Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: beau32 on November 30, 2010, 12:10:42 PM
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Looks like we are getting some new German Iron. :rock
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/images/stories/news/panther-tank-1.jpg)
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Looks really nice. Some great work there. Not a Beaufighter though! :)
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PERK IT!!!
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Woohoo!! I'm excited
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DROOOOOOOLLLLL..... but its not
an M-18 :noid
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Very nice.
Definitely a perk tank though.
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You can't perk that, it's too pretty!
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how does this compare to tanks already in game?
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how does this compare to tanks already in game?
the panther had the frontal armor comparison to a tiger while the rest of the armor was weaker. almost like a panzer IVs but a little stronger. has a 75mm gun but iirc it is a better 75mm than the pnzrIV but i might be wrong with that. normal speed, irl it had a fragile transmission but it was the first tank to be able to rotate on its axis and the only GV in WWII able to do this. it also had a poor suspension but again this wouldnt be in the game just like the bad transmission wouldnt be. (i wonder if HTC is mapping the rotation on its axis into the game?) :headscratch: all in all its a great tank for the game. great gun, great armor, good speed. definitely perk worthy.
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how does this compare to tanks already in game?
It will die to a well placed 1000lbs bomb like any other tank :)
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if you compare it with a tiger , its much faster, is a smaller target, hits comparable with the tiger up to 2km.
I has good angled armor in front, but can easy be destroyed with a sideshot.
Now Im waiting for the stalin tank IS2 to be made :P
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Don't recall armor specs but that 76mm gun should be lethal, higher muzzle velocity than the Tiger's 88mm.
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Don't recall armor specs but that 76mm gun should be lethal, higher muzzle velocity than the Tiger's 88mm.
75mm :aok iirc
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how does this compare to tanks already in game?
For Aces High purposes, it's merely a Tiger that's a bit faster. While it doesn't sport the 88 the Tiger has, it -does- have
a very high velocity 75mm. Your standard M4s and PzIV tankers will be screeching just as loudly as they do
now when they see a Tiger as they will with this one.
IMHO it's like adding another jet to the game; what's the point, really?
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Don't recall armor specs but that 76mm gun should be lethal, higher muzzle velocity than the Tiger's 88mm.
It's about the same league as the 17lbs on the Firefly
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75mm :aok iirc
Whoops... you're right.
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well, I cannot deny th GV folks their game. . .
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IMHO it's like adding another jet to the game; what's the point, really?
What other jet not in AH yet was that famous, part of almost every major battle in Europe from 1943 onward, and had almost 6000 built during the war?
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Now Im waiting for the stalin tank IS2 to be made :P
Yea, we need now the IS-2 and, ISU-122 and some SU- like the 85/100 :rock
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It will die to a well placed 1000lbs bomb like any other tank :)
As I can't see a pintle gun, probably even easier :D
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Yea, we need now the IS-2 and, ISU-122 and some SU- like the 85/100 :rock
if added the IS-2 would out shine anything in the game, its only limitations would be almost no ammo, and glacialy slow reload times, a better answer to the panther would be the SU-100
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Panther looks good. :aok
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Dang might resubscribe .... :airplane:
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:banana: :banana:
:x
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Great Add Hitech! :aok
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More Iron :x but will shrubs still tip them over or branches stop them at full speed :D :bolt:
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Great model of the coolest looking tank of WWII. WTG Superfly and Greebo!
Hopefully some fighters will follow.
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BAR i think they are secretly bringing in the M18 to go againest the panther and the tiger
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Just another whipping toy for the M4's to blow up along with the Tiger & Firefly & T-34/85. Glad to see it though one less thing off the wish list forums.
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:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok
I LOVE XMAS EARLY!!!!!!!!!!!!
TY HITECH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I wonder how it handles at 5k.
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I wonder how it handles at 5k.
We'll have to take her out for a mountain climb.
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i dont know but when i am 800 yards from a tiger i hope it actually does damage after 3 hits!
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We have more perk tanks than we have unperked tanks.
Not real excited about this one......
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The Panther, even with it's mechanical problem may have been the best tank of the war. It had good armor a fast rate of fire a faster turret than a Tiger and good road speed and a great gun. (about like a 17 pounder) I am happy to see it is coming to the game. WTG HTC.
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I've got wood.
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I've got wood.
Now you can build a coffee table for a knat's house :P
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the panther had the frontal armor comparison to a tiger while the rest of the armor was weaker. almost like a panzer IVs but a little stronger. has a 75mm gun but iirc it is a better 75mm than the pnzrIV but i might be wrong with that. normal speed, irl it had a fragile transmission but it was the first tank to be able to rotate on its axis and the only GV in WWII able to do this. it also had a poor suspension but again this wouldnt be in the game just like the bad transmission wouldnt be. (i wonder if HTC is mapping the rotation on its axis into the game?) :headscratch: all in all its a great tank for the game. great gun, great armor, good speed. definitely perk worthy.
lol
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lol
Serious question here because I don't know. What other tanks could?
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In terms of AH, think of the Panther as being almost indistinguishable to both the Firefly and Tiger for AP performance. The armor of the Panther will be very similar to the Tiger and far superior to the Firefly, at least in the front. It *should* have more speed, I've seen speeds of 29mph to 35 mph listed vs 25 mph for both the Tiger and Firefly. Reload times, if HTC goes "by the book" as they seem to do in this category, should be right at 6 seconds.
The gun of the Panther tank is the 75mm Kw.K.42 L / 70. The gun of the Panzer Mk IV is the 75mm KwK.40 L / 48. The projectiles are the exact same thing (PzGr.39 @ 6.8kg and 7.5cm), but the case of the KwK.42 cartridge is a bit bigger than the case of KwK.40 cartridge thereby holding more propellant and producing 200m per seconds more velocity (740m/s vs 940m/s).
