Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: FiLtH on August 21, 2010, 12:18:37 AM
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How about ENY affecting zones rather than whole arenas. Most times it isnt the fact that there are 30 more people on the team, its that they all are at the same base.
Way it is now:
Arena: Bish 70 Knit 65 Rook 115
Base A1: Bish 0 Knit 30 Rook 65
Base A35: Bish 0 Knit 30 Rook 10
Even though the 10 rooks were willing to leave the hord and find a fight elsewhere, they are penalized with ENY,even though they face huge odds at A35.
If it were a local ENY, the knits would face an eny hit at A2 as the rooks would at A1.
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+1 I have always favored an idea like this.
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That dose make better seance to do it that way. +1
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+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000.2
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Hmmm. What would happen if one bish decided to go to A1? ENY Sky rockets for rooks and nits? Idk about this idea, it seems buggy.
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What is to stop me from upping my 5.0 ENY ride from a base slightly offset from where the horde is to avoid the high area ENY at A1? Buggy indeed.
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Local superiority is what tactics are about. ENY is about evening the sides, not trying to spread out the fight.
2nd the basic idea does not even work, because the imbalance happens after you already have the plane.
HiTech
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Local superiority is what tactics are about. ENY is about evening the sides, not trying to spread out the fight.
2nd the basic idea does not even work, because the imbalance happens after you already have the plane.
HiTech
but eny doesnt really even out the sides. I have seen many, many , many times, when knights have more people and yet we are being losing base after base. because not enough people are in the air. I really suspect that some people will switch to another country then go to sleep or whatever. I know you already said you wont kick out the sleepers, but how about not counting them as far as eny goes. you have no activity for 20 min then you wont affect eny.
semp
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but eny doesnt really even out the sides. I have seen many, many , many times, when knights have more people and yet we are being losing base after base. because not enough people are in the air. I really suspect that some people will switch to another country then go to sleep or whatever. I know you already said you wont kick out the sleepers, but how about not counting them as far as eny goes. you have no activity for 20 min then you wont affect eny.
semp
You do realize that not county the sleepers would tend to make the imbalance larger?
HiTech
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but eny doesnt really even out the sides. I have seen many, many , many times, when knights have more people and yet we are being losing base after base. because not enough people are in the air. I really suspect that some people will switch to another country then go to sleep or whatever. I know you already said you wont kick out the sleepers, but how about not counting them as far as eny goes. you have no activity for 20 min then you wont affect eny.
semp
I'd chalk it up to Knights having "more physical numbers", but those "Trying to Run the Country", are not ones who "get things done". A couple of nights ago, the Rooks lost about 5 bases and a CV parked off of our own Port, because I used common sense and drummed up like minded countrymen. We rolled heavily defended bases until A140. Then "someone" entered in the fray and kibosh-ed the works and dropped "F-bombs and cussing every other word" on range channel. So rather than start what I finished, I saved my ears.
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2nd the basic idea does not even work, because the imbalance happens after you already have the plane.
HiTech
You know though, there are a lot of pilots that take off still, even when their side has 4:1,5:1,8:1 odds at a fight? It would at least cap the endless flow of Spit16/P51D horde off with a discretionary reason to reconsider ones choice of fight. You could make the local eny requirements more lax than the global ones, but if there is an 5:1ish fight, a local eny could help improve gameplay in that quadrant to some degree.
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Local superiority is what tactics are about. ENY is about evening the sides, not trying to spread out the fight.
2nd the basic idea does not even work, because the imbalance happens after you already have the plane.
HiTech
I know the HTC Gods have spoken but I like this idea anyway.
:aok
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I have always been in favor of Zone (local) ENY.
+1
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You know though, there are a lot of pilots that take off still, even when their side has 4:1,5:1,8:1 odds at a fight? It would at least cap the endless flow of Spit16/P51D horde off with a discretionary reason to reconsider ones choice of fight. You could make the local eny requirements more lax than the global ones, but if there is an 5:1ish fight, a local eny could help improve gameplay in that quadrant to some degree.
I agree.
HTC, this is something worth investigating.
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Sorry. Disagree. You cap the launch of numbers from a field and you cap fun for a lot of people. Its bad enough you cant get into an arena and then when you do you want to cap taking off from a certain field? Do you really think that makes sense as a business plan?
Besides its the defending from the hordes trying to hoard fields that is the greatest fun. I thought you learned that already? :devil
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Hmmm. What would happen if one bish decided to go to A1? ENY Sky rockets for rooks and nits? Idk about this idea, it seems buggy.
lol i was thinking exactly that
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If that Bish flew a ways to get to A1 then his takeoff base eny would be affected but he wouldnt be there to make his count, lessening the available force at his base. Theres always ways around stuff, it would be up to the player whether it would be worth the extra effort to mess with it.
