Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: JUGgler on January 08, 2011, 12:30:13 AM
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To continue any kind of experiment with this is just silly. F3 is absolutely an improvement! With F3 available I think anyone who says they don't use it is lying "for whatever reason". Shooting in F3 for me was easier "much easier" IF the target was NOT directly in front. "Walking" your rounds to target is UBER easy in F3 mode. SA obviously is the BEST you can get. With that said I do not believe F3 should be removed, there is a couple things plenty clear to me that are very related to this issue.
#1-Vulching and Basecampnig, my definition of basecamping is perching 3-5K from base with advantage in #s as well as Alt! This is only slightly less lame than actually vulching, but since I hate flying long distances it is a lameness that I appreciate! Vulching and basecamping are related to this issue due to the fact it is these actions that result in most deaths from the il2 in F3.
#2-Hangars are "vehicle type" specific, this is related cause the tards who vulch or basecamp will intentionally drop VH and FHs while INTENTIONALLY leaving the BH up to set up the overwhelming "vulch/cherry" advantage. Leaving the BH up results in the il2 as the only viable vehicle left for defence.
If these 2 types of play cannot be altered then F3 view should stay in the MA IMHO!
I think making every hangar able to spawn any and ALL vehicles would settle the vulch problem outright! If vulch is the goal and they leave 1 hangar up to do said vulching then they will have to contend with 1st rate fighters and GVs! If base take is the goal then dropping all hangars will be the way to go, the natural and reasonable consiquence of this will be NO hangars NO vulching! Lets not let the tards have their cake and eat it too ;)
I think this change would end 90% of all vulch and cherry whines immediately. Also F3 view could easily be removed with this change!
I found the il2 to be an "opportunistic" killer, meaning the plane is wofully incapable of competing with virtually any other plane, BUT F3 gives it the ability to SEE EVERYTHING then make simple adjustments for the deflection and crossing shots. This type of OPPORTUNISTIC killing is NOT likely in a plane without F3, your SA is just UBER limited compared to F3.
F3 in regards to groung targets: I found F3 is a GREAT improvement for locating and setting up your attack on GVs. In F3 there is NO reaquisition of targets when you loop over for the attack. In F1 you have to reaquire the target and this can easily affect your attack run.
I'll sum up: If you are dying to il2s in F3 then you should stop vulching and or basecamping! You fully deserve the 23mm you recieve ;)
For every kill an il2 gets it will be killed 8-10 times. The il2 is such a ponderous and labourious plane to fly I say WTFG GHI.
Please remove vehicle icons so F3 has less of an impact on them ;)
If you fly a bomber as a fighter and you've created this "UBER" status doing so, I don't think you are UBER at all as using F3 levels the playing field significantly ;)
Anyway it was ponderous and not very fun, although quite informative! Now I am done with the il2, Go get emm GHI <S>
JUGgler
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Told YOU ALL AH community it is easier by massive amounts.
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yeah. and HTC wont change it unless you give em a video. Which by the way i fail at. So someone else can do it. Personally i dont care if its changed or not. If F1 in an A20 is forced then i will deal with it :aok
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(http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs16/f/2007/181/0/8/_rolleyes__by_Asmodiel.gif)
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(http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs16/f/2007/181/0/8/_rolleyes__by_Asmodiel.gif)
This.
We have F3 to simulate the situational awareness that bomber crews had in real-life. It's one of those gamey ways HTC makes Aces High fun, and a game, not a full 100% THIS IS REAL LIFE simulator. If you want to game the game, go ahead, there's nothing stopping you. But to think everybody that kills
you in an IL-2 or such other Air2Ground aircraft is using F3 mode, is absolutely absurd.
Its a game, people. A GAME! Why make a big deal out of having F3 mode in, say, an IL-2? Have you ever tried to look around you in an IL-2 NOT using F3 mode? Have fun spotting GV's from the cockpit alone!
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This.
We have F3 to simulate the situational awareness that bomber crews had in real-life. It's one of those gamey ways HTC makes Aces High fun, and a game, not a full 100% THIS IS REAL LIFE simulator. If you want to game the game, go ahead, there's nothing stopping you. But to think everybody that kills
you in an IL-2 or such other Air2Ground aircraft is using F3 mode, is absolutely absurd.
Its a game, people. A GAME! Why make a big deal out of having F3 mode in, say, an IL-2? Have you ever tried to look around you in an IL-2 NOT using F3 mode? Have fun spotting GV's from the cockpit alone!
JUGs point wasnt to remove F3 from all of the aircraft that currently utilize it. Just limit it by not allowing the guns to fire while outside the cockpit. F3 is rampant in the DA in fighters and JUG's summation affects that arena. Let's see if we can get JUG to answer one last question:
JUG, if you and I went to the DA to 1 v 1 in say, JUGs...I will use F3 and you can't...do I have any advantage on you and if so, why?