The Panther (vs the Pzr IV) will be able to penetrate 30mm more armor at 1000m, 27mm more at 1500m, and 26mm more at 2000m.
Anyone want to bet this thing is perked MORE than the Firefly and only slightly less than a Tiger? I'll wager 5pts LESS than the Tiger. You heard it here, first. :D
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Fortunately, we don't require perks in Scenarios. :aok
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Fortunately, we don't require perks in Scenarios. :aok
Amen to that!!! :aok
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This is cool! the more GV's the better.
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Just try to stop me now :D ;)
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Preface....... I am a default skin only guy, who likes Tigers.................
New German Armor with something other than a Desert Paint Job..... ?
YEAH BABY!!!
(http://www.solarnavigator.net/films_movies_actors/film_images/Austin_Danger_Powers_Mike_Myers.jpg)
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New Dive bombing target! :aok
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Alright, how many perks is it gonna be? 50ish?
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UBER! :aok
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:banana: nuff said.
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New German Armor with something other than a Desert Paint Job..... ?
The yellow/mustard paint is not a desert color. It was the standard base color.
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was looking at the front page then just screamed YES!!!! and my ma turned around like wtf is wrong with u
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was looking at the front page then just screamed YES!!!! and my ma turned around like wtf is wrong with u
I know right, I had the same reaction. Luckily only the grumpy old cat was in the house, so I could care less :devil
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New German Armor with something other than a Desert Paint Job..... ?
Panthers were delivered in plain dark yellow from the factory up until late 1944. This was standard camo for German armour in the 43-44 timeframe. The army depots or front line units camouflaged the vehicles with green and red brown paint as needed. From Sept 44 the tanks were camouflaged in the factory. Three colour camo schemes were applied direct to the primer to save paint and unseen areas were just left in primer. In 1945 the official scheme changed again, Panthers were supposed be painted base green with the other two camo colours applied above. However in reality all sorts of schemes were used as paint supplies dwindled.
The default Panther is from Kampfgruppe Peiper and was knocked out in an ambush near Stoumont in the Battle of the Bulge. It has a late 1944 MAN factory three colour camo scheme applied onto primer. I picked this scheme because it has more green in it than an earlier Panther and so would blend in with the MA terrain better.
I've done several skins for the Panther with earlier schemes and zimmerit paste applied, I'll post screenshots in the skins forum once the new version is out.
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Panthers were delivered in plain dark yellow from the factory up until late 1944. This was standard camo for German armour in the 43-44 timeframe. The army depots or front line units camouflaged the vehicles with green and red brown paint as needed. From Sept 44 the tanks were camouflaged in the factory. Three colour camo schemes were applied direct to the primer to save paint and unseen areas were just left in primer. In 1945 the official scheme changed again, Panthers were supposed be painted base green with the other two camo colours applied above. However in reality all sorts of schemes were used as paint supplies dwindled.
The default Panther is from Kampfgruppe Peiper and was knocked out in an ambush near Stoumont in the Battle of the Bulge. It has a late 1944 MAN factory three colour camo scheme applied onto primer. I picked this scheme because it has more green in it than an earlier Panther and so would blend in with the MA terrain better.
I've done several skins for the Panther with earlier schemes and zimmerit paste applied, I'll post screenshots in the skins forum once the new version is out.
Thanks for all the hard work greebo!!!! :aok :salute
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Best addition to Aces high..well ever.
Even the plane dweeb flyers guys can appreciate this one.
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WTG :aok
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hmmmmm....... this may interest me enough to get me back in the game. Plus the addition of the b29.
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WooHoo! Darn, I wet myslef... :rofl :salute
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Dang might resubscribe .... :airplane:
Im seriously thinking about that too.
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What is the armor thickness on top of the engine compartment?
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What is the armor thickness on top of the engine compartment?
http://www.tarrif.net/
The above link has a lot of good info.
btw... ;)
Hull Front (Upper) : 51mm @ 34°
Hull Front (Lower) : 51mm @ 34° - 90°
Hull Sides (Upper) : 38mm @ 90°
Hull Sides (Lower) : 38mm @ 90°
Hull Rear : 38mm @ 68° - 80°
Hull Top : 19mm @ 0° - 7°
Hull Bottom : 13mm - 25mm @ 0°
Turret Front : 76mm @ 60°
Turret Mantlet : 89mm @ 90°
Turret Sides : 51mm @ 85°
Turret Rear : 51mm @ 90°
Turret Top : 25mm @ 0°
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(http://photos.imageevent.com/dwr49/gifs/orson%20clapping.gif)
Panthers were delivered in plain dark yellow from the factory up until late 1944. This was standard camo for German armour in the 43-44 timeframe. The army depots or front line units camouflaged the vehicles with green and red brown paint as needed. From Sept 44 the tanks were camouflaged in the factory. Three colour camo schemes were applied direct to the primer to save paint and unseen areas were just left in primer. In 1945 the official scheme changed again, Panthers were supposed be painted base green with the other two camo colours applied above. However in reality all sorts of schemes were used as paint supplies dwindled.
The default Panther is from Kampfgruppe Peiper and was knocked out in an ambush near Stoumont in the Battle of the Bulge. It has a late 1944 MAN factory three colour camo scheme applied onto primer. I picked this scheme because it has more green in it than an earlier Panther and so would blend in with the MA terrain better.
I've done several skins for the Panther with earlier schemes and zimmerit paste applied, I'll post screenshots in the skins forum once the new version is out.
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lol
someone needs to read up on tanking :aok the panther was the only one that could use its transmission in emergencies in WWII to allow one track to go reverse while the other goes fowards...
