Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Killer91 on March 21, 2011, 02:16:32 PM
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So I was reding today about AT&T and T-Mobile might merge and it got me to thinking.. Just a couple weeks ago in my college history class we were talking about anti-trust laws. Now we didn't go into great detail on them, just their main functions. So how exactly can these two companies merge with these laws in place?
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The way I understand it is that they are merging, not one company buying the other. If it's not one company buying the other than you can't call it eliminating competition so it's perfectly legal.
As least that's the way I understand it (I don't really study law).
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The way I understand it is that they are merging, not one company buying the other. If it's not one company buying the other than you can't call it eliminating competition so it's perfectly legal.
As least that's the way I understand it (I don't really study law).
AT&T is wanting to buy T-Mobile for 39 billion. AT&T has not been able to build towers fast enough. Many folks do not want an ugly tower in their back yard. One way they have chosen to rectify the situation is to buy another company with towers. This, of course, will only happen if they can jump through all the hoops required by government.
Funny thing is that I just left T-Mobile for AT&T.
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The way I understand it is that they are merging, not one company buying the other. If it's not one company buying the other than you can't call it eliminating competition so it's perfectly legal.
As least that's the way I understand it (I don't really study law).
It has not been approved the the FTC yet. The general litmus test is if there are 5 or more competitors in the field and not one competitor of comparable size. Now, At&t is going to claim that there are way more than 5 competitors and list off a slew of regional carriers. Its the FTC's job to deiced what 'comparable size' means, and if regional carriers equate to that. Its also unclear what 'industry' your talking about, At&T could say, we are not in the 'cell phone' market, we are in the 'communications market' and thus expand 'the net' so to speak that their sector encompasses to include more than 5 major competitors. One could see them arguing that they compete with ISP etc... as they themselves have an ISP service and mobile phones now days are more about a connection to the Internet than just for talking.
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If AT&T is willing to spend $39,000,000,000 for it, I'm guessing they won't hesitate to kick a little bit to the FTC guys who are going to make this decision. I have no doubt this will go through.
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So I was reding today about AT&T and T-Mobile might merge and it got me to thinking.. Just a couple weeks ago in my college history class we were talking about anti-trust laws. Now we didn't go into great detail on them, just their main functions. So how exactly can these two companies merge with these laws in place?
Did the class teach you that there are loop holes in the laws?
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Many folks do not want an ugly tower in their back yard.
I would really like to have an 'ugly tower' in my backyard. These cellphone companies pay about $1k a month just for the space.
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I would really like to have an 'ugly tower' in my backyard. These cellphone companies pay about $1k a month just for the space.
hummmm......
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They pay nicely for maintenance services too..... mowing, weed eating, etc.
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So I was reding today about AT&T and T-Mobile might merge and it got me to thinking.. Just a couple weeks ago in my college history class we were talking about anti-trust laws. Now we didn't go into great detail on them, just their main functions. So how exactly can these two companies merge with these laws in place?
I MAY JUST HAVE to switch to verizon now......i like t-mobile.....but i can only see them going down hill from this.....at&t sucks
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I MAY JUST HAVE to switch to verizon now......i like t-mobile.....but i can only see them going down hill from this.....at&t sucks
I was with T-Mobile for the last 9 years. I left them about a month back. While their services was ok, they didn't work in some of the hill country. My T-Mobile guy was a good fella. Always took care of all his customers. Hated to leave but that is just how it is.........
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I would really like to have an 'ugly tower' in my backyard. These cellphone companies pay about $1k a month just for the space.
more than that depending on the location.
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Yup, we have one on our property. We also have 3 or 4 power lines like these:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3134/3167556630_8e1c058755.jpg?v=0)
Luckily we own 80ish acres of land and none of them can be seen from the house.
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great, now i won't have any real choices when my contract is up...where i live, with verizon "can you hear me now"...gets answered with !@%$%!@3 no!!!
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I would really like to have an 'ugly tower' in my backyard. These cellphone companies pay about $1k a month just for the space.
with that in mind....they can place one on my property tomorrow....