Anything that would have the affect of spreading out fights rather than the TOTAL concentration we have now would be an improvement.
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The problem is the mentality enforced by the time rule of the game (kills/time) which has knits (at least) convinced to fly the shortest distance to the nearest field and either fight or capture. The other concept you are fighting with this idea is the hordes which are all part of the game as well and brought on by the mission editor. If you get rid of missions will you get rid of hordes? No. If you cap the number of people that can launch from one field will hordes disappear? Maybe but whats going to stop them from leaving the game altogether?
Not a good plan.
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Quit? What's that? People don't quit this game.
HTC has said his piece so its moot, but I think you can agree there must be a better way to manage too many people of one side, in one area on the map than there currently is.
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I cannot think of a way to make this work. It might work in the middle of a zone, but anything on the edge of zone would be subject to having aircraft flown in from zones that aren't ENY impacted.
Unless you go so drastic as to have that P-51D <poof> into a P-51B or P-40, the Spitfire XVI <poof> into a Spitfire IX or I, Bf110G-2 <poof> into a Bf110C-4b upon entering the zone, and I don't think anybody wants that.
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Quit? What's that? People don't quit this game.
HTC has said his piece so its moot, but I think you can agree there must be a better way to manage too many people of one side, in one area on the map than there currently is.
We have never tried to manage where people play on a map. And I have still not seen any post as to why it would be a good idea to manage how many people are in one area.
HiTech
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We have never tried to manage where people play on a map. And I have still not seen any post as to why it would be a good idea to manage how many people are in one area.
HiTech
NOT to be an "overly educated rectal orifice", but isnt that what you are doing with the arena caps??
NOT
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We have never tried to manage where people play on a map. And I have still not seen any post as to why it would be a good idea to manage how many people are in one area.
HiTech
I thought my original post was clear, but what Im trying to explain ( and not in an unfriendly way) is when you have an eny penalty and you are the type of player who wants to fight against the enemy, not so much his own countrymen for kills, but goes to a different base, it would be nice not to have the penalty there when you are fighting many 51s and the like and you are limited in your plane choice.
I know, I know, holy run-on sentence Batman :)
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I cannot think of a way to make this work. It might work in the middle of a zone, but anything on the edge of zone would be subject to having aircraft flown in from zones that aren't ENY impacted
Exactly. If you want to fly a P51D to 8:1 odds, you need to take off from a base further away. The additional flight time would be the penalty. Or if you want it to be a short flight to be surrounded by green, you need to fly a P51B. The trick would be (that you briefly touched on) selecting appropriate zone boundaries for each map.
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And I have still not seen any post as to why it would be a good idea to manage how many people are in one area.
The only thing I see the local eny doing is limiting what additional aircraft can take off in that zone. Aces High is like Night of the Living Dead, everyone keeps respawning. As soon as a fight really starts to deteriorate, those players that choose to continue to respawn into this fight should have to fly a 'lesser' aircraft. Getting the formula correct for local eny would also have to be based on feel.
I know I could make a very good working and above all, fair, Local Eny formula and also zone a map for you if you want to see. If your mind is already completely made up on the notion, then I won't waste my time.
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I thought my original post was clear, but what Im trying to explain ( and not in an unfriendly way) is when you have an eny penalty and you are the type of player who wants to fight against the enemy, not so much his own countrymen for kills, but goes to a different base, it would be nice not to have the penalty there when you are fighting many 51s and the like and you are limited in your plane choice.
I know, I know, holy run-on sentence Batman :)
Ahh now I understand, you want the country balance eny to have less of an effect on you.
Thanks now I'm clear on the subject.
HiTech
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Exactly. If you want to fly a P51D to 8:1 odds, you need to take off from a base further away. The additional flight time would be the penalty. Or if you want it to be a short flight to be surrounded by green, you need to fly a P51B. The trick would be (that you briefly touched on) selecting appropriate zone boundaries for each map.
But that wouldn't be true if the base being attacked was close to the edge of the zone. In that case you could have your P-51D, without any long flight to get it, and massive numerical superiority too.
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But that wouldn't be true if the base being attacked was close to the edge of the zone. In that case you could have your P-51D, without any long flight to get it, and massive numerical superiority too.
If the zones rolled with the front line bases, and only applied to the front line bases, this would not be an issue.
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If the zones rolled with the front line bases, and only applied to the front line bases, this would not be an issue.
Doing it that way just defeats the whole point and you may as well stick with global ENY restrictions. If the entire front is counted then the numerically dominant side still gets dinged no matter if they are attacking/defending a place where the numerically inferior side has local numerical superiority. The moment you switch to tighter zones to deal with that you reintroduce the possibility of bringing in a P-51D from a base right outside the zone to attack or defend a base right inside the zone.