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someone needs to read up on tanking :aok the panther was the only one that could use its transmission in emergencies in WWII to allow one track to go reverse while the other goes fowards...
Are you sure? I think the M-26 Pershing had that same ability as well as a couple of other tanks.
ack-ack
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Finally the Panther!! :x :t
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I wonder what the ammo loadout will be.
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The top of the hull over the engine compartment looks like it will rip open quite nicely. It is a big area, non sloped with the same armor thickness as the Sherman.
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someone needs to read up on tanking :aok the panther was the only one that could use its transmission in emergencies in WWII to allow one track to go reverse while the other goes fowards...
Tiger could.
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Its gonna be fun to play around in, and most of all to drop bombs on.
If it comes out before before the new year then that would make 3 new tanks added in 2010. And once again HTC thanks for the M4's. :rock
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://www.craftyspot.co.uk/images/PantherTankColor.jpg)
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://www.craftyspot.co.uk/images/PantherTankColor.jpg)
NOW THAT PIC IS HAWT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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it was actually an MG-34, you can tell by the round barrel, MG-42 has a square heatshield around it
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Yaaaaaaaaaa
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Nice addition. And my P-47D-25 is getting frisky to kill it.
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"the panther had the frontal armor comparison to a tiger while the rest of the armor was weaker"
That wont change the ch200 cries when its taken out from side hits. Just watch. Its a Panther, ergo it should be invulnerable to anti-tank fire, HTC please "fix it". :rolleyes:
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://www.craftyspot.co.uk/images/PantherTankColor.jpg)
From Jentz 1995, pp. 56–57
The Ausf A model introduced a new cast armor commander's cupola, replacing the more difficult to manufacture forged cupola. It featured a steel hoop to which a third MG 34 or either the coaxial or the bow machine gun could be mounted for use in the anti-aircraft role, though it was rare for this to be used in actual combat situations.
I dont think it was standard issue. I'd like to think that HTC would go ahead and add one in, but we wont find out until the game is updated.
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will there be new keys for on the spot left/right turns
nice ride thanks htc see you again soon
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Panther is going to be beautiful. She is a gorgrous design inspired by the T34. The one tank that screams for addition now is the M26 :rock
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<General Patton> - ack-ack your tank killing methods are unorthodox as h&ll soldier!!
<ack-ack> - Thank you Sir! The only thing I could find big enough to drop on the Panther with my 38 was your M4 Sir!
<General Patton> - And how many Panthers are there between here and Berlin??
<ack-ack> - Don't worry Sir! You have enough M4's for me to find out...hehehehehehehehee.
<Forward Air Controler> - Red Dog Poppa to command. You won't beleive this. There's some crazy fly-fly boy droppin M4's on german tanks out here with a P38!!!! :confused:
<Coommand> - Red you in the hooch again?? :furious
<Forward Air Controler> - Dangit No! I ran outta hooch two towns back. :furious
<Command> - (Loud commanding yelling in the background) :furious Disregard what you are seeing. We are sending you more hooch with fuel and 20 M4's for the fly-fly boy. General Pattons complements. :angel:
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I wonder what the ammo loadout will be.
Depending on the source, I've read it carries 79-82 rounds for the main gun and 4200 rounds for the 7.92mm machine guns.
The main gun ammo can consist of regular AP, tungsten cored AP and HE rounds.
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Play WoT :noid
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From Jentz 1995, pp. 56–57
The Ausf A model introduced a new cast armor commander's cupola, replacing the more difficult to manufacture forged cupola. It featured a steel hoop to which a third MG 34 or either the coaxial or the bow machine gun could be mounted for use in the anti-aircraft role, though it was rare for this to be used in actual combat situations.
Looking at the line drawings of virtually all Ausf. G production batches of different manufacturers it looks like most of the production batches had the gun.
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I need to start stocking up on perks :joystick:
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://warphotos.basnetworks.net/photos/galleries/World_War_Two/Tanks/german_panther_tank.jpg)
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://lh4.ggpht.com/_e0cyaOd1zQM/SjlJ0sz8gkI/AAAAAAAADuA/07gb3wgcMuc/IMG_1169.JPG)
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hey! i was at that museum!
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(http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee82/penguinsknees/CIMG8101.jpg)
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(http://img164.imageshack.us/img164/6568/dibujo2ce2.jpg)
one 7.92mm MG34 coaxially to gun, one 7.92mm MG34 in front hull (traverse 5°left to 5°right, elevation -10° to +15°), one 7.92mm MG34 on commander's cupola, together 5,100 rounds
with the panther we can also add this!
(http://ww2total.com/worldwar2/weapons-WW2/artillery/self-propelled-guns/axis/germany/Panther_Coelian/images/Panther-37mm-AA.jpg)
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Panthers were delivered in plain dark yellow from the factory up until late 1944. This was standard camo for German armour in the 43-44 timeframe. The army depots or front line units camouflaged the vehicles with green and red brown paint as needed. From Sept 44 the tanks were camouflaged in the factory. Three colour camo schemes were applied direct to the primer to save paint and unseen areas were just left in primer. In 1945 the official scheme changed again, Panthers were supposed be painted base green with the other two camo colours applied above. However in reality all sorts of schemes were used as paint supplies dwindled.
The default Panther is from Kampfgruppe Peiper and was knocked out in an ambush near Stoumont in the Battle of the Bulge. It has a late 1944 MAN factory three colour camo scheme applied onto primer. I picked this scheme because it has more green in it than an earlier Panther and so would blend in with the MA terrain better.
I've done several skins for the Panther with earlier schemes and zimmerit paste applied, I'll post screenshots in the skins forum once the new version is out.
