Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Penguin on June 28, 2011, 02:57:39 PM
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Currently, the pilot's neck is made of diamond. When incoming rounds or terrain damage the plane, his head position is solid as a rock. The only problem with this is that real pilots have necks made of muscle, bone, sinew and connective tissue. Therefore, I ask that HTC add a head shake effect, with its violence dependent on the damage inflicted.
In addition to having a neck of diamond, our pilot has nerves of steel. Therefore, I request that if and when the pilot takes fire (and near misses), a screen blur effect on the sides of the screen creep in, with its severity based on the damage. My point is based on one of Winston Churchill's quotes: "There is not a more exciting thing in the world than for someone to shoot at you, and miss."
Finally, it seems odd that our pilot simply teleports out of the plane, and there is hardly a peep out of him. I suggest that we add a sound for a pilot jumping out of the airplane, with the sound of leather, canvas and steel all sliding and banging together being the default.
-Penguin
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I find that incredibly hard to believe....... :headscratch:
The specific density of diamond vs the velocity of lead would not make for a comparable break even point. The lead will win decidedly each and every time causing a general "shatter reaction" from the diamond. Even if the neck diamond was traveling in generally the same direction. :old:
I do not want a neck of diamond, PLUS 1 to this wish!!!
We must do something about these types of reactions....... (http://forgifs.com/gallery/d/185463-1/Gender_reactions.gif)
:D
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In addition to having a neck of diamond, our pilot has nerves of steel. Therefore, I request that if and when the pilot takes fire (and near misses), a screen blur effect on the sides of the screen creep in, with its severity based on the damage. My point is based on one of Winston Churchill's quotes: "There is not a more exciting thing in the world than for someone to shoot at you, and miss."
Having been shot at and missed I can only say that my vision did not blur. Instead things became crystal clear with minute detail noted.
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'There is nothing more exhilarating than to be shot at without result'
at least get your quotes right if you are going to quote a great man.
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No.
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our pilot has nerves of steel.
Modelled perfectly - I have nerves of steel, so why shouldn't my cartoon pilot?
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Blurring? Nah. But I want more violent and jarring animations inside the cockpit during collisions.
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Having been shot at and missed I can only say that my vision did not blur. Instead things became crystal clear with minute detail noted.
It may be hard to remember, but was that detail only where you were focusing or across your entire field of vision? What I've read states that what you focus on becomes crystal clear, but all else becomes blurry.
'There is nothing more exhilarating than to be shot at without result'
at least get your quotes right if you are going to quote a great man.
I tried to find it online but couldn't. Hence, I attempted to model Churchill's manner of speech.
I find that incredibly hard to believe....... :headscratch:
The specific density of diamond vs the velocity of lead would not make for a comparable break even point. The lead will win decidedly each and every time causing a general "shatter reaction" from the diamond. Even if the neck diamond was traveling in generally the same direction. :old:
I do not want a neck of diamond, PLUS 1 to this wish!!!
We must do something about these types of reactions....... (http://forgifs.com/gallery/d/185463-1/Gender_reactions.gif)
:D
It's not for when the pilot is shot, but the plane itself.
-Penguin
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Finally, it seems odd that our pilot simply teleports out of the plane, and there is hardly a peep out of him. I suggest that we add a sound for a pilot jumping out of the airplane, with the sound of leather, canvas and steel all sliding and banging together being the default.
i like this...but for jumping, have the default be something along the lines of what the troopers say jumping out of the C-47...
GERONIMOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
make the sound file editable though...so you can say stuff like
-here goes nothing
-14$ a months...for THIS!?
-SHUCKS!!!!!!!
:D just my 0.02$
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What I've read states that what you focus on becomes crystal clear, but all else becomes blurry.
That is true no matter what the "condition" (you don't have to be shot at) ... that is how our eyes work ... with very rare exceptions.
When you are typing into a post, the area that you are directly looking at, is the only area in focus ... no ? ... or is everything within your scope of view totally in focus ?