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Doing it that way just defeats the whole point and you may as well stick with global ENY restrictions. If the entire front is counted then the numerically dominant side still gets dinged no matter if they are attacking/defending a place where the numerically inferior side has local numerical superiority. The moment you switch to tighter zones to deal with that you reintroduce the possibility of bringing in a P-51D from a base right outside the zone to attack or defend a base right inside the zone.
You wouldn't sum up the entire fronts. You would split up the front bases. The fronts on most maps aren't uniform, it wouldn't be that difficult to do. if country A base distance country B base < 40 miles, draw zone around it. If there were other bases within that range too you could circumscribe a zone circle (radius based on edge distance from furthest base in circle to edge of circle) around the adjecent bases perimeter and set that as a zone. Number the Zone, set it at a refresh rate every 1-2 minutes to check the balance. If the conditions change, i.e. base is captured, delete Zone, redraw it based on new conditions.
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Ahh now I understand, you want the country balance eny to have less of an effect on you.
Thanks now I'm clear on the subject.
HiTech
I don't think there's any need for the attitude, I'm simply making a suggestion that would improve the game from my viewpoint. It's not like I'm some smart mouth kid, I've been a long time customer of your game who has only wanted it to continue successfully.
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<S> all!
I think the idea of local vs Global is a great Idea if possible to implement, and maybe have a larger radius than just the immediate local fight--- maybe this could help alleviate the issue I am bringing up below:
ENY is consistently a problem for our squad. The issue comes down to Arena Caps and ENY combined. On a busy night, and depending on which pilots/countries are joining at which time, ENY gets locked in because of the cap.
For example: Orange becomes capped (we'll say with an ENY issue for Bish), and unfortunately, since no Rooks or Knights can join Orange to help balance it out... they join Blue. But lets say Blue is already having an ENY issue for Rooks, and then it continues to be a problem with those additional Rook/Knit Pilots joining, because the numbers can never balance (from an ENY perspective) until there is a large or outflow of pilots (like the end of the night) from either arena to increase/decrease the caps.
Hopefully I'm making sense :) and welcome any comments! :salute
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<S> all!
I think the idea of local vs Global is a great Idea if possible to implement, and maybe have a larger radius than just the immediate local fight--- maybe this could help alleviate the issue I am bringing up below:
ENY is consistently a problem for our squad. The issue comes down to Arena Caps and ENY combined. On a busy night, and depending on which pilots/countries are joining at which time, ENY gets locked in because of the cap.
For example: Orange becomes capped (we'll say with an ENY issue for Bish), and unfortunately, since no Rooks or Knights can join Orange to help balance it out... they join Blue. But lets say Blue is already having an ENY issue for Rooks, and then it continues to be a problem with those additional Rook/Knit Pilots joining, because the numbers can never balance (from an ENY perspective) until there is a large or outflow of pilots (like the end of the night) from either arena to increase/decrease the caps.
Hopefully I'm making sense :) and welcome any comments! :salute
The ENY penalty is in place to promote the switching of countries to even things out. If you are so dedicated to a single chess piece that you refuse to switch, then you lose the right to whine about how ridiculously low the ENY is.
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The ENY penalty is in place to promote the switching of countries to even things out. If you are so dedicated to a single chess piece that you refuse to switch, then you lose the right to whine about how ridiculously low the ENY is.
I'm not sure how accurate that is... I don't believe any squad in the game should be forced to bounce back and forth to different countries depending on the night.
Why does everyone in the forums have such a hostile tone all the time? :confused:
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Why does everyone in the forums have such a hostile tone all the time? :confused:
because of the fact, no one can reach through the screen knock out there teeth :aok
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I'm not sure how accurate that is... I don't believe any squad in the game should be forced to bounce back and forth to different countries depending on the night.
Why does everyone in the forums have such a hostile tone all the time? :confused:
Mostly it is to get your message through to stubborn people the only way possible, with hostility. Eventually, it just becomes a habit, I suppose. My apologies.
I believe that's exactly why it is there..it does not force you to switch, just offers you an incentive if you do choose to switch..for example, Das Muppets switch on a nightly basis. (Not criticising here, I'm about 1 "25 knit horde v 2 cons" sortie away from doing the same myself)
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because of the fact, no one can reach through the screen knock out there teeth :aok
:rofl
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I'm not sure how accurate that is... I don't believe any squad in the game should be forced to bounce back and forth to different countries depending on the night.
Why does everyone in the forums have such a hostile tone all the time? :confused:
The best solution for you guys is to either switch arenas or hop in 51B's :)