You know things have taken a turn when you're changing the paint schemes from matching foureign lands to matching the local terrain. I heard they ran from the factory screaming when directive came down to pain them "Factory Brick Red"
Great job Greebo, it looks fantastic. :salute
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Tiger could.
tiger came out before the panther and it didnt have the same transmission as the panther. the tiger's transmission wouldnt allow for separate track movement. and ackack i actually looked at the M26, nothing that i read up on said anything about separating tracks to allow for this with the transmission. the only tank i have been able to find information on this is the panther. and i know for a fact that the tiger did not do this.
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It's funny. I knew nothing about tanks until I played WoT, now I'm as educated about them as I am airplanes and I realize that I need to stay outta this thread so you tank knowledge noobies can have fun :D
perdweeb
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It's funny. I knew nothing about tanks until I played WoT, now I'm as educated about them as I am airplanes and I realize that I need to stay outta this thread so you tank knowledge noobies can have fun :D
perdweeb
World of Tanks... the worst game on the web taught you everything about them? :rofl and in CoH every tracked vehicle needs 7 shots to kill them and they all can turn on a dime... hmm thats right too!!!
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Panther needs an MG42 machine gun for AA defense on that ring around the commanders cupola. That's why that ring is there.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4d/Bundesarchiv_Bild_101I-301-1954-06,_Nordfrankreich,_Panzer_V_(Panther)_in_Ortschaft.jpg)
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World of Tanks... the worst game on the web taught you everything about them? :rofl and in CoH every tracked vehicle needs 7 shots to kill them and they all can turn on a dime... hmm thats right too!!!
Worst game on the web? You probably just suck at it.
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tiger came out before the panther and it didnt have the same transmission as the panther. the tiger's transmission wouldnt allow for separate track movement. and ackack i actually looked at the M26, nothing that i read up on said anything about separating tracks to allow for this with the transmission. the only tank i have been able to find information on this is the panther. and i know for a fact that the tiger did not do this.
Been studying this stuff 35 years.
Watch the tiger do it's thing at 2:57
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWKfpOtFtBc
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tiger came out before the panther and it didnt have the same transmission as the panther. the tiger's transmission wouldnt allow for separate track movement. and ackack i actually looked at the M26, nothing that i read up on said anything about separating tracks to allow for this with the transmission. the only tank i have been able to find information on this is the panther. and i know for a fact that the tiger did not do this.
Sure, the Pershing didn't have the same transmission as the Panther but it was able to pivot on it's tracks like both the Panther and the Tiger. I also seem to recall some of the Soviet tanks also being able to pivot on their tracks.
ack-ack
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I'm just wondering, did any of the tanks in game have the ability to pivot in place?
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Been studying this stuff 35 years.
Watch the tiger do it's thing at 2:57
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWKfpOtFtBc
Well i think that pretty much seals it. While very hard (and possibly damaging) on the tracks the Tiger could pivot on it place by moving the tracks in opposite directions.
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Well i think that pretty much seals it. While very hard (and possibly damaging) on the tracks the Tiger could pivot on it place by moving the tracks in opposite directions.
first time ive ever seen a tiger pull it off and all the info i found on tigers never said they could... never saw the M26 also. i concede then <S>
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A PANTHER!!!!!!! :x :x :x
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first time ive ever seen a tiger pull it off and all the info i found on tigers never said they could... never saw the M26 also. i concede then <S>
i think the thing is they could do it but they wasn't made to do it. where the other tanks tracks where made to pivot by design
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I'm just wondering, did any of the tanks in game have the ability to pivot in place?
WoT? Yes they do.
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http://www.tarrif.net/
The above link has a lot of good info.
btw... ;)
Hull Front (Upper) : 51mm @ 34°
Hull Front (Lower) : 51mm @ 34° - 90°
Hull Sides (Upper) : 38mm @ 90°
Hull Sides (Lower) : 38mm @ 90°
Hull Rear : 38mm @ 68° - 80°
Hull Top : 19mm @ 0° - 7°
Hull Bottom : 13mm - 25mm @ 0°
Turret Front : 76mm @ 60°
Turret Mantlet : 89mm @ 90°
Turret Sides : 51mm @ 85°
Turret Rear : 51mm @ 90°
Turret Top : 25mm @ 0°
What tank is that? Sherman? It sure aint a Panther G.
Panther G armor:
Lower hull Front: 60mm@35° Side: 40mm@90° Rear: 40mm@60° Bottom:16-30mm@0°
Upper hull Front: 80mm@35° Side: 50mm@60° Top: 40&16mm@0°
Turret Front: 110mm@79° Side: 45mm@65° Rear: 45mm@65° Top: 16mm@0-6°
Gun mantlet: 100mm@round
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WoT? Yes they do.
he meant AH i think
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tiger came out before the panther and it didnt have the same transmission as the panther. the tiger's transmission wouldnt allow for separate track movement. and ackack i actually looked at the M26, nothing that i read up on said anything about separating tracks to allow for this with the transmission. the only tank i have been able to find information on this is the panther. and i know for a fact that the tiger did not do this.
Didn't the King Tiger have this ability?
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Didn't the King Tiger have this ability?
The Tiger I seems to have had the capability. As I understand it, the Tiger II used the exact same drive system as the Tiger I, so it would have it too.
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The Tiger I seems to have had the capability. As I understand it, the Tiger II used the exact same drive system as the Tiger I, so it would have it too.
since the tiger one was as heavy as it was and probably was not to good at doing it without removing its tracks I would imagine the T2 would be more likely to tear stuff up and less likely to be recommended as such to do so!
