sinking the CV ourself's but be great for airial dogfight's with 262's lol.
Oh and thats another reason why they had rocket booster's was to catch the new Japanese Kamikaze rocket plane bombs :)
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I'm not seeing a problem.
The carrier won't burn down to the waterline and sink until after I'm already airborne, and SOMEBODY is going to sink it anyway. Do I get perks for sinking my own CV?
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Oh and thats another reason why they had rocket booster's was to catch the new Japanese Kamikaze rocket plane bombs :)
I'm rasing the (http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/6170/bsflag.gif) on this.
Since the acronym has "Take Off" in it, I really don't see a plane taking off with the extra drag and weight of rocket pods to save it for the new, secret, Japanese Kamikaze rocket plane that never saw service and wasn't discovered until after Japan's surrender.
Source?
wrongway
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I'm rasing the (http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/6170/bsflag.gif) on this.
Since the acronym has "Take Off" in it, I really don't see a plane taking off with the extra drag and weight of rocket pods to save it for the new, secret, Japanese Kamikaze rocket plane that never saw service and wasn't discovered until after Japan's surrender.
Source?
wrongway
He learned it in "Air Frames Engineering 101" class at his local University of DeVry annex.
ack-ack
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He learned it in "Air Frames Engineering 101" class at his local University of DeVry annex.
ack-ack
:rofl :rofl the annex even ....i'm sorry :rofl
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He learned it in "Air Frames Engineering 101" class at his local University of DeVry annex.
ack-ack
ahem ACK ACK you'r hied must be filled wi hot air just like a hotair balloon and just as big :lol The Japanesse did have a kamikaze rocket plane. it was a V1 buzz bomb adapted to take a pilot and droped from below a betty. check you'r history and P*****F and stay out of disscusion's unless you have something of use to say whitch i highly dout you ever will as i see you as a know it all punk kid who oneday will get a big kick in the Ba's and the hied from the person you have just P***ED**F :lol shame i wont be there to see that happen :lol :lol :rock :rock :cheers: :cheers: :airplane: :airplane: :airplane:
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. it was a V1 buzz bomb adapted to take a pilot
With factually wrong statements like this one, it' quite ironic when you tell others to "check their history" ;)
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ahem ACK ACK you'r hied must be filled wi hot air just like a hotair balloon and just as big :lol The Japanesse did have a kamikaze rocket plane. it was a V1 buzz bomb adapted to take a pilot and droped from below a betty. check you'r history and P*****F and stay out of disscusion's unless you have something of use to say whitch i highly dout you ever will as i see you as a know it all punk kid who oneday will get a big kick in the Ba's and the hied from the person you have just P***ED**F :lol shame i wont be there to see that happen :lol :lol :rock :rock :cheers: :cheers: :airplane: :airplane: :airplane:
My comment wasn't in reference to the Baika (by the way, none were built), my comment was in reference to the Corsair using JATO pods. The only time these were used were during some experiments in 1944 using an old F4U-1 and there are absolutely no records or pilot reports of JATO ever being used operationally outside of the few experiments I already mentioned with the F4U-1.
What was laughable about your original claim of Corsairs using JATO pods was the claim that Corsairs used them to chase down Baika bombs. :rofl
Thanks for the laughs, Mr. Air Frames Engineer.
ack-ack
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I'm rasing the (http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/6170/bsflag.gif) on this.
Since the acronym has "Take Off" in it, I really don't see a plane taking off with the extra drag and weight of rocket pods to save it for the new, secret, Japanese Kamikaze rocket plane that never saw service and wasn't discovered until after Japan's surrender.
Source?
wrongway
Agreed, except for the "secret, never saw service and we didn't know about it until after the war" bit. You're wrong on that count.
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Agreed, except for the "secret, never saw service and we didn't know about it until after the war" bit. You're wrong on that count.
We knew about them or,
My comment wasn't in reference to the Baika (by the way, none were built)
ack-ack
I didn't do my research either.
:headscratch:
:aok
wrongway
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My comment wasn't in reference to the Baika (by the way, none were built), my comment was in reference to the Corsair using JATO pods. The only time these were used were during some experiments in 1944 using an old F4U-1 and there are absolutely no records or pilot reports of JATO ever being used operationally outside of the few experiments I already mentioned with the F4U-1.