A simple google search ... "churchill shot at" ... 1st link returned ... http://www.quotedb.com/quotes/3461
As far as your wish ... -1
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Penguin you're being too literal. The wide FOV of AH simulates 2 things... Peripheral vision and the instant ability to retain/regain focus while looking around. I just looked back and forth between 2 things, 1 left and 1 right, about 120 degrees apart. When looking at my monitor to type I can see them fairly clearly even though I can't read what is on them (2 pieces of paper pinned up on different walls), but looking back and forth is instant.
What you are suggesting isn't bad, per se. It's just not realistic either. Perhaps for another game it might have a place, but IMO it has nothing to do with AH.
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I want to hear and feel my pilot fill his drawers when he gets in a situation where his death is inevitable. I want virtual realism dammit!
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My virtual pilot stubbed his toe this morning and is recuperating. He won't be flying for a week.
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Currently, the pilot's neck is made of diamond. When incoming rounds or terrain damage the plane, his head position is solid as a rock. The only problem with this is that real pilots have necks made of muscle, bone, sinew and connective tissue. Therefore, I ask that HTC add a head shake effect, with its violence dependent on the damage inflicted.
The pilot is strapped to the plane and the body should not move. As the plane mostly pulls Gs up and down (not side to side like a car) the forces on the neck are up and down, when pulling Gs I don't remember ever having my neck squashed or extended.
Also the way I understand it is if the forces are that high that your head will move down your spine will crack (you will black out way before that) or if the forces are high enough to stretch your neck out your eyes would explode and then your spine would separate disconnecting your body from your neck.
In addition to having a neck of diamond, our pilot has nerves of steel. Therefore, I request that if and when the pilot takes fire (and near misses), a screen blur effect on the sides of the screen creep in, with its severity based on the damage. My point is based on one of Winston Churchill's quotes: "There is not a more exciting thing in the world than for someone to shoot at you, and miss."
I agree with Colmbo on this one. In such situations the pilot feels things slower and is a lot more focused on something. This effect is normally replicated by your body when playing aces high, plus it would be impossible to make things slow down for one guy in an online game.
I can think of only three cases when something would happen to your vision: +/-Gs (we have this), something got in your eye but since we have closed cockpits that is not a problem (and something can get in your eye while playing aces high so your body replicated this on it's own), or there is something seriously wrong with your eyes in which case you would probably not be a fighter pilot.
BTW for the future when trying to prove something about flying I recommend quoting pilots, not politicians.
Finally, it seems odd that our pilot simply teleports out of the plane, and there is hardly a peep out of him. I suggest that we add a sound for a pilot jumping out of the airplane, with the sound of leather, canvas and steel all sliding and banging together being the default.
+1 on this one, but the only sound that you would hear is the wind and your canopy sliding. You would also see the pilot climbing out (as your looking though his eyes), not just flying out through the back of the plane like we have right now.
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The pilot is strapped to the plane and the body should not move. As the plane mostly pulls Gs up and down (not side to side like a car) the forces on the neck are up and down, when pulling Gs I don't remember ever having my neck squashed or extended.
Also the way I understand it is if the forces are that high that your head will move down your spine will crack (you will black out way before that) or if the forces are high enough to stretch your neck out your eyes would explode and then your spine would separate disconnecting your body from your neck.
I agree with Colmbo on this one. In such situations the pilot feels things slower and is a lot more focused on something. This effect is normally replicated by your body when playing aces high, plus it would be impossible to make things slow down for one guy in an online game.
I can think of only three cases when something would happen to your vision: +/-Gs (we have this), something got in your eye but since we have closed cockpits that is not a problem (and something can get in your eye while playing aces high so your body replicated this on it's own), or there is something seriously wrong with your eyes in which case you would probably not be a fighter pilot.
BTW for the future when trying to prove something about flying I recommend quoting pilots, not politicians.
+1 on this one, but the only sound that you would hear is the wind and your canopy sliding. You would also see the pilot climbing out (as your looking though his eyes), not just flying out through the back of the plane like we have right now.
I was not referring to G-Forces. I was referring to your plane hitting the ground or being otherwise damaged. However, thank you for the interesting information about G-Forces, I never knew that. However, it's not the body that causes the shake, it's the head being jarred by impacts from rounds or terrain.