Changeup
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Changeup, you'd only have a slight advantage SA wise. You would be able to see your dead 6 and under your wings, below you.
When it comes to guns, it's all player skill.
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(http://www.memorylast.net/content/graphics/animated-gifs/popcorn.gif)
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JUG, if you and I went to the DA to 1 v 1 in say, JUGs...I will use F3 and you can't...do I have any advantage on you and if so, why?
You by far would have the advantage. I've explained why too many times to too many people. someone else can take that
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To continue any kind of experiment with this is just silly. F3 is absolutely an improvement! With F3 available I think anyone who says they don't use it is lying "for whatever reason". Shooting in F3 for me was easier "much easier" IF the target was NOT directly in front. "Walking" your rounds to target is UBER easy in F3 mode. SA obviously is the BEST you can get. With that said I do not believe F3 should be removed, there is a couple things plenty clear to me that are very related to this issue.
#1-Vulching and Basecampnig, my definition of basecamping is perching 3-5K from base with advantage in #s as well as Alt! This is only slightly less lame than actually vulching, but since I hate flying long distances it is a lameness that I appreciate! Vulching and basecamping are related to this issue due to the fact it is these actions that result in most deaths from the il2 in F3.
#2-Hangars are "vehicle type" specific, this is related cause the tards who vulch or basecamp will intentionally drop VH and FHs while INTENTIONALLY leaving the BH up to set up the overwhelming "vulch/cherry" advantage. Leaving the BH up results in the il2 as the only viable vehicle left for defence.
If these 2 types of play cannot be altered then F3 view should stay in the MA IMHO!
I think making every hangar able to spawn any and ALL vehicles would settle the vulch problem outright! If vulch is the goal and they leave 1 hangar up to do said vulching then they will have to contend with 1st rate fighters and GVs! If base take is the goal then dropping all hangars will be the way to go, the natural and reasonable consiquence of this will be NO hangars NO vulching! Lets not let the tards have their cake and eat it too ;)
I think this change would end 90% of all vulch and cherry whines immediately. Also F3 view could easily be removed with this change!
I found the il2 to be an "opportunistic" killer, meaning the plane is wofully incapable of competing with virtually any other plane, BUT F3 gives it the ability to SEE EVERYTHING then make simple adjustments for the deflection and crossing shots. This type of OPPORTUNISTIC killing is NOT likely in a plane without F3, your SA is just UBER limited compared to F3.
F3 in regards to groung targets: I found F3 is a GREAT improvement for locating and setting up your attack on GVs. In F3 there is NO reaquisition of targets when you loop over for the attack. In F1 you have to reaquire the target and this can easily affect your attack run.
I'll sum up: If you are dying to il2s in F3 then you should stop vulching and or basecamping! You fully deserve the 23mm you recieve ;)
For every kill an il2 gets it will be killed 8-10 times. The il2 is such a ponderous and labourious plane to fly I say WTFG GHI.
Please remove vehicle icons so F3 has less of an impact on them ;)
If you fly a bomber as a fighter and you've created this "UBER" status doing so, I don't think you are UBER at all as using F3 levels the playing field significantly ;)
Anyway it was ponderous and not very fun, although quite informative! Now I am done with the il2, Go get emm GHI <S>
JUGgler
Let's see your before and after stats then, eh?
[...] to think everybody that kills
you in an IL-2 or such other Air2Ground aircraft is using F3 mode, is absolutely absurd.
This.
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IMHO triggers should be disabled in f3
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IMHO triggers should be disabled in f3
+1
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IMHO triggers should be disabled in f3
(http://latigo.marestare.com/forum/Smileys/default/agree.gif)
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seriously?,people who have been playing this game awhile,and are probably better killers in planes than I am,think that F3 is somehow an unfair advantage when fighitng an IL2 pilot?? GO back to the training arena if you are getting killed by il2's.. :lol
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IMHO triggers should be disabled in f3
Now THIS I agree with 100%
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Let's see your before and after stats then, eh?
This.
Stats Schmats, it is just easier. I would have continued if not for the borebom and that my stick went out last night. As I pondered the situation it was clear continuing the "test" was pointless the "truth is the truth" ;)
JUGgler
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So GHI became very good at doing this and started shooting you down in your uberplanes, and lets face it nearly every other plane in the planeset is uber compared to the IL2. The way I see it happen is
1. Player swoops down on GHI expecting an easy kill
2. GHI makes the player overshoot.
3. He makes a long range shot on you as timidly try and zoom away from a completely inferior plane.
4. You cry on 200 or the boards.
Its not that you want to make it harder for GHI people who whine about this want to make it easier for themselves! :lol why not chop throttle and try and stay in close but out of guns?? Its probably because you are making a timid run on the guy that you get killed, hilarious! :rofl
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JUGs point wasnt to remove F3 from all of the aircraft that currently utilize it. Just limit it by not allowing the guns to fire while outside the cockpit. F3 is rampant in the DA in fighters and JUG's summation affects that arena. Let's see if we can get JUG to answer one last question:
JUG, if you and I went to the DA to 1 v 1 in say, JUGs...I will use F3 and you can't...do I have any advantage on you and if so, why?