What was laughable about your original claim of Corsairs using JATO pods was the claim that Corsairs used them to chase down Baika bombs. :rofl
Thanks for the laughs, Mr. Air Frames Engineer.
ack-ack
ack-ack bullet was just on my squad channel. hes been over in scotland drinking his butt off and doesnt know what hes saying :aok literally...hes been drunk all day over there
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Iy was used and it did destroy ships. The Japanese name was actually "Ohka"
"1 April 1945: Six "Bettys" attacked the U.S. Fleet off Okinawa. At least one made a successful attack, with its Ohka hitting one of the 406 mm (16 in) turrets on West Virginia, causing moderate damage. Alpine, Achernar, and Tyrrell were also hit by kamikaze aircraft, but it is unclear whether any of these were Ohkas from the other "Bettys". None of the "Bettys" returned."
12 April 1945: Nine "Bettys" attacked the U.S. Fleet off Okinawa. Mannert L. Abele was hit, broke in two, and sank. Witnessed by LSMR-189 CO James M. Stewart. Jeffers destroyed an Ohka with AA fire 45 m (50 yd) from the ship, but the resulting explosion was still powerful enough to cause extensive damage, forcing Jeffers to withdraw. Stanly was attacked by two Ohkas. One struck just above the waterline, with the charge punching through the other side of the hull before detonating, causing little damage to the ship, and the other Ohka narrowly missed and crashed into the sea, knocking off the Stanly's ensign in the process. One Betty returned.
4 May 1945: Seven "Bettys" attacked the U.S. Fleet off Okinawa. One Ohka hit the bridge of Shea, causing extensive damage and casualties. Gayety was also damaged by a near-miss by an Ohka. One "Betty" returned.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Japanese_Ohka_rocket_plane.jpg)
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With factually wrong statements like this one, it' quite ironic when you tell others to "check their history" ;)
Ahem Gentlemen and Laddie's And Disbeliever's.
Here is proof of the Japanese Kamikaze Rocket Plane that the F4u Loaded with Rocket booster's was to catch.
(http://)
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kamikaze-ManchesterMSI_crop.jpg
Click this link to view it and be proven wrong :) :lol :lol :lol :lol :x :x :salute :salute :salute :banana: :airplane:
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With factually wrong statements like this one, it' quite ironic when you tell others to "check their history" ;)
Actually the japs with their alliance with Germany received the V! And V2 rocket plans. But the japs only saw that by redeveloping the V1 buzz bomb to a piloted plane was far better to sink U.S Ships.
In fact the Germans Where going to upgrade the V1 to take a pilot as-well but Hitler Forbid the Idea Of Manned suicide missions.
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You're confusing the Baika and the Ohka (Allied nickname: Baka Bomb) rocket powered flying bombs. The Ohka (Baka) was designed by Ensign Mitsuo Ohta and his students at the University of Tokyo and was not, repeat, not a copy of the Fieseler Fi 103R or the unmanned V-1. The Ohka was powered by 3 solid rocket powered engines and later models were designed to use thermojet engines.
The Baika's design was a directly influenced by the Fieseler Fi 103R, as it was pretty much a direct copy though with some improvements in the Japan's version and none were built by war's end.
For reference, the Ohka and Baika.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_KezhQ6waZT0/S4Z7qj30FPI/AAAAAAAAV4s/nJwWOLtWOTk/s320/invasion-japan-oka-baika.jpg)
V-1 and Fieseler Fi 103R
(http://www.ctie.monash.edu.au/hargrave/images/v1_v4_500.jpg)
For an "Air Frames Engineer", you should have already known this and a simple layman such as myself shouldn't have to to correct the 'expert'.
In fact the Germans Where going to upgrade the V1 to take a pilot as-well but Hitler Forbid the Idea Of Manned suicide missions.
Incorrect. The Baika was directly influenced by Germany's manned V-1 which was intended to be used in suicide missions. Read about Germany's "Leonidas Squadron" that was formed to fly the Fieseler Fi 103R, it was only the intervention of KG 200's commander that this unit didn't see widespread use, only 35 pilots flew the Fi 103R on suicide missions against bridges during the Battle of Berlin. Each member had to sign a declaration that said, "I hereby voluntarily apply to be enrolled in the suicide group as part of a human glider-bomb. I fully understand that employment in this capacity will entail my own death."
Here is proof of the Japanese Kamikaze Rocket Plane that the F4u Loaded with Rocket booster's was to catch.