Oops, you're right, I did mess that up. I keep forgetting that AH2 cannot simulate your eyes focusing on something. However, I don't think that quoting Churchill here would make any difference.
-Penguin
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I was not referring to G-Forces. I was referring to your plane hitting the ground or being otherwise damaged. However, thank you for the interesting information about G-Forces, I never knew that. However, it's not the body that causes the shake, it's the head being jarred by impacts from rounds or terrain.
Ah got it. Thankfully I don't really know how that would feel or look so I can not comment.
I seen reports of some cases when the pilot's seat would get ripped off and squash the pilot between the seat and the controls. Also I seen an airplane wreckage where the engine was on the pilot's seat (I assume you can understand what happened there). However this is would vary between the type of crash and the airplane.
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The pilot is strapped to the plane and the body should not move. As the plane mostly pulls Gs up and down (not side to side like a car) the forces on the neck are up and down, when pulling Gs I don't remember ever having my neck squashed or extended.
I've read of a conditon called "Hornet neck". The F-18, like most modern airplanes, can pile the G on pretty quick, guys would be looking over a shoulder and pull hard straining the neck.
As an indication of how you do move under G here is a video (http://www.dalefalk.com/Movies/Mustang/7506324_6taqB#484638165_ZptGh-A-LB) taken while flying Crazy Horse. When Lee takes the airplane and pulls vertical notice how on the inside camera view we both come "up" when he relaxes the pull. That pull was about 6G. I didn't notice any of that until later when watching the video.
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Modelled perfectly - I have nerves of steel, so why shouldn't my cartoon pilot?
(http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/alkorphoto/alkorphoto0903/alkorphoto090300047/4533402-two-steel-balls.jpg)
*walks off whistling innocently
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I've read of a conditon called "Hornet neck". The F-18, like most modern airplanes, can pile the G on pretty quick, guys would be looking over a shoulder and pull hard straining the neck.
As an indication of how you do move under G here is a video (http://www.dalefalk.com/Movies/Mustang/7506324_6taqB#484638165_ZptGh-A-LB) taken while flying Crazy Horse. When Lee takes the airplane and pulls vertical notice how on the inside camera view we both come "up" when he relaxes the pull. That pull was about 6G. I didn't notice any of that until later when watching the video.
They came up because their lap belts were not tight, not because their neck got stretched (as requested in the OP). When I do aerobatics I prefer to tighten my belts so the body would not float at all under negative Gs.
So floating body is just a preference, I don't think we can model that in AH.
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They came up because their lap belts were not tight, not because their neck got stretched (as requested in the OP). When I do aerobatics I prefer to tighten my belts so the body would not float at all under negative Gs.
So floating body is just a preference, I don't think we can model that in AH.
If you're commenting on colmbo's video replace "thier neck" with "your neck".
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They came up because their lap belts were not tight,
My lap belt was quite snug. The 6g pull pushed us down into the seat cushion, what you see is us coming back up to normal.
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My lap belt was quite snug. The 6g pull pushed us down into the seat cushion, what you see is us coming back up to normal.
Hmm...I guess if you look at it from the side you would see that, but I never noticed that effect myself.
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I want to hear and feel my pilot fill his drawers when he gets in a situation where his death is inevitable. I want virtual realism dammit!
You would get tired of that sound every flight buddy. In your case I suggest a round of applause and a fireworks display when you actually land an intact bird. :neener:
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You would get tired of that sound every flight buddy. In your case I suggest a round of applause and a fireworks display when you actually land an intact bird. :neener:
All that work and coding, for something that would never be seen?
:bolt:
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I think there is a new SAPP hack out there. I have seen Corky land at least 5 sorties in the last two weeks. I didn't count that many in the last six months..... :noid :noid :noid :noid
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At least 5? As in you couldn't keep counting on your other hand's fingers because you had to keep that hand operating the margarita blender built into a P-38?
:noid
:banana: :aok
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yes. The curse has it's grip on me. Although my 38 has a handcrank blender. I have not been allowed an electric one yet. :noid
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I LIKE
COLORS
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Having been shot at and missed I can only say that my vision did not blur. Instead things became crystal clear with minute detail noted.
First firefight in Afghanistan went like this:
1. <As RPGs explode around truck> "Is this really happening?"