Changeup
Well Changeup I would destroy you in a JUG :D! The advantage would be in your "out of plane" perspective. The ability to have "the whole picture" if you will. Example, say I was diving on your 6, and you were trying to set me up for the overshoot. In F3 you would have a clear picture of what I was doing as I past beneath your plane and in front giving you an unobsrtucted picture of me for your guns solution. Using this example if you were not in F3 you would have to roll to get eyes on me. If you dont have to make this roll the advantage in timing and E retention can be significant IMO.
Now using the same example only I have F3 on and you do not: I am diving fast from your hi6 I have an excellent view of your plane as you try to set up the overshoot, normaly in this situation If I stay fast I will have to time my shot as you will be under my nose and not visible to me, a simple "rudder kick" by you and my guns solution is defeated as I would not see this to react to it. In F3 you could do a "song and dance" beneath my nose and I would see it easy, able to adjust and get the kill. I am not good enough to claim there would be absolute advantage in a duel, although common sense tells me YES! F3 takes the guess work out!
I would be inerested to see 2 outstanding players with very similar skill try this out in the DA.
Grizz and 2Bighorn would be prime candidates for this. They are both awesome and I would think they would split victories in a 10 fight match 5/5 maybe 6/4 so ANY advantage one of them had would show up in the victory count I believe.
Anyway in my mind there is no question about the advantage F3 gives someone. Is this advantage enough to overcome the advantages say a corsair has over an il2? NO but it is an opportunistic advantage. I also think at times it is the only thing that helps "the vulched" to kick a few of the "vulchers" in the crotch so removing it would be a toss up for me.
Now in regards to ground attack and F3, well that is entirely a whole new matter.
For those who say F3 is to simulate multiple crew members Hmm, last I looked the il2 didn't have eyes in its belly :huh
With the lame vulchfests that frequent the MA. removing F3 would be mostly bad IMHO!
JUGgler
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This.
We have F3 to simulate the situational awareness that bomber crews had in real-life. It's one of those gamey ways HTC makes Aces High fun, and a game, not a full 100% THIS IS REAL LIFE simulator. If you want to game the game, go ahead, there's nothing stopping you. But to think everybody that kills
you in an IL-2 or such other Air2Ground aircraft is using F3 mode, is absolutely absurd.
Its a game, people. A GAME! Why make a big deal out of having F3 mode in, say, an IL-2? Have you ever tried to look around you in an IL-2 NOT using F3 mode? Have fun spotting GV's from the cockpit alone!
If that's the case, give the 110 F3 mode, and the Mossi VI. The distinction between what planes get F3 modes is not extra eyeballs, it's if it is defined as a Bomber.
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Let's see your before and after stats then, eh?
This.
Not a fair comparison. Juggler has been flying in F1 mode for years and only in f3 mode for a couple weeks.
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I call F-3 mode the Garden Hose Effect. Just spray the steam and adjust to target and that is that. It is clearly an advantage and if you don't think so go to the DA and see for yourself.
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I just have one question. If F3 is easier, why is it harder for me?
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One person had around 887 total iL2 kills of which 728 were Air to Air kills 159 were GV's draw your own theory, Gamey is what it is, when in F3 mode and you squeeze the trigger you should go back into F1 view, no pilot ever had a 360 degree view of his plane while fighting, utter BS, also fix the 110 that can launch rockets on the ground, that's a newest one Ive seen :rolleyes:
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I just have one question. If F3 is easier, why is it harder for me?
I've tried it a couple of times, I think it sucks. I find it to be very disorienting and hard to relate what I need to be doing as far as flying to what is going on around me. Also the TrackIR doesn't work in that mode either, so it's keypad views, since I don't have hat switch views on my phone anymore. It's way harder for me too.
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I've tried it a couple of times, I think it sucks. I find it to be very disorienting and hard to relate what I need to be doing as far as flying to what is going on around me. Also the TrackIR doesn't work in that mode either, so it's keypad views, since I don't have hat switch views on my phone anymore. It's way harder for me too.
i find that in an A20 and IL2 i can get alot more out of the airplane. DA helps me with fighters also incredibly. And thats why i stay MAs :aok for F1 mode for all
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i find that in an A20 and IL2 i can get alot more out of the airplane. DA helps me with fighters also incredibly. And thats why i stay MAs :aok for F1 mode for all
You should come to the DA with me some time and mix it up. At the fields, not the lake. It's incredibly fun and you really can get a much much better feel for the edge of your plane and better at acm to boot in there. Mostly though, it's a blast. Dueling for an hour is way better than days in the main arenas.