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OK a simple understanding of what you are seeing in that video.
the slight optical illusion of the tread spinning is what leads people to believe that the tread is actually turning of its own volition.
the (from facing) left tread is turning the right tread is not, except for some torsional rotation and brake slipping caused by the strain. this separate braking allows for almost all tracked (or independently driven axles) vehicles to turn in place. the difference with the Panther is that its transmission was the first designed to allow both tracks to truly turn in independent directions of each other allowing the tank to spin in place without digging up the ground and breaking the tracks.
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OK a simple understanding of what you are seeing in that video.
the slight optical illusion of the tread spinning is what leads people to believe that the tread is actually turning of its own volition.
the (from facing) left tread is turning the right tread is not, except for some torsional rotation and brake slipping caused by the strain. this separate braking allows for almost all tracked (or independently driven axles) vehicles to turn in place. the difference with the Panther is that its transmission was the first designed to allow both tracks to truly turn in independent directions of each other allowing the tank to spin in place without digging up the ground and breaking the tracks.
GEARBOX
The Maybach-Olvar gearbox provides eight forward speeds and four reverse speeds with pre-selective hydraulic engagement. The gears are arranged on a main shaft, lay shaft and reverse lay shaft, although, in fact, both main shaft and lay shafts consist of four short lengths of shaft each carrying a gear and each able to be engaged or disengaged by a dog clutch. The rearmost dog clutches on both main shaft and lay shafts are controlled by selection forks mounted on a common shaft in such a manner that when one dog is engaged, the other is free. The movement of these selector forks is controlled by a double acting hydraulic cylinder mounted on the top of the gearbox. Likewise the central pair are operated by another cylinder. The remaining dog clutch on the lay shaft is operated by a third cylinder, but has engagement with a different gear at each end of its travel (i.e. no free position). The remaining dog clutch on the main shaft and the dog clutch on the reverse are operated together by a hand lever, so that in the forward position of the hand lever the dog on the main shaft is engaged and that of the reverse shaft free, with the exact opposite for the rear position of the hand lever, whilst in the intermediate position of the hand lever both dogs are free. Thus for forward drive, once the hand lever has been placed in the forward position, all changes of gear are effected through the operation of the hydraulic cylinder. The movement of the gear change lever through its quadrant causes the rotation of a valve which determines the distribution of oil pressure to the appropriate hydraulic cylinder for the ratio required. Side pressure on the gear change lever then admits pressure to that cylinder and effects the gear change. In reverse the procedure is similar but only the four lowest ratios are available. With the exception of the final output gear and the main shaft and reverse shaft meshing with it, all gears are single helical. An extension of the final output shaft carries a spiral bevel for the main drive, whilst an extension of the main shaft carries a small straight bevel for controlling the speed of the steering differentials. At the input end of the main shaft is a multi-disc centrifugal clutch which can, however, be disengaged by the admission of hydraulic pressure to a cylinder, the piston of which operates a withdrawal fork.
The same withdrawal fork is operated by the clutch pedal. A small cone clutch on the input side of the main shaft and the rear end of the lay shaft are geared together and operated by hydraulic pressure giving synchronization of the lay shaft with the engine speed. The input shaft also drives, through two gears, a fore and aft shaft on which are mounted two oil pumps, which provide the pressure necessary for hydraulic operation. Another unit driven from this shaft is the engine rev counter. Hydraulically operated brake shoes are provided for the slowing of the main clutch and the second gear from the input end on the main shaft, and a hydraulic device adjusts the throttle opening as required. An easily accessible oil filter is provided which serves both gearbox and steering unit which have a common oil level; the level is checked by a dip-stick on the gearbox and replenished through a filler cap. The oil capacity is 32 litres (7 gallons).
STEERING UNIT
Steering is effected by imposing different speeds on to the sun wheel of an epicyclic, whose annulus is positively driven by a bevel meshing with the main gearbox output bevel, and whose planet carrier carries the output flange to the final drive. There is one of these epicyclics at each end of the bevel shaft meshing with the gearbox output bevel.
The direction and speed rotation of the sun wheel and the choice of left or right hand sides are governed by the engagement of two or four hydraulically operated multi-disc clutches. These clutches connect the sun wheels through a lay shaft meshing with the small bevel on the extension of the gearbox input shaft. In this way a choice of two speeds both proportional to engine speed, is imposed at will upon the sun wheel of the epicyclic whose annulus is already rotating at a multiple of engine speed according to the gear engaged. In addition, in neutral with no output from the main gearbox bevel, a drive is still obtained from the bevel on the extension of the gearbox input shaft, and this produces with the engagement of the appropriate steering clutch opposing rotations of left and right sun wheels. As the annuli are unable to rotate in opposite directions owing to their being secured to the same shaft this opposite rotation of the sun wheel, of necessity, produces opposite rotation of the output flanges, resulting in a neutral turn. For one full revolution of both output flanges the gearbox input flange performs 117 revs.
Oil pressure from a pump driven by an extension of the fore and aft gearbox shaft is admitted to the required steering clutches through ports in the steering assembly casing, the opening of which is controlled by a piston valve. Movement of piston valve is governed by the driver's steering wheel. In this way two distinct radii of turn are available for each gear engaged, and identical for left and right turns. A mushroom shaped knob on the gearbox casing operates hydraulically a brake on one section of the main shaft, thereby eliminating clutch drag and making the neutral turn more positive.
The tank can also be steered when required by steering levers on each side of the driver which operate the right and left brake assemblies.
Even though its powertrain systems might not have been the most reliable, when they worked the Tiger was quite mobile for its size and weight. It could pivot in place, completely turning around in a distance of 3.44 meters (11.28ft).
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tiger came out before the panther and it didnt have the same transmission as the panther. the tiger's transmission wouldnt allow for separate track movement. and ackack i actually looked at the M26, nothing that i read up on said anything about separating tracks to allow for this with the transmission. the only tank i have been able to find information on this is the panther. and i know for a fact that the tiger did not do this.
your saying that tank destroyers couldn't rotate on their axis that is bullcrap.