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They pay nicely for maintenance services too..... mowing, weed eating, etc.
I have to argue on that one. A few years back, I was helping out a rancher on improving his grazing land. His biggest problem is infestation of cedar trees and no burning. The reason is that of cellphone tower on his land. The company will not do any maintenance and limited the rancher to burn.
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Ah i seeee.. This makes a little more sense now. I'm all for it cause AT&T coverage SUCKS around here. IDK if T-Mobile's network is any better but it can't possibly hurt the cell coverage around here. I'd let em put a tower in my yard just so I could have reliable service. Kinda sucks living inside town(granted I'm about 100ft from the city limits) and not getting service at my house :bhead
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I MAY JUST HAVE to switch to verizon now......i like t-mobile.....but i can only see them going down hill from this.....at&t sucks
I cannot use Verizon as there is a dead space circling my house about 300 yards in diameter, with my house being the centerpoint.
I am screwed now. T-Mobile service has been great for us and the customer support has been top notch as well. I am really screwed.
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I cannot use Verizon as there is a dead space circling my house about 300 yards in diameter, with my house being the centerpoint.
I am screwed now. T-Mobile service has been great for us and the customer support has been top notch as well. I am really screwed.
AT&T was terrible back around 9 to 12 years back. I have the number of our business contact now. I had a single issue to clarify. I called their regular service and was switched around then put on hold for a long time. I finally hung up and was getting really pisssed off. One of my secretaries gave me another number. It is our business contact for AT&T. He was on it and had the issue rectified in less than 5 minutes.
I have to think their individual service is still way below what most would find acceptable.
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Ah i seeee.. This makes a little more sense now. I'm all for it cause AT&T coverage SUCKS around here. IDK if T-Mobile's network is any better but it can't possibly hurt the cell coverage around here. I'd let em put a tower in my yard just so I could have reliable service. Kinda sucks living inside town(granted I'm about 100ft from the city limits) and not getting service at my house :bhead
Although T-Mobile and At&T are both GSM cell providers they operate on different frequencies, often phones have to be made with different chips that cell to AT&T than the ones sold to T-Mable. The Nexus-one is the first one that comes to mind.
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AT&T was terrible back around 9 to 12 years back. I have the number of our business contact now. I had a single issue to clarify. I called their regular service and was switched around then put on hold for a long time. I finally hung up and was getting really pisssed off. One of my secretaries gave me another number. It is our business contact for AT&T. He was on it and had the issue rectified in less than 5 minutes.
I have to think their individual service is still way below what most would find acceptable.
my mom is on at&t, as is my brother. brother doesn't complain about it...although he gets a lot of dropped calls....and can't even talk on his phone in his house.....mom complains about it all the time. with t-mobile, i can talki inside his house....and mine...even in the basement for that matter.
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I've had T-mobile for about 5 years, good coverage in my area and great customer service. The one time I felt like the t-mobile sales associate kind of misled me, I called up t-mobile and they altered my plan and took off all the previous months' charges from the misunderstanding. If you call, you're almost guaranteed an extra 50 anytime minutes it seems.
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They both suck.
Verizon FTW! :aok
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Verizon left a bad taste in my mouth when, after arguing about the coverage issues I was having, they sent a truck out and tested and found my complaint to be legit, and when we dropped the service, they refused to allow us to take our phone number with us, citing the service worked in other areas.
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We've never had problems with AT&T mobile.
We used to have to go out on the back deck to make calls when we lived in an RF "hole". Keep in mind that low areas (in terms of HAAT, or height above average terrain) as well as areas that are surrounded by high, dense folliage--read that trees--are susceptible to bad connectivity.