Please post any proof of a Corsair using JATO pods other than the tests on an old F4U-1 that I mentioned? The Corsair never used JATO pods operationally, that means outside of the couple of experimental test take offs, a Corsair never had JATO rockets mounted. So, please explain how a plane could have used JATO pods when it never carried them in the first place?
ack-ack
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Please post any proof of a Corsair using JATO pods other than the tests on an old F4U-1 that I mentioned? The Corsair never used JATO pods operationally, that means outside of the couple of experimental test take offs, a Corsair never had JATO rockets mounted. So, please explain how a plane could have used JATO pods when it never carried them in the first place?
ack-ack
[/quote]
I never said that the F4u Ever used the rocket pods in actual combat but they where considered but thankfully the U.S Navy And U.S Marine's push into jap held teritorys was fast enougth to capture supply stations of the JATO. and just becouse i am an airframe's engineer doesnt mean that i get my history correct so live with it and thanks for helping :salute
( P.S i fix and service modern jet's and do know a little but not as much as my great uncle doe's about WW2 airframes
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Hey bullet, do you have a nervous twitch causing you to put multiple emoticons in your post, or do you just like to over use them?
The Ohka (cherry blossom I believe) was used in combat, the Baika wasn't. Seven US ships were damaged or sunk by Ohkas throughout the war.
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See Rule #11
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Hey bullet, do you have a nervous twitch causing you to put multiple emoticons in your post, or do you just like to over use them?
it's a common side effect of scorpion bites.
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Actually the Japanese with their alliance with Germany received the V! And V2 rocket plans. But the Japanese only saw that by redeveloping the V1 buzz bomb to a piloted plane was far better to sink U.S Ships.
In fact the Germans Where going to upgrade the V1 to take a pilot as-well but Hitler Forbid the Idea Of Manned suicide missions.
I never said that the F4u Ever used the rocket pods in actual combat but they where considered but thankfully the U.S Navy And U.S Marine's push into Japanese held teritorys was fast enougth to capture supply stations of the JATO. and just becouse i am an airframe's engineer doesnt mean that i get my history correct so live with it and thanks for helping :salute
fixed your bad habit of using derogatory slang names for the Japanese society......
in fact I am surprised you did not use the N word for where you typed Germans
what surprises me is he referenced "wikipedia" of all places..... bet he uses The History channel for references as well.....
what does not surprise me is how many people come to these forums and never read the freaking forum posting rules...... or if they do read them they do not care to follow them......
( P.S i fix and service modern jet's and do know a little but not as much as my great uncle doe's about WW2 airframes
so how long did it take you to get your A&P Licenses? how much OJT and how much college before you took the exam?
ah and what types of Engines or what types of Airframes are you checked off on? how old are you again?
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I'm not sure about JATO for the F4U. But some were outfitted with ice cream makers.
Late in the war one squadron in the Palaus found the action slow, and to stave off boredom the ground crews rigged 5 gallon cans with a wind-driven spinner connected to a mixing rotor, and hooked up one under each wing of an F4U. A pilot would take the aircraft up to high altitude for a given period of time and then come back to base with the ice cream.
May be true maybe not, I wasn't there, but it is a nice story. Probably true though.
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(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg229/WWhiskey/friendlyordinance.png)
beer keg runs!!! :noid :noid :noid :airplane:
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last emote's where typed :lol :rofl
It's WERE, WERE ,WERE, WERE!
One would think a highly educated airframes engineer such as yourself would use proper grammar, and limit himself in the emote department...
I personaly would not climb into anything designed by a man who does not have a basic grasp of his first language.
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The Wiki-article about Ohka (Cherry Blossom) is here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohka
As for the manned Fiesler, AFAIK it was for testing. Hanna Reitch (sp?) was one of the test pilots. If I recall right she asked Hitler the question about manned missions.
Here is a wee:
"in her autobiography Fliegen, Meine Liebe, Reitsch recalled other test pilots had been killed or gravely injured while trying to land the piloted version of the V1 (known as the Reichenberg), so she made test flights late in the war to learn why and found the craft's extremely high stall speed was thwarting test pilots, who had no experience landing at extremely high speeds. Reitsch's background with the very fast Me163, along with simulated landings at a safe high altitude, led her to a successful landing of the Reichenberg, but only at over 200 km/h."
Article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-1_flying_bomb
Then the merge:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-1_flying_bomb#Japanese_versions
Anyway, the Ohka was used and did sink ships. Or is Wiki just crap?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Mannert_L._Abele_%28DD-733%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Hugh_W._Hadley_%28DD-774%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Shea_%28DM-30%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Stanly_%28DD-478%29
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It's WERE, WERE ,WERE, WERE!
One would think a highly educated airframes engineer such as yourself would use proper grammar, and limit himself in the emote department...
I personaly would not climb into anything designed by a man who does not have a basic grasp of his first language.
ok i gotta admit what he's doing is going overboard but when i hear him on Mic in game he's older than me... and hes a scot. maybe he's drunk AGAIN... he's always drinking guys.
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I thought it pretty interesting that the Ohka possessed by the NASM was actually a jet rather than
a rocket.