2. Senses become fine tuned, training creeps back in, you begin to operate like a machine
3. Legs began shaking uncontrollably...first thought is fear...then you realise that it is Adrenaline
4. Begin shooting those bad guys like there is no tomorrow!
Only time my vision became blurry was right after RPG exploded like 20 meters away sending me hurtling through the air and into the side of my Humvee...then was like holy watermelon that was cool...lol.
Sounds like something you would get with a PW on Xbox 360 or somethin
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i like this one.
having flown high-performance gliders i can tell you that your head bobs and jigs alot.even just cranking over into a thermal your head will move a noticable amount.especialy in loops,barrel rolls,snap stalls and hitting turbulance.
how they would model it,i dunno.my guess is when maybe u do a stall and u snap to the side u hit your head on the canopy and hear a thump sound or somthing..
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having flown high-performance gliders i can tell you that your head bobs and jigs alot.even just cranking over into a thermal your head will move a noticable amount.especialy in loops,barrel rolls,snap stalls and hitting turbulance.
A few videos of T-6 aerobatics (http://www.dalefalk.com/Movies/T-6-Flight/7443717_QsSXY#480251587_VUXPT) Check the aileron roll and barrell roll videos, good inside view of pilots head during the rolls.
If flown smoothly I haven't experienced being banged around in the cockpit much except on snap-rolls...at least not as the pilot. It's kind of like driving a car, you think you're being real smooth but your passengers get slammed around since they are unable to anticipate your actions. Turbulence being an exception, on a couple of flight I felt like a Super Ball thrown into a shower stall.
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A few videos of T-6 aerobatics (http://www.dalefalk.com/Movies/T-6-Flight/7443717_QsSXY#480251587_VUXPT) Check the aileron roll and barrell roll videos, good inside view of pilots head during the rolls.
If flown smoothly I haven't experienced being banged around in the cockpit much except on snap-rolls...at least not as the pilot. It's kind of like driving a car, you think you're being real smooth but your passengers get slammed around since they are unable to anticipate your actions. Turbulence being an exception, on a couple of flight I felt like a Super Ball thrown into a shower stall.
ive rarely accualy hit my head on the glass.flew a PW6 yesterday and was only up for about 40 mins.forecast called for 800 fpm but i only could get into 1 thermal witch quickly turned to sink after goin back up to 5500 ft MSL.now,in the PW6 sometimes my head is up against the glass because im 6 foot 7.That is about the only time I hate being this big.
I suggested in the game that when u make a quick maneuver or turn etc that the pilots head would move and if a hard enough turn,he bumps his head on the canopy.it would have to be a heck of a snap roll or turning at 400 knots.thats just my 2 cents on the subject
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I agree with Colmbo on this one, if you are the pilot you should not notice anything. My record is +5.5/-2.0Gs and I never noticed my head moving (turbulence is an exception).
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Wait a minute... I tried some interesting maneuvers yesterday in a P-47-D-11, and whenever I pulled up, dove, or rolled quickly, my head bobbed off to the side a bit, so that the gunsight went off the reflector a bit. Is this what you mean?
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The pilot is strapped to the plane and the body should not move. As the plane mostly pulls Gs up and down (not side to side like a car) the forces on the neck are up and down, when pulling Gs I don't remember ever having my neck squashed or extended.
Not all pilots in ww2 had the racing style shoulder harnesses used today. I believe the waste strap was more common by a vast majority.
Second only in coordinated flight are the G forces always in the vertical. Air combat is nearly impossible to maintain coordinated. As a matter of fact most of us use so much rudder in turn fights the pilots body would be glued to the side of his aircraft if it were real.
If it were a realistic view system, every time you rolled suddenly or snap rolled your entire virtual body would be slammed to the side. The same would happen every time you kicked your rudder hard.
To the OP, this sounds like a good idea. I think it would be great to see a little shaking or jarring going on when you take hits. It should probably also cause a reduction in energy. Good idea.
I can think of only three cases when something would happen to your vision: +/-Gs
If an explosive cannon shell goes off in the cockpit or possibly even behind the pilot armor, there could be such a change in air pressure in the cockpit it could cause blinking and temporary blurred vision at the least and shrapnel (even if it's only light particle debris) dispersal in a slightly more likely scenario.