While a transmitted RF signal at Low Frequency--LF, Medium Frequency--MW, High Frequency--HF, and VHF could care less about buildings and trees, UHF starts to get bad and all the cell phone bands 900 mHZ up to 10 GHZ are highly affected by it. Placement of the cell towers is also a factor. Keep in mind that your cell phone transmits a signal of 500 mW (typical), or basically 5 times the strength as your garage door opener (100 mW). That's not exactly big-time RF. While a ham radio operator can take that same 500 mW and communicate with the South Pole on Morse Code or digital computer modes at 14.030 mHZ HF (with a high gain antenna with height)...that same 500 mW at cell phone frequencies--also known as "microwave" frequencies doesn't have a lot of poop, and much less with heavy foliage and a low location--at least "low" in the eyes of the closest cell tower. There's only so much you can do with 500 mW and basically a glorified vertical dipole antenna...and it gets worse when people use a phone in anything other that a vertical position when on the cell tower's fringe.
I am lucky now. We moved to a nice mountainside home about 350' above the rest of the town around us and there are 2 cell towers--both we are far higher up than. We have 5 bars everywhere we go except 30 miles away in a major deadspot (no towers). Outside of that, we are rock solid everywhere we go. We go down to the shelter below the house (surrounded by concrete) and still be solid 5 bars.
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Verizon left a bad taste in my mouth when, after arguing about the coverage issues I was having, they sent a truck out and tested and found my complaint to be legit, and when we dropped the service, they refused to allow us to take our phone number with us, citing the service worked in other areas.
There customer service is the worst.
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I cannot use Verizon as there is a dead space circling my house about 300 yards in diameter, with my house being the centerpoint.
I am screwed now. T-Mobile service has been great for us and the customer support has been top notch as well. I am really screwed.
I have a feeling that AT&T is buying T-Mobile to use their 4g network. They'll in all likelyhood use T-Mobile's former towers and networks. That's what AT&T did when they bought Cingular. You'll probably be fine as far as reception goes. Their customer service is ok, not as good as Sprint but much better than Verizon.
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I have a feeling that AT&T is buying T-Mobile to use their 4g network. They'll in all likelihood use T-Mobile's former towers and networks. That's what AT&T did when they bought Cingular. You'll probably be fine as far as reception goes. Their customer service is ok, not as good as Sprint but much better than Verizon.
Here's some inside information. T-Mobile does NOT have 4G, they piggy backed on a brew-haha last year when Sprint and others "claimed they had 4G, but also did not". T-Mobile said "Screw it, rename our 3G.....4G". The problem is, now Verizon has the largest 4G coverage, then AT&T and Sprint following in 3rd. T-Mobile still has 3G and it is night and day between the two speeds.
It is not conjecture, they (T-Mobile) do NOT have 4G.
We just left Sprint after 13 years last month. Verizon is superior, in both Customer Service and Coverage. I also like my DroidX.
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Here's some inside information. T-Mobile does NOT have 4G, they piggy backed on a brew-haha last year when Sprint and others "claimed they had 4G, but also did not". T-Mobile said "Screw it, rename our 3G.....4G". The problem is, now Verizon has the largest 4G coverage, then AT&T and Sprint following in 3rd. T-Mobile still has 3G and it is night and day between the two speeds.
It is not conjecture, they (T-Mobile) do NOT have 4G.
We just left Sprint after 13 years last month. Verizon is superior, in both Customer Service and Coverage. I also like my DroidX.
Well, then according to the ITU, Verizons LTE isn't 4G either. Semantics really. True 4G would be 100mbs which hasn't been achieved
commercially. Typically, what the carriers (read: ALL CARRIERS, not just T-mobile) are referring to as 4G is somewhere between 6mbs
to 12mbs real world. ( HSPA+ ) which is T-mobiles "4G" is pretty much comparable to Verizon's LTE or Sprints WiMax.
Although I think Sprint was at the lower end of that spectrum.
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Here's some inside information. T-Mobile does NOT have 4G, they piggy backed on a brew-haha last year when Sprint and others "claimed they had 4G, but also did not". T-Mobile said "Screw it, rename our 3G.....4G". The problem is, now Verizon has the largest 4G coverage, then AT&T and Sprint following in 3rd. T-Mobile still has 3G and it is night and day between the two speeds.