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ok i gotta admit what he's doing is going overboard but when i hear him on Mic in game he's older than me... and hes a scot. maybe he's drunk AGAIN... he's always drinking guys.
Not allway's i never drink the night before work or the night before i have 2 drive in the morning. And i am an airframe's engineer i used to be an airframe's technition but when the Royal Airforce ( Reserve's )was up dated in 2001 the job title changed as in my line we where not replacing airframe skin's ( metal ) that where already formed and sent from the manufacturer we where making them our self's from scratch. Now my second field as when i signed up for the Royal Air Force ( reserve's ) The 2 Trades of Airframe's Technition and Mechanical Technition where now simply put they are now 1. So in A way i am now called an airframe engineer by law but by law i am aslo a mechanical technition. ( It's Wierd but thats the Labour Goverment they cost cut and all that :confused: ). So i say call me what you will. :)
OK OK OK OK IM Scottish and it was over my long weekend had some beer an whiskey may no have read some post's properly an may have misspelledan qoated but hey i was drunk for a few day's im ashamed of myself :( :( :( :( but hey we all been there and done it ooopppsss
appologie's if i angered anyone :salute all
Alcahol the :t :t Playmate :t :t
( Oh and rated for C130's Tornado's VC-10's Nimrod MrII Just not long rated on Euro fighter typhoon and soon be rated for the YF-35 )
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I'm not sure about JATO for the F4U. But some were outfitted with ice cream makers.
Late in the war one squadron in the Palaus found the action slow, and to stave off boredom the ground crews rigged 5 gallon cans with a wind-driven spinner connected to a mixing rotor, and hooked up one under each wing of an F4U. A pilot would take the aircraft up to high altitude for a given period of time and then come back to base with the ice cream.
May be true maybe not, I wasn't there, but it is a nice story. Probably true though.
True story along with the ice cream ships.
ack-ack
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Anyway, the Ohka was used and did sink ships. Or is Wiki just crap?
No, Wiki is correct in this case. The Ohka (Baka bomb) was used and did sink US ships, the Baika on the other hand never saw the light of day.
ack-ack
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Baka & Baika. There it was ;)
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And here I was getting uppity, thinking to be one, you had to know how to correctly spell "Technician".
What? There's no T in it? Blasphemy!
To think someone that can't spell his job title correctly may work on Tornado, Eurofighter or F-35 in any capacity is simply mind-numbing. But then again, we all know the truth ....
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And here I was getting uppity, thinking to be one, you had to know how to correctly spell "Technician".
What? There's no T in it? Blasphemy!
To think someone that can't spell his job title correctly may work on Tornado, Eurofighter or F-35 in any capacity is simply mind-numbing. But then again, we all know the truth ....
Ever heard of disslexia BUDDY if you havent you an idiot :mad:
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Ever heard of disslexia BUDDY if you havent you an idiot :mad:
I've heard of it. I have friends that are severely dyslexic. In fact, one of my friends was medically discharged from naval service for it. Amazing coincidence, don't you think?
My post was not meant to demean your condition. I had no knowledge of it, so if you wish to be mad, so be it. Your previous posts, well, they are quite enlightening, and completely without any factual basis whatsoever.
But, I am amazed at your ability to work on multi-million dollar aircraft with the obvious impairment you suffer from. One question....did you get statemented prior to enlisting or after?
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I've heard of it. I have friends that are severely dyslexic. In fact, one of my friends was medically discharged from naval service for it. Amazing coincidence, don't you think?
My post was not meant to demean your condition. I had no knowledge of it, so if you wish to be mad, so be it. Your previous posts, well, they are quite enlightening, and completely without any factual basis whatsoever.
But, I am amazed at your ability to work on multi-million dollar aircraft with the obvious impairment you suffer from. One question....did you get statemented prior to enlisting or after?
Two years after enlisting. Had serious head injury's from a car crash whilst moving from RAF Leuchars to RAF Lossimouth. then after some time it was noticed. And i went for some serious retraining to let me do my job whilst having dislexia. But one main problem remains i still cant put from mind to papper very well. Even this post has taken me around 5 - 10 minutes to write :(
But hey i never let it stop me :)
Oh and im set to be medically dischared in 1 year or sooner. As i have another problem i tend to swear when im angered. And swearing at an officer is not on so im told. :lol altho some deserve it but an N.C.O dont do it cos they say it bad example for the lower rank's. :)
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Hey, privats think you noncoms are a bunch of jerks, you guys think the leiutenants are jerks, and they think the generals are a bunch of bungling morons.
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Hey, privats think you noncoms are a bunch of jerks, you guys think the leiutenants are jerks, and they think the generals are a bunch of bungling morons.
:lol lol true point there lol :lol