Any serious jolt or unexpected noise usually causes a person to wince. Close flak shells should jolt your aircraft enough to cause your entire aircraft to be thrown a short distance and toss the pilot around as well.
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If it were a realistic view system, every time you rolled suddenly or snap rolled your entire virtual body would be slammed to the side. The same would happen every time you kicked your rudder hard.
Based on my experience that would not be realistic.
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Second only in coordinated flight are the G forces always in the vertical. Air combat is nearly impossible to maintain coordinated. As a matter of fact most of us use so much rudder in turn fights the pilots body would be glued to the side of his aircraft if it were real.
Could you elaborate on that a little more please. I don't know of any aircraft that is capable of pulling extreme Gs just with the use of the rudder.
If you ever get a chance to talk to any WWII pilots ask them how they used their rudder in combat. Sure some maneuvers require for your aircraft to be uncoordinated but most of the time you want to use enough rudder (not full rudder, but just enough for what ever you are doing). The reason most people in AH don't use rudder is because we don't have too many people receiving proper instructions on how to fly.
If it were a realistic view system, every time you rolled suddenly or snap rolled your entire virtual body would be slammed to the side. The same would happen every time you kicked your rudder hard.
I'm going to have to disagree on that. Sometimes when your uncoordinated you do feel those forces pulling you to the side, but an aircraft is not a race car, it is simply incapable of generating such high side Gs to slam you into the wall.
If an explosive cannon shell goes off in the cockpit or possibly even behind the pilot armor, there could be such a change in air pressure in the cockpit it could cause blinking and temporary blurred vision at the least and shrapnel (even if it's only light particle debris) dispersal in a slightly more likely scenario.
Any serious jolt or unexpected noise usually causes a person to wince. Close flak shells should jolt your aircraft enough to cause your entire aircraft to be thrown a short distance and toss the pilot around as well.
I'm not really familiar with how flak bursts effect air pressure, I mean I know the general idea but I don't know how significant that change in pressure would be. Would you know of any numbers to help us discuss whether or not the effect is significant enough to add it to AH?
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Let's make something clear right off the bat. A lot of factors will determine how much force a pilot will experience.
An aircraft's roll response and rudder authority play a large part. If an aircraft has excellent roll rate and response, then even a small amount of control movement might seem like you are yanking the stick. And the faster your aircraft is moving when this happens the more the response is to your controls. The same is true of the rudder. If it has a large surface, it will produce better response.
The pilots relation to the CG will have some effect as well.
You cannot compare a 190 to a Mustang. They will not throw a pilot around with the same force even if they do the same maneuver at the same speed. It will have similar results, but different Gs.
Based on my experience that would not be realistic.
What is your experience?
A snap roll is a violent maneuver and it can throw you around like a rag doll if you are not wearing a shoulder harness or your cockpit isn't skin tight. A normal roll, if done sharply will also throw you against the side of the aircraft but the intensity of force would depend on the roll response of the aircraft at any given speed. Neither are life threatening jolts, but strong enough I doubt there's a man alive that can sit up straight and keep his head or body still.
Shoulder harnesses weren't in all aircraft in ww2 so many did not have that additional stabilization and not all cockpits were as small as a 109 or Spitfire.
Could you elaborate on that a little more please. I don't know of any aircraft that is capable of pulling extreme Gs just with the use of the rudder.
I didnt say anything about pulling Gs with just the use of a rudder. Using the rudder doesn't increase or decrease the amount of Gs an aircraft pulls (unless you factor in drag which isn't relevant here.)
Using a rudder changes the direction of force. If a pilot is accelerating forward the he experiences force from front to back until acceleration stops. If he pulls back on the stick the force goes from top down, relatively. If he kicks the rudder, it's from side to side, relatively.
Obviously the vertical Gs have the ability to reach dangerous extremes. My guess is, any rudder use or spins that result in horizontal Gs would likely be less than 3 Gs. A jolt from a flak burst might exceed that if close enough.