It is not conjecture, they (T-Mobile) do NOT have 4G.
We just left Sprint after 13 years last month. Verizon is superior, in both Customer Service and Coverage. I also like my DroidX.
Good to know. Either way, Skuzzy will still have cell coverage. :D
3g to 4g is all junk anyway... It's just bandwidth.
I used to deal with these systems every darn day (sprint blackberry enterprise servers and networks). Before you ask... Yes, Research In Motion sucks.
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Good to know. Either way, Skuzzy will still have cell coverage. :D
3g to 4g is all junk anyway... It's just bandwidth.
I used to deal with these systems every darn day (sprint blackberry enterprise servers and networks). Before you ask... Yes, Research In Motion sucks.
Here is the deal.. 4g == marketing term... Different carriers are selling different things.... I don't think there is a carrier in the US that is selling full on '4g' which is called 'LTE Advanced' and none of them I think are yet compliant with IMT Advanced 4G requirements.
1) T-Mobile: I believe is actually selling "HSDPA+" wich is more like 3.5g but branding it as 4g. 3g is also known as UMTS.
2) At&T: I believe is actually selling LTE GSM as '4g'.
3) Verizon: I believe is selling LTE and they are calling this '4g'.
4) Sprint: Is selling WiMax which is a totally different technology and is more akin to wide area wifi. They are branding this two ways, once as '4g' and once through a joint venture called "Clear Wire".
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(Verizon)There customer service is the worst.
Actually, you're wrong.
Just the opposite.
Here is just one example of many:
http://cell-phone-providers-review.toptenreviews.com/
In some cases, AT&T is the very worst in customer service:
http://www.jdpower.com/Telecom/ratings/wireless-customer-care-ratings-(volume-1)/
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Good to know. Either way, Skuzzy will still have cell coverage. :D
3g to 4g is all junk anyway... It's just bandwidth.
I used to deal with these systems every darn day (sprint blackberry enterprise servers and networks). Before you ask... Yes, Research In Motion sucks.
Maybe, maybe not. If the sevice degrades, at all, I will terminate the service and simply do without cell service. No big deal to me. I have always voted with my wallet. I will not do business with Verizon as the service was bad, and the customer service was worse. We had Sprint for a short period of time. Not any better. We tried T-Mobile and have been with them for several years now. No complaints at all.
I do not care how many G's any service has not or does not have. I have an old Motorola flip phone. No Internet, no email, no text messaging, just a phone. It may the last phone I ever have, unless I can find a replacement which does not have a GPS chip in it.
It does what I need it to do.
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No phone service has 4G. It is a marketing term only that all are trying to get away from as no one has that speed.
When I changed to AT&T I got the HTC Inspire the before it was to go on sale. I was actually looking to see if the Atrix was out yet. They set me up and said when the Atrix comes out I could switch to it, no charge. Well the Atric came out and I was not impressed. While it is dual core it was no faster than the Inspire and smaller with a cheap feel and look. I kept the Inspire and am very happy with it.
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I MAY JUST HAVE to switch to verizon now......i like t-mobile.....but i can only see them going down hill from this.....at&t sucks
That's my take on this. Verizon ain't cheap (over priced out here IMO, especialy if you want data just forget about it), AT&T sucks, goodbye T-mobile.... now what do I do?
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That's my take on this. Verizon ain't cheap (over priced out here IMO, especialy if you want data just forget about it), AT&T sucks, goodbye T-mobile.... now what do I do?
You can get your ham ticket and have your friends do the same. Except for the $ spent on study book, exam, and radio & antenna (both of which you could build yourself if you wanted) it has zero "time" charges. Talk with Australia, UK, Canada, or across town all you want. I know boatloads of husband/wife hams who keep in touch locally on 145-147 mHz FM. No minutes.