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:lol been holding my tongue about this since the convention. Actually as far as frontal protection the panther tends to be a slightly better then the Tiger 1, mostly due to the armors slope.
Panther G Tiger 1
Turret F. 110/11deg. 100/8deg.
hull front 80/55deg.(upper) 100/24deg
60/55deg.(lower)
gun mantlet 100 (curved) 100-110/0deg.
As far as gun comparison's between the 75mm L-70 and the 88m L-56
If both are firing standard AP rounds Pzgr39
muzzle velocity Penetration of Homogeneous Armor plate at 30 deg. from verticle (mm)
100m 500m 1000m 1500m 2000m
KwK42 L-70 925 m/s 138 124 111 99 89
KwK36 L-56 773 m/s 120 110 100 91 84
As you can see the guns are very comparable. The panthers gun was considered one of the best in the war.
I haven't seen the penetration factors or the 17pounder british gun, but if someone could please post would love to compare.
Supposedly this was going to be a late G model that we are getting with the chinned mantlet (no shot trap)
can't wait :D
:salute
BigRat
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I received leaked information that the Panther was in the works a while ago...didn't think it would be coming so soon sweetennnesss
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OK a simple understanding of what you are seeing in that video.
the slight optical illusion of the tread spinning is what leads people to believe that the tread is actually turning of its own volition.
the (from facing) left tread is turning the right tread is not, except for some torsional rotation and brake slipping caused by the strain. this separate braking allows for almost all tracked (or independently driven axles) vehicles to turn in place. the difference with the Panther is that its transmission was the first designed to allow both tracks to truly turn in independent directions of each other allowing the tank to spin in place without digging up the ground and breaking the tracks.
I watched it 4 times thinking the same as you,,, but it does have reverse power to it,,, it has too,,, if it did not,, the only way it could be forced not to move would be with the brake,, and that would not allow it to move forward or backward, unless released, and then it would almost always move forward, since that is the way the tank is trying to move and almost all of the pressure would be applied to that direction!
I know its not simple to understand, but unless gravity was trying to pull it backwards,,, it would only be inclined to move in the direction the tank was already traveling, maybe myth busters will do a special!
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This game needs Jap tanks. They may have been crap but the deserve a spot in the line up. Afterall, we do have Spitfires in the game :devil :bolt:
carry on gentlemen :banana:
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And this is why the Betty has been delayed. It's a package deal. :x Now, the next question is....when will it be released? I definitely won't be 2 weeks. My call is early January. :lol
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Heres a great combat film of the Panther in Action in Cologne
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jt5bJQOkI1g
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BAM!!!
Even though its powertrain systems might not have been the most reliable, when they worked the Tiger was quite mobile for its size and weight. It could pivot in place, completely turning around in a distance of 3.44 meters
the tiger could pivot in place but could not rotate on axis. in fact nothing in that quote by 2bighorn says it will :aok
And no. tank destroyers in WWII could not rotate on axis curry... IIRC the M26 did not have this also (but i have yet to see M26 transmission specs so i may be wrong on this). the panther was a newly developed transmission for its time and was extremely fragile BUT could rotate the panther on its axis but this was avoided due to the fragility of the transmission... Russian tanks in WWII could not achieve this either nor any (if not all) british and american armor.
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I watched it 4 times thinking the same as you,,, but it does have reverse power to it,,, it has too,,, if it did not,, the only way it could be forced not to move would be with the brake,, and that would not allow it to move forward or backward, unless released, and then it would almost always move forward, since that is the way the tank is trying to move and almost all of the pressure would be applied to that direction!
I know its not simple to understand, but unless gravity was trying to pull it backwards,,, it would only be inclined to move in the direction the tank was already traveling, maybe myth busters will do a special!
read bighorn's statement. the reason you are seeing its reversal is due to the fact that on that side of the tank the transmission is released and the track is basically in neutral <S>
Edit: aka. friction (not gravity) is forcing it to roll backwards while the other side rolls fowards. :aok
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:O nom nom nom :O :D :D :D :D
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BAM!!!the tiger could pivot in place but could not rotate on axis.
Pivot is a center point of rotation.
in fact nothing in that quote by 2bighorn says it will :aok
Actually it does.
Russian tanks in WWII could not achieve this either nor any (if not all) british and american armor.
Cromwell MkV, for example, could, etc...
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Most WWII tanks used braked or controlled differential steering systems that could not neutral turn.
The Tiger was the first production tank with the Maybach double differential steering system, allowing it to neutral turn. It was designed by Henschel based on the Merritt-Brown gearbox used on the Churchill tank.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWSYa7b3Vjo
"STEERING UNIT
Steering is effected by imposing different speeds on to the sun wheel of an epicyclic, whose annulus is positively driven by a bevel meshing with the main gearbox output bevel, and whose planet carrier carries the output flange to the final drive. There is one of these epicyclics at each end of the bevel shaft meshing with the gearbox output bevel.
The direction and speed rotation of the sun wheel and the choice of left or right hand sides are governed by the engagement of two or four hydraulically operated multi-disc clutches. These clutches connect the sun wheels through a lay shaft meshing with the small bevel on the extension of the gearbox input shaft. In this way a choice of two speeds both proportional to engine speed, is imposed at will upon the sun wheel of the epicyclic whose annulus is already rotating at a multiple of engine speed according to the gear engaged. In addition, in neutral with no output from the main gearbox bevel, a drive is still obtained from the bevel on the extension of the gearbox input shaft, and this produces with the engagement of the appropriate steering clutch opposing rotations of left and right sun wheels. As the annuli are unable to rotate in opposite directions owing to their being secured to the same shaft this opposite rotation of the sun wheel, of necessity, produces opposite rotation of the output flanges, resulting in a neutral turn. For one full revolution of both output flanges the gearbox input flange performs 117 revs.