If you are in an aircraft that is doing 300 mph and you kick the rudder while holding the wings level, it would be like a car making a 300 mph turn on a flat surface. NOT the same number of Gs, but a significant number.
In AH we do these things all the time. We use extreme amounts of rudder in tight turning, high G, 1v1s as well as other situations, hence my statement "...if it were real..." We would be kicking full rudder at anywhere from 130 to 200 mph maybe more and it's going to throw you around a bit.
Those types of fights were "fights of a lifetime" to the majority of ww2 pilots and relatively rare. But it did happen and they were violent, not comfortable, coordinated joy fights.
And none of this even takes into consideration the turbulence you would encounter while flying in the wake of an enemy aircraft and the bouncing around that can make it hard to keep your feet on the pedals without locking your body up and draining what little energy you have left.
If you ever get a chance to talk to any WWII pilots ask them how they used their rudder in combat. Sure some maneuvers require for your aircraft to be uncoordinated but most of the time you want to use enough rudder (not full rudder, but just enough for what ever you are doing). The reason most people in AH don't use rudder is because we don't have too many people receiving proper instructions on how to fly.
Using rudder at all is a mostly instinctive act unless you are constantly looking at your turn and slip indicator. NO ONE does this. And several factors can throw the coordination of an aircraft off. Wind, improper trim, drag, or just bad coordination.
I think it is quite rare that anyone is so well coordinated that they can keep that ball in the tracks all of the time even if they are looking at the indicator. And in a dogfight, no fighter pilot is going to be looking at his turn and slip.
But the point was, in a hard, violent dogfight like we experience on a regular basis, you would not be in coordinated flight most of the time. And if any pilot in ww2 got into fights like ours, with lap belts but no shoulder harness and a nice roomy cockpit of a Jug or Mustang his head and body would be all over the place.
Sometimes when your uncoordinated you do feel those forces pulling you to the side, but an aircraft is not a race car, it is simply incapable of generating such high side Gs to slam you into the wall.
I think you are way overestimating the amount of force it takes to throw you side to side. We are talking 1 to 3 Gs here. It is not a break your shoulder or crack your skull slam, but it is violent, sudden and partly uncontrollable.
An experience aerobatic pilot will anticipate the forces on his body and counter them with his muscles, but no aerobatic pilot in the world will ever achieve the level of stability our cartoon pilots have without the help of restraints that were not available in WW2.
And the majority of pilots in ww2 were not "professional" aerobatic pilots. Most were green and had barely enough hours to make them proficient pilots. They likely wouldn't anticipate much of anything that happened to them in combat.
I'm not really familiar with how flak bursts effect air pressure, I mean I know the general idea but I don't know how significant that change in pressure would be. Would you know of any numbers to help us discuss whether or not the effect is significant enough to add it to AH?
Tell your kid to unexpectedly set off a couple of M80s in the floor of your car while you are driving with the window rolled up. Then tell me you dont cringe, blink, or lose vision and concentration for a split second.
It's not all about the pressure. The shock and violence plays just as much a roll.
That acute awareness everyone was talking about earlier in this post comes from knowing you are in a dangerous situation. It does not come from, nor is it constant if an explosive device goes off in your vehicle. That kind of thing causes disorientation which most of the time results in distorted vision and momentary confusion and it is well documented.
In case no one else has mentioned it, the OP probably got his idea from other flight sims. IL-2 does model the head shake much more than AH does but still not realistically. And I think Warbirds models some disorientation. Just FYI
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I think that when you get shot down or bail from the plane, the game should quote Churchill at you.
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few."
“If you are going through hell, keep going.”
"Don't speak to me of naval tradition! It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the lash!"
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What is your experience?
3400 hours total, acro in Cap 10, T-6 and P-51. Even as a passneger a snap roll in the CAP 10 didn't bang me around as you describe it. Sure, it moves you around...that's basic physics....but nothing close to being "a rag doll".
What is your flight experience?
I think it is quite rare that anyone is so well coordinated that they can keep that ball in the tracks all of the time even if they are looking at the indicator. And in a dogfight, no fighter pilot is going to be looking at his turn and slip.
It is rare that a proficient pilot DOESN'T keep the ball in the center...some acro excluded of course.