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You can get your ham ticket and have your friends do the same. Except for the $ spent on study book, exam, and radio & antenna (both of which you could build yourself if you wanted) it has zero "time" charges. Talk with Australia, UK, Canada, or across town all you want. I know boatloads of husband/wife hams who keep in touch locally on 145-147 mHz FM. No minutes.
No thank you, I've done my share of rigging 50-100 foot "ladder" ham antennas from the top of the chimney and into our hillside during my youth for my often ungrateful and phsycodic-workaholic father. I've spent way more time rigging, maintaining and repairing the antennas and equipment for him than he's taken the time to enjoy using it or ever taken any time to show me the operating ropes, so it's all there still and likely still working since last I checked, tempting, but just no.
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Actually, you're wrong.
Just the opposite.
Here is just one example of many:
http://cell-phone-providers-review.toptenreviews.com/
In some cases, AT&T is the very worst in customer service:
http://www.jdpower.com/Telecom/ratings/wireless-customer-care-ratings-(volume-1)/
You have not dealt with what we had to. After canceling our contract the past summer, they are still charging us and had a collection agency after us.
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Not a done deal yet. Sprint is trying to block it. GO SPRINT GO!
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Not a done deal yet. Sprint is trying to block it. GO SPRINT GO!
:banana: :banana: :banana:
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Not a done deal yet. Sprint is trying to block it. GO SPRINT GO!
I HOPE THey succeed......was talking to mom last night on the phone. thought my borg implant was acting up..it did a funny ring, and there was a hum/whine in the background...so i hung up n called back. same thing. also heard other voices. i hung up, and called her on the house phone. all was ok now. she's on at&t.
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Fact is Verizon is owning the cell phone world.....getting the Iphone probably is what made At&T decide to expand because that was their only up on Verizon, even though Droid > Iphone.
My facebook status from the other day...
"T-mobile and AT&T merging? Looks like boss dog Verizon might actually have to step their game up....oh and can you hear me now? Verizon for the win"
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I won't miss Sprint and their gaping coverage holes.
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I am not crazy about Sprint, but if this merger happens and the service degrades for T-Mobile customers, then Sprint will be my only option.
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I am not crazy about Sprint, but if this merger happens and the service degrades for T-Mobile customers, then Sprint will be my only option.
When you walk into Sprint, ask them if they still are taking their Nextel friend's advice to have call centers in mexico that they're paying to call their paying customers and use up their their time while also trying to sell add-services and other such lovely aditional offers. I'm serious, and spin it so you can get a deal if only to make me happy to know they squirmed a little. Still the only company in the world to this day I have never settled my debt with (I refused and always will to pay them my last two months I had them, after being a loyal customer for years and for the BS that started happening after Nextel bought them).
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When you walk into Sprint, ask them if they still are taking their Nextel friend's advice to have call centers in mexico that they're paying to call their paying customers and use up their their time while also trying to sell add-services and other such lovely aditional offers. I'm serious, and spin it so you can get a deal if only to make me happy to know they squirmed a little. Still the only company in the world to this day I have never settled my debt with (I refused and always will to pay them my last two months I had them, after being a loyal customer for years and for the BS that started happening after Nextel bought them).
Up until last year the main Nextel tech support centers were Des Moines, IA and Winchester, KY. Now Winchester is the main tech center as Des Moines has closed. They do have a tech center in Mexico City, but only transfer there for Spanish language support. All their tech support is outsourced to Hewlett Packard, which bought their former tech support provider, EDS (started by Ross Perot). I'm unsure as to whether they have a sales dept. that's in Mexico though.
EDIT: Nextel's IDEN network is so antiquated that I have zero clue why anyone would even bother to use it anyway.
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But you all have to remember when Cingular bought out AT&T so isn't it really Cingular renamed as AT&T merging with T-Mobile. Also didn't AT&T get broke up a while ago because they had an almost monopoly or something?
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Here is the deal.. 4g == marketing term... Different carriers are selling different things.... I don't think there is a carrier in the US that is selling full on '4g' which is called 'LTE Advanced' and none of them I think are yet compliant with IMT Advanced 4G requirements.