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Changeup, you'd only have a slight advantage SA wise. You would be able to see your dead 6 and under your wings, below you.
When it comes to guns, it's all player skill.
I highly recommend you think before you type. Slight advantage? Read what you wrote again, lmao..how many aircraft allow you to see under your wings and dead 6 without F3??? Thats just goofy nonsense. If the con is infront and under your nose, you can see him in F3, without it a good pilot can escape...period.
Changeup
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I just have one question. If F3 is easier, why is it harder for me?
See Grizz's answer. It took me about 2 weeks to adjust and about 3 or 4 weeks to figure out the gunnery. In fact, it was very hard to go back to F1 and fire accurately when I quit going to the DA lake and went to the MA. It was a huge adjustment.
Changeup
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Well Changeup I would destroy you in a JUG :D! The advantage would be in your "out of plane" perspective. The ability to have "the whole picture" if you will. Example, say I was diving on your 6, and you were trying to set me up for the overshoot. In F3 you would have a clear picture of what I was doing as I past beneath your plane and in front giving you an unobsrtucted picture of me for your guns solution. Using this example if you were not in F3 you would have to roll to get eyes on me. If you dont have to make this roll the advantage in timing and E retention can be significant IMO.
Now using the same example only I have F3 on and you do not: I am diving fast from your hi6 I have an excellent view of your plane as you try to set up the overshoot, normaly in this situation If I stay fast I will have to time my shot as you will be under my nose and not visible to me, a simple "rudder kick" by you and my guns solution is defeated as I would not see this to react to it. In F3 you could do a "song and dance" beneath my nose and I would see it easy, able to adjust and get the kill. I am not good enough to claim there would be absolute advantage in a duel, although common sense tells me YES! F3 takes the guess work out!
I would be inerested to see 2 outstanding players with very similar skill try this out in the DA.
Grizz and 2Bighorn would be prime candidates for this. They are both awesome and I would think they would split victories in a 10 fight match 5/5 maybe 6/4 so ANY advantage one of them had would show up in the victory count I believe.
Anyway in my mind there is no question about the advantage F3 gives someone. Is this advantage enough to overcome the advantages say a corsair has over an il2? NO but it is an opportunistic advantage. I also think at times it is the only thing that helps "the vulched" to kick a few of the "vulchers" in the crotch so removing it would be a toss up for me.
Now in regards to ground attack and F3, well that is entirely a whole new matter.
For those who say F3 is to simulate multiple crew members Hmm, last I looked the il2 didn't have eyes in its belly :huh
With the lame vulchfests that frequent the MA. removing F3 would be mostly bad IMHO!
JUGgler
Thanks...I will take you up on the JUG thingy...IN
Changeup
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You should come to the DA with me some time and mix it up. At the fields, not the lake. It's incredibly fun and you really can get a much much better feel for the edge of your plane and better at acm to boot in there. Mostly though, it's a blast. Dueling for an hour is way better than days in the main arenas.
ive actually trained my squad in there almost every sunday. :aok
It really does help with a little info on what it does and showing the limits of the aircraft followed by how to aim, you can take a bad shot, and make him a good one in a day or two :aok
If i have time ill hop in there with ya bud <S>
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ive actually trained my squad in there almost every sunday. :aok
It really does help with a little info on what it does and showing the limits of the aircraft followed by how to aim, you can take a bad shot, and make him a good one in a day or two :aok
If i have time ill hop in there with ya bud <S>
Cool man, I'll even fight ya some in bravo Ponies, though that is one of my worst planes. You'll have to fight me some in the K4 though, to keep it even. I can't have you whipping me all day, after all.
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Cool man, I'll even fight ya some in bravo Ponies, though that is one of my worst planes. You'll have to fight me some in the K4 though, to keep it even. I can't have you whipping me all day, after all.
:lol :aok
been practicing in the K4 though also :t
youd still whip me though :lol
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JUG, if you and I went to the DA to 1 v 1 in say, JUGs...I will use F3 and you can't...do I have any advantage on you and if so, why?
Changeup
Because you can see under your nose. Why is this so hard for people to understand? Seeing is better than firing blindly. Check the 202 films I posted in the DA thread. You will see that with F3 Juggler would have been very easy to hit. Without it, I was taking a guess at where to fire.
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yeah. and HTC wont change it unless you give em a video. Which by the way i fail at. So someone else can do it. Personally i dont care if its changed or not. If F1 in an A20 is forced then i will deal with it :aok
Videos have been posted. Just remove it from the DA.
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Videos have been posted. Just remove it from the DA.
I agree, maybe make just a few fields F3 "no go" zones!
let them have it at the lake
JUGgler