But the point was, in a hard, violent dogfight like we experience on a regular basis, you would not be in coordinated flight most of the time.
Why not? With the exception of skids to spoil an attackers gun solution there is no reason not to be coordinated in your flight. Coordinated means less drag, more speed -- those are good things.
I think you are way overestimating the amount of force it takes to throw you side to side.
I think you are blowing out of proportion the effect it has on the pilot.
no pilot in the world will ever achieve the level of stability our cartoon pilots have
I agree 100%
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What is your flight experience?
Certainly no where near what yours is. So how many hours of that is actually aerobatic?
3400 hours total, acro in Cap 10, T-6 and P-51. Even as a passneger a snap roll in the CAP 10 didn't bang me around as you describe it. Sure, it moves you around...that's basic physics....but nothing close to being "a rag doll".
Not familiar with the aircraft, did it have shoulder harnesses? I dont think a CAP and a full size fighter is really a good comparison either. Ever done a snap roll with a lap belt only?
Was that you in the Texan in the link you posted? Did you notice how tight the cockpit was in addition to the shoulder harnesses? Did you notice how leisurely the flight was? Was someone shooting at you when you were doing those acros?
It is rare that a proficient pilot DOESN'T keep the ball in the center...some acro excluded of course.
acro is the whole point of our discussion. We aren't talking about leisure or professional flying here.
Why not? With the exception of skids to spoil an attackers gun solution there is no reason not to be coordinated in your flight. Coordinated means less drag, more speed -- those are good things.
In most of the duels Ive been in that lasted more than a minute, I spend a considerable portion of that fight in a skid as part of a rolling scissors as do most of the opponents I flew against. In the MA I used them extensively as well, either for position or for breaking. Granted not everyone flys the same, but I am not alone by a long shot. Only someone who BnZs almost exclusively could possibly "fight coordinated" all the time.
So again, the comment "if it were real" was meant to take the way many players of AH fight, and suppose it was a real fight. If you were flying a mustang in a skid at 140 to 200 mph with only a lap belt to keep you steady, you would be glued to the side of the plane. Even if you had the strength to resist being thrown to the side going into the skid, (not likely) how long do you think you could hold it?
I think you are blowing out of proportion the effect it has on the pilot.
And you are on to something there. Rag doll is a bit of an exaggeration, and slammed is a bit excessive. But neither is completely inaccurate.
I may not have the flight time you have, but I've done enough in my life to know what the human body can take, what it can do, and how easily a machine can toss a man around. I've also read enough fighter pilot bios to know that what I have said is accurate.
I can see it now, you sitting straight up in a nice roomy cockpit, with no harness, just before going into a skid, then waaammo, you looked like a rag doll getting slammed into the wall to me. :D
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Not presenting this as my evidence, just some hints from old quotes.
Combat flying is based on the slashing attack and rough maneuvering. In combat flying, fancy precision aerobatic work is really not of much use. Instead, it is the rough maneuver which succeeds. — Colonel Erich 'Bubi' Hartmann, GAF, aka Karaya One, worlds leading ace, with 352 victories in W.W.II.Jagdgeschwader 52
Good flying never killed [an enemy] yet. — Major Edward 'Mick' Mannock, RAF, ranking British Empire fighter ace of W.W. I. 61 victories.
The most important thing in fighting was shooting, next the various tactics in coming into a fight and last of all flying ability itself.— Lt. Colonel W. A. 'Billy' Bishop, RAF
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I want to hear and feel my pilot fill his drawers when he gets in a situation where his death is inevitable. I want virtual realism dammit!
:rofl :rofl :rofl :aok
:cheers: Oz
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I can't even get an aircraft to spin here.
The closest I have come is a snap half roll.
I don't think we can do snap rolls in aces high.
I have plenty of aerobatics time which seems to have been wasted since I do not fly for a living at this time.
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you might have the stall limiter check on Icepac, I can get any of the AH planes to spin easily including the B29.
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Modelled perfectly - I have nerves of steel, so why shouldn't my cartoon pilot?
Agreed, my pilot is fine too. If you charge a panther with an M8, and win, nothing else is gonna phase you.