Oil pressure from a pump driven by an extension of the fore and aft gearbox shaft is admitted to the required steering clutches through ports in the steering assembly casing, the opening of which is controlled by a piston valve. Movement of piston valve is governed by the driver's steering wheel. In this way two distinct radii of turn are available for each gear engaged, and identical for left and right turns. A mushroom shaped knob on the gearbox casing operates hydraulically a brake on one section of the main shaft, thereby eliminating clutch drag and making the neutral turn more positive.
The tank can also be steered when required by steering levers on each side of the driver which operate the right and left brake assemblies."
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:aok :aok
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Panthers were delivered in plain dark yellow from the factory up until late 1944. This was standard camo for German armour in the 43-44 timeframe. The army depots or front line units camouflaged the vehicles with green and red brown paint as needed. From Sept 44 the tanks were camouflaged in the factory. Three colour camo schemes were applied direct to the primer to save paint and unseen areas were just left in primer. In 1945 the official scheme changed again, Panthers were supposed be painted base green with the other two camo colours applied above. However in reality all sorts of schemes were used as paint supplies dwindled.
The default Panther is from Kampfgruppe Peiper and was knocked out in an ambush near Stoumont in the Battle of the Bulge. It has a late 1944 MAN factory three colour camo scheme applied onto primer. I picked this scheme because it has more green in it than an earlier Panther and so would blend in with the MA terrain better.
I've done several skins for the Panther with earlier schemes and zimmerit paste applied, I'll post screenshots in the skins forum once the new version is out.
Hi Greebo, great work as always!
So are all those extra skins earlier schemes? I was just thinking that the so called ambush camo that was intruduced rather late in the war would look mighty cool on the Panther! ;)
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die hard got it for me but bighorn i cant find anywhere in that where it says it would...
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Hi Greebo, great work as always!
So are all those extra skins earlier schemes? I was just thinking that the so called ambush camo that was intruduced rather late in the war would look mighty cool on the Panther! ;)
One of my skins is done in what is termed "disc camouflage", which is the MAN factory version of the ambush scheme. The other two are earlier schemes, base dark yellow with red brown and green mottling. What I think you mean though is the Mercedes factory's ambush scheme, which has lots of dots covering the camouflage. I haven't done one of those, but may do so when I get time, assuming someone else doesn't do it first.
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
they spent their 2 cents on tank up grades and now they are broke!
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
Seems this thing is a beast long range i cant wait :x :x
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lol, I just wanna wait to see the dispute !
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One of my skins is done in what is termed "disc camouflage", which is the MAN factory version of the ambush scheme. The other two are earlier schemes, base dark yellow with red brown and green mottling. What I think you mean though is the Mercedes factory's ambush scheme, which has lots of dots covering the camouflage. I haven't done one of those, but may do so when I get time, assuming someone else doesn't do it first.
Yeh, I'm talking about that one, small dots applied over the basic camo. Looks cool. :)
Something like this:
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y77/AcoolVW/InfraRed/PantherGPz5withaninfrareddevice-2.jpg)
(A nice 3D-model but maybe not the best depiction of the paint scheme itself.)
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moin
i have to say thank you very much HTC to bringing this tank :salute.
cu christian
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die hard got it for me but bighorn i cant find anywhere in that where it says it would...
Here, it's marked in bold:
...opposite rotation of the sun wheel, of necessity, produces opposite rotation of the output flanges, resulting in a neutral turn.
You can see that clearly on that animation die hard posted.
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Here, it's marked in bold:
...opposite rotation of the sun wheel, of necessity, produces opposite rotation of the output flanges, resulting in a neutral turn.
You can see that clearly on that animation die hard posted.
ty <S>
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
I swore I would have no say in this. So I'll say .....
perdweeb
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
Probably busy playing WoT.
ack-ack
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
Yeah any time I get the urge to gv now i play WoT.
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Looks like we are getting some new German Iron. :rock
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/images/stories/news/panther-tank-1.jpg)
Bit pointless introducing new gv's when the damage modelling etc on the ones we have still require much more fine tuning.
Example : 2 stationery tanks , one shoots at the broadside of the other ,sees a hit sprite dead middle ,then the shell explodes in the trees behind the tank with no no damage or kill on the tank observed with the hit sprite.
Happened 3 times on 3 separate occasions the other night.
With gv's you just have to take that kind of watermelon all the time
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Few other ambush camos:
http://ausfwerks.com/buildup/panther/main.html
http://www.the-old-toy-factory.com/Webpage/Imagens/Escala%201_32/99405S1_Panther_Tank_Ambush_Camo.jpg
I understand that the scheme is not supposed to be spotted with round spots but with irregular triangles or other such patterns, or maybe they had different stencisl for those in different factories.
Discussion on subject:
http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=c990f57cf290a6d38d50c9d9eef229bc&t=70734&page=2
-C+
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where is the American tank? like the M-18 hell cat.
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj110/GrnEagle43DHBG/m18-gun-motor-carriage-02.png)
enough of the German tanks. we need American tank in here now. we have the B-29 coming in from late
war. why not the M-18 hell cat from 1945.
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oh ya or maybe the Pershing tank the M29 yea.
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj110/GrnEagle43DHBG/TANKS%20ARTILARY/usmt-M26-Pershing-3rdArmy.jpg)
American
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Japanese had tanks too... :cry
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where is the American tank? like the M-18 hell cat.