1) T-Mobile: I believe is actually selling "HSDPA+" wich is more like 3.5g but branding it as 4g. 3g is also known as UMTS.
2) At&T: I believe is actually selling LTE GSM as '4g'.
3) Verizon: I believe is selling LTE and they are calling this '4g'.
4) Sprint: Is selling WiMax which is a totally different technology and is more akin to wide area wifi. They are branding this two ways, once as '4g' and once through a joint venture called "Clear Wire".
I believe AT&T has had HSPDA+ for 2 years now. I may be wrong but my past two AT&T smartphones connect/connected to HSPDA+. Only the smartphones are able to connect to it and even then its specific on the phone I believe.
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I believe AT&T has had HSPDA+ for 2 years now. I may be wrong but my past two AT&T smartphones connect/connected to HSPDA+. Only the smartphones are able to connect to it and even then its specific on the phone I believe.
yeah, exactly, at&t has a more 'advanced' network than t-mobile, its just that they way oversubscribe it. I could go into the details of GSM and it being time-division vs cdma being code-division and the adv of code-division, but that would just bore people.
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yeah, exactly, at&t has a more 'advanced' network than t-mobile, its just that they way oversubscribe it. I could go into the details of GSM and it being time-division vs cdma being code-division and the adv of code-division, but that would just bore people.
I barely made it through your post. :aok
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yeah, exactly, at&t has a more 'advanced' network than t-mobile, its just that they way oversubscribe it. I could go into the details of GSM and it being time-division vs cdma being code-division and the adv of code-division, but that would just bore people.
it may not actually.
a friend of mine works for l3 communications. he had explained to me in the past, why/how verizon is better than the others. i can't remember though.
as for at&t vs t-mobile? the exgtent of my travels are generally nj, pa, and up/down the east coast. never any dead spots, except in 2 wooded areas near south jersey regional airport.
mom on the other hand(at&t) hits dead spots in the carolinas, southern georgia, and in different areas around my brothers house in florida.....not to mention all the drops she has around here in nj.
i'll be paying attention...if i feel that their service is dropping.........then i'll go to verizon.
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Up until last year the main Nextel tech support centers were Des Moines, IA and Winchester, KY. Now Winchester is the main tech center as Des Moines has closed. They do have a tech center in Mexico City, but only transfer there for Spanish language support. All their tech support is outsourced to Hewlett Packard, which bought their former tech support provider, EDS (started by Ross Perot). I'm unsure as to whether they have a sales dept. that's in Mexico though.
EDIT: Nextel's IDEN network is so antiquated that I have zero clue why anyone would even bother to use it anyway.
Oh I think at the time they had to disolve that sales branch in Mexico and make a public statement along the lines of claiming "oops, did we do that? we couldn't of done that because that is soo stupid!", because there were a lot more vocaly upset consumers than I was at that time.
This was back a year or so after Nextel "merged" with Sprint... I want to say somewhere in the ballpark of '02-'04.
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it may not actually.
a friend of mine works for l3 communications. he had explained to me in the past, why/how verizon is better than the others. i can't remember though.
as for at&t vs t-mobile? the exgtent of my travels are generally nj, pa, and up/down the east coast. never any dead spots, except in 2 wooded areas near south jersey regional airport.
mom on the other hand(at&t) hits dead spots in the carolinas, southern georgia, and in different areas around my brothers house in florida.....not to mention all the drops she has around here in nj.
i'll be paying attention...if i feel that their service is dropping.........then i'll go to verizon.
You are mixing different things...
1) At&T & T-Mobile are both GSM, Verizon is CDMA. Thus, AT&T have a 'time-division' system and Verizon has a 'code-division' system.
2) Dead spots & coverage don't have much to do with '3g/4g' or CDMA vs GSM. Dead spots is due to the terrain and the placement of cell towers whereas the discussion about 3g/4g is about the 'width of the pipe' ie.. bandwidth (which translates into speed).