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj110/GrnEagle43DHBG/m18-gun-motor-carriage-02.png)
enough of the German tanks. we need American tank in here now. we have the B-29 coming in from late
war. why not the M-18 hell cat from 1945.
M-18!!! :noid
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where is the American tank? like the M-18 hell cat.
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj110/GrnEagle43DHBG/m18-gun-motor-carriage-02.png)
enough of the German tanks. we need American tank in here now. we have the B-29 coming in from late
war. why not the M-18 hell cat from 1945.
Why did you mention it? This thread now belongs to BAR.
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Japanese had tanks too... :cry
with paper armor, like the rest of the things they built
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with paper armor, like the rest of the things they built
Their ships certainly didn't have paper armor, nor did their aircraft once they put armor on them.
They didn't even try to build a tank for tank vs. tank combat until the very end, and the few of those they did build never fought. For some unfathomable reason, the Japanese focused on ships and airplanes. Maybe it had to do with tanks not floating very well...
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Their ships certainly didn't have paper armor, nor did their aircraft once they put armor on them.
They didn't even try to build a tank for tank vs. tank combat until the very end, and the few of those they did build never fought. For some unfathomable reason, the Japanese focused on ships and airplanes. Maybe it had to do with tanks not floating very well...
^this :lol
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A question is, "Do you think they will add Japanese tanks in AH?". I honestly do not see why not, seeing as they did use them, even if their armor was a bit on the thin side. People ask for the Panzer II, and it's armor was not that much better. The same could be said about the Soviet BT-5, which I have not seen many people request this tank (In fact, search only pulled up an O'Club topic about one being raised, but no wishing or discussion). It is a tank I would like to see added as well as the BT-7.
Another question is, "Which of the Japanese tanks would be added 1st?". That one is a bit of a doozy. Those of you who have books about Japanese tanks, would be better equipped to answer this question.
Now, back to topic... :lol
I've seen many a photo of the Panther with a pintle gun, will they be adding it to our Panther prior to it's release? I also wonder if it's Eny is going to be the same, or lower than the Tiger's. I'm guessing it will be the same. Perk price will be about the same as well. While it's gun is deadlier than the Tiger's, it's armor is thinner overall. Deadlier gun, slightly faster, better, slopped armor.....perked = to the Tiger is my guess. I wouldn't complain if it was, or even slightly higher considering it's advantages. Also means I'm going to run out of perks right quick. haha I can only imagine right now, how she'll look rolling around on USRanger's Twin Rivers map....*drools* :x
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According to Robert Leckie author and marine several Japanese tanks on Guadalcanal were taken out with M1 Garands and .30 cal MGs
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:lol been holding my tongue about this since the convention. Actually as far as frontal protection the panther tends to be a slightly better then the Tiger 1, mostly due to the armors slope.
Panther G Tiger 1
Turret F. 110/11deg. 100/8deg.
hull front 80/55deg.(upper) 100/24deg
60/55deg.(lower)
gun mantlet 100 (curved) 100-110/0deg.
The actual size or surface area comes into play also. The smaller the surface area of the actual area exposed is a quality in itself. A 6'x2' plate at 100mm thickness will out perform a 6'x6' plate at 100mm thickness. The frontal area on that panther is enormous compared to the tiger. As far as the slope is concerned, the 8.8cm round overmatched most armour plating where the slope is calculated in. t-34 vs. tigerI is a good example. The spare track sections of the tigerI being mounted on the front of the hull is not by accident either, and is not modeled in AH.
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According to Robert Leckie author and marine several Japanese tanks on Guadalcanal were taken out with M1 Garands and .30 cal MGs
this is ture, any weapon 7.62mm or bigger is a threat to japanese tanks
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The top turret armor on the Panther, according to the information I have found on the internet, is about the same as the current panzer IV H. For comparison,
Tiger, 26mm
Sherman, 25mm
T34/85, 20mm
Panzer IV H, 16mm
Panther, 16 mm
The current panzer is easily killed with the IL2 or B25H. If the Panther is the same, then it will be very vulnerable to air attack.
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where's all the world of tank guys w/ their 2 cent input ????
******
thats all you get for two cents
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M-18!!!! :noid :furious
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this is ture, any weapon 7.62mm or bigger is a threat to japanese tanks
Not quite. I cant imagine the 33mm frontal armor of the type 95 or type 97 would be harmed by MG fire. I'll do more reading into the matter. BTW, the Type 97 would be the best Japaese tank to add, most numerous and most capable tank they had. 57mm gun, a pair of 7.7mm MG's, 23mph, and lightly armored.
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A question is, "Do you think they will add Japanese tanks in AH?". I honestly do not see why not, seeing as they did use them, even if their armor was a bit on the thin side.
Why not? IMO, for the same reason as we won't see flamethrower tanks or the Churchill AVRE... cool ideas but they just don't fit into the framework of the game. Almost all the Japanese tanks that saw action were light tanks that were neither designed nor used for slugging it out with enemy medium and heavy tanks.
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Not quite. I cant imagine the 33mm frontal armor of the type 95 or type 97 would be harmed by MG fire. I'll do more reading into the matter. BTW, the Type 97 would be the best Japanese tank to add, most numerous and most capable tank they had. 57mm gun, a pair of 7.7mm MG's, 23mph, and lightly armored.
true the front wouldn't be the problem, how much side,back and top armour does the tank have though?
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just cant wait to dive bomb this thing heheheee!
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true the front wouldn't be the problem, how much side,back and top armour does the tank have though?
The Type 95 "Ha-Go" had 12mm on both side/rear of turret and hull sides, and 9mm on top and rear of hull.
The Type 97 ""Chi-Ha" had 20-26mm throughout the sides and read of the turret and hull.
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so...whens the m1 abrams being put in? :noid